Help me with flotation decisions

[Mickdougal]

In September 2012 I bought my first boat. It is a 1979 Invader, 20', with good finish, fair upholstery, and the usual weathering for a 30+ year boat. I am learning. Boy, am I learning!

I got it in the water yesterday after completely rebuilding trailer brakes, and doing all the service I could over the winter. As I returned to the dock from parking the tow vehicle, I noticed a 'slight' but noticeable (10 degree?) starboard list. Hmmm.

Well, we got it out in the water and once we found the problem with the secondaries not closing all the way (no wonder it was hard to start!) and a few other punch list items it turned out to be a really nice handling boat. Really fast (to me!) and smooth in the choppy waters. I could already hear the grandkids screaming "Faster, Grandpa!" as they skied and boarded behind the boat in my mind.

But for that starboard list. Hmmm.

So I joined this forum and now I see why the boat was for sale so cheap. Invaders were built with cost effective (Read: CHEAP) foam that was open cell, not closed cell.

Now the question nags. To continue or to start over. On a retiree's budget starting over is not an option. Repairing the sodden foam will be time consuming and possibly expensive. But the sea water that got into my veins in my days on Diesel Subs has evidently not gone away and I think I'm hooked. Think? I know I'm hooked.

So my question to the forum is what is the best foam to replace the garbage foam, and should I use pressure treated lumber for stringers and decking? Will I spend this entire boating season ripping up and rebuilding? Maybe I should have bought that cheap little tiller boat my wife suggested... Maybe I still can...

Thanks, all, for listening. I hope to have some good times here.

 

[QC]

Re: Help me with flotation decisions

Hello Mick. I moved this post to a new thread. Then we won't be confused with who's who in the zoo . . . Welcome aboard!!

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: Help me with flotation decisions

If the transom is Not show signs of weakness and you there are no other signs of problems with the boat, then you could prolly use her for this season and begin the restoration in the fall. Replacing the deck, stringers and transom for a 1st time novice can be quite a task. Since you are retired and could spend quite a bit of time on the project you could get it done quicker than most. A good quess-ti-mate would be approx 60-100 man hours and $750 - $1,500 in materials. It all depends on what all you run into when you start tearing into her. The deck will need to be removed and replaced. If it's carpeted you might be able to salvage the carpet and reinstall it. If the stringers have not been compromised and the transom is sound then replaceing the foam is really not that bad. Removing it...well that's tedious and not much fun but can be done with a small shovel etc... Typically the stringers will be bad and need to be replaced. Transoms.... just depends on how she's been maintained over the years. You won't know till you dig into it. We'll be here to help if you decide to do it. The first link in my signature below has drawings and info on how to do some of it. this link has pics and vids on everything!!!!

http://forums.iboats.com/boat-resto...-engine-pics-galore-update-11-8-a-358277.html

 

[jigngrub]

Re: Help me with flotation decisions

I see several positives for this restoration:

1. Sea water in veins

2. A good motor that goes fast

3. Grandpa, grand kids and family fun (most important)

Yes it will take time to restore/fix this boat, but what else are you going to do?

It'll take some money too, but not nearly as much as a new boat would... and your boat will be nearly new and better built than when it was new for a fraction of the cost of a new boat.

The actual replacement foam will cost you less than $200 shipping included, the lumber will probably be less than $200 as well. The expensive stuff will be the fiberglass resin and mat/cloth... but we're still talking about a like new/better than new boat for a fraction of the cost of a new one.

If you don't mind getting dirty/itchy, some hard work, and enjoy working with your hands this project will be well worth it to you... and you may even become addicted to restoring boats as some of us here have.

I say go for it! All the information you need is right here on this site plus free consultation and technical help be real people like yourself.

Take a look around the resto forum here and view the other project boats both in progress and finished to see if you find it interesting enough to dig into something like this. If you do decide to go forth it'll certainly keep you off the streets and out of the pool halls for a while.

btw... did I mention you'll get a like new boat for a small fraction of the cost of a new one?

 

[gm280]

Re: Help me with flotation decisions

I second jigngrub's entire post...

 

[GT1000000]

Re: Help me with flotation decisions

Yes Sir, I concur with all of the above...and would also like to welcome you aboard and wish you the best of luck...
I will gladly come along for the ride and throw my 2? into the ring whenever I can...
My first suggestion is to get your self a Free Photobucket, or similar, account and load pictures of your craft there...then you can post them here for all of us picture hungry guys...the reason for this is twofold, it helps us see what you see and be better able to give you ideas on how to proceed, and it will also document any repairs for any and all to follow as reference or to learn from...
Best regards,
GT1M

 

[Mickdougal]

Re: Help me with flotation decisions

Hello, men. Mick reporting back.
I started removing nasty decking and some foam. There was water standing on top of the foam and it had rotted the decking. No brainer there. I am sure that water got in around the access hatch for the fuel tank. Dumb, dumb, DUMB!
The foam broke out in nice, dry chunks- no saturation. That's nice. I haven't pulled out enough to see the stringers but I fear the worst.
The real head scratcher is why on earth do have a list? With two men totaling over 450 lbs. standing on the port side it barely leveled the boat. I can't see where there's enough room for 450-500 lbs. of water on the starboard side.
I'll try to post a photo or two but no promises. Photo bucket from the iTunes App Store had lousy reviews so I going to have to try other means.
Any ideas from the goat locker?
Thanks. I appreciate the encouragement.

 

[jigngrub]

Re: Help me with flotation decisions

Keep looking for list answers while doing your demo... saturated foam on starboard side and dry on port?... hull breach on starboard side taking on water?

 

[zool]

Re: Help me with flotation decisions

Hey Mick,

Assuming you have an I/O setup, and assuming it sits level at rest, and lists on plane, it could be a prop torque issue and not water weight.

The issue can come fom just a wrong prop, to underlying structural damage (stringers, transom, yada yada).

If the transom is flexing, it can have that effect too. The foam is incidental.

If the boat is deemed safe, you can correct it with trim tabs.....if rotten, well, better safe than sorry....

Anything can be fixed tho

 

[Mickdougal]

Re: Help me with flotation decisions

Sorry, but it seems like one can overlook the basic details all too easily. I should have mentioned that the boat has this starboard list at rest.
This is friend Joe standing on the port side, counteracting the list, and it is still evident. I am supposing that we are dealing with structural damage and further exploratory surgery is warranted.
Friscoboater's legendary series on the Sea Ray will probably be the guide for this. I will try to post photos so anyone who cares can keep up with progress.
What I've learned:
1. There is plenty of crap on Craigslist, and
2. NEVER, NEVER buy an old boat without checking the structural timbers.
3. There's a sucker born every minute. Don't be one.
Thanks again, all.

 

[Mickdougal]

Re: Help me with flotation decisions

Hey, guys. I took a new tack on the Invader project. Rather than use up the entire boating season my wonderful wife encouraged me to start looking for another (non-project) boat. Then while browsing Craigslist she found this gorgeous 1973 Glastron 17 foot with a 65 HP Johnson outboard. It had been on the list since Wednesday and that was Friday. I made the call and we went down and bought it on Monday, Memorial day.
Now the Invader can take as much time as we need to do it right. Eventually I will need to sell it to recoup the Glastron investment, and to reclaim some parking. Let me post a couple of pix for you. I can't believe the condition it's in for being 40 years old. And yes, it runs. And NO, there are NO soft spots in the decking.



Now I have several new learning curves (three-cylinder outboards, Glastron boats, etc) and I promise to post them in a new thread. See you there! Thanks, and I won't forget to post Invader pictures as I go. Praying that the stringers are still OK.

Thanks,

Mickdougal