I can't believe this happened

[fishfeatures]

Hi,

Johnson 60 hp BJ60ELESM

I unseized this engine for a mate and when it was running as it should be, I offered him my 2000 Mariner 30 for his 60 as he didn't need that much power where as I was looking to upgrade...

It was a good deal until now.... approx 20 hrs on the engine since I did the work and this evening about 1/2 mile from the dock I heard a rattle , had a look and the tray seemed to be rattling so I assumed a bolt holding it on came loose, as I had a few bolts need retightening after the initial work due to the motor shaking.
Docked the boat , reversed the trailer and then got back in started the engine to drive it on when after 10 secs it stopped. Paddled up to the trailer and recovered the boat.

At home about 10 mins after this, I removed the cowling , first thing I noticed was the heat from the motor. Removed the plugs and the botttom one was loose and the tip bent....

I assume I have done damage but how???

New impeller, new t-stat, etc.

I'm not brave enough to remove the head yet adn won't be for a day or two as this has really knocked me for 6....Can't afford to get it done professionally so it'll have to be me..

Can someone suggest what may have happened, why, and am I unlucky or was it my doing...

Really down now looks like my summer is bust or at best shorten by a few weeks...:facepalm:

 

[archcycle]

Re: I can't believe this happened

That head is going to have to come off so you can assess whether there's damage to the piston. Post pics of the bent sparkplug. It is possible that you just have a serious pre-ignition problem (early explosion) that hasn't damaged anything badly yet which would mostly likely be solved with some adjustments.

The head really isn't a big deal to remove, it's just some bolts. It's nothing like the heads in a car that are full of valves and possibly your cams etc. It's just a metal cap for the combustion chamber on these things. Putting it back on just involves buying a torque wrench and a new head gasket.

BEFORE you do take it off do a compression check.

It was running when you got home so don't panic until you have seen something broken.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: I can't believe this happened

It wasn't running when i got it home , the motor was still hotter than hell even then from being out in the river.Can'do a compession test either the flywheel is jammed up. I know the head will have to come off but it's what I'll find when I do it that worries me....

 

[Chinewalker]

Re: I can't believe this happened

You unseized the motor? Why was it stuck? My bet is something that was rusted/corroded when it was seized has come unglued... This is why I always recommend a complete tear down on a seized motor... All it takes is one crusty bearing to take down the entire motor.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: I can't believe this happened

it was lying up for a couple of years as he was away with work, and I pretty much did what it says in the "awakeing a sleeping giant" sticky.

I'll tear her down in the next few days and hopefully the great guys here can guide me along. I'd like to buy another motor but over here good second hand ones are hard to come by and when you do find one they are priced sooo high. It'll actually be cheaper for me to rebuild cause anything around my price range is either a load of crap resprayed or just crap and I ain't buying anyone elses troubles. At least this way I know I have the motor that suits my boat and I'll know it's a good 'un....

very despairingly,

K.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

well I opened her up and this is what greeted me (am a noob at posting pics hope it works)




here is what was gathered in the bottom of the cyclinder, can someone tell me what it is..rings??





other 2 cylinders seem to be ok







I was running a seafoam type cleaner along with the fuel to try and claer the carbon build up on the top of the cylinders and it is working but should i have cleared it off altogether and if so how?

this is the cyclinder head it is slightly dented in palces so I guess that this will have to be planed down....


So the flywheel still wont move, but i am taking the head to my uncles garage tomorrow where he'll remove the flywheel and i'll then split the head. I should then be able to get a better picture of how bad the walls are.

# 1 and #2 seem ok will i have to replace these pistons or just #3??
if so will i get all 3 cyl bored or just #3

I'm a bit daunted about doing this but hopefully with you guys and your years of experience may just be able to help me out..
We don't have "boat shops" over here so all info regarding sizes and procedures must be in good old plain english as most people doing the work won't have a clue about outboards unfortunately.


please go easy with the bad news as I've had enough of it already for one week.

 

[nwcove]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

that looks like a whole lotta piston in your hand! but its not a lost cause. take it apart, make sure the block isnt cracked, and do a rebuild. you will have a" like" new motor.

 

[rtek816]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

I have a 140 V4 that had the same problem on one cylinder (except for locking up).Looks like the same failure. Either abuse or lots of hours. I didn't have that many chunks of aluminum to salvage. You will require a complete rebuild. The ring caught on the exhaust port and broke the top of the piston (and itself). The head needs to be replaced as it most likely has a small piece of STEEL ring imbedded in it which will act like a glow plug on a cox airplane engine and cause preignition, letting you enjoy the fun ahead again. Strip her down and get a bore gauge or a machine shop to measure the bores against spec. If their even close to outside, bore them all. I wouldn't order any parts until it was down to a skeleton and I knew what parts needed to be replaced. Add the costs and make a decision. Can't beat the amount of knowledge on this board that can take a semi mechanical guy through a total rebuild. You'll find a ton of support if you can phrase your questions well and keep adding pics. Someone will chime in. You'll be amazed at how much you will learn. Good Luck.

P.S. what's the year? If you do a first class rebuild (and you should) new carb kits, pistons, rings, bearings, gasket kit, 3-hole bore, and assorted sundries would be around $1,000.00 USD in Michigan, USA. Oh and pluss a used head (strongly suggest)

 

[rtek816]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Sorry...plus is plus. Must have had something else on my mind. I am a grammer snob.

 

[nwcove]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

exactly what rtek said......it sounds like alot of work/money......but the end result is a motor that should last for years.

 

[boobie]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

If you're going to do this work yourself get an OEM factory service manual. Don't mess with Seloc or Clymer.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Either abuse or lots of hours.

Define abuse for me ... I have the engine on a 14ft ski boat so it's goes 1/2 - WOT a lot but surely that isn't abuse? as for hours the engine is 1990 and I can't honestly say how many PO's there have been or what hrs are on the motor so this may be a factor.

can someone explain to me why rebore all 3 cylinders , is it because the engine will act differently with just #3 done. I don't mind doing all 3 cyl I just want to know why if the other two are in good nick.

 

[mark1961]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

can someone explain to me why rebore all 3 cylinders , is it because the engine will act differently with just #3 done. I don't mind doing all 3 cyl I just want to know why if the other two are in good nick.

Rebore the lot imo, you appear to have some deep scoring on the bore in the first pic of the supposed good cylinders.....

 

[rtek816]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Abuse: Start engine and immediately go WOT. WOT to idle and shut engine off.

I would guess this engine has a lot of hours on it. When you measure the cylinders (even the ones that look good) I'll bet they are tapered out of spec. Won't know for sure until you get in there and check.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Always let it idle for 5-10 mins while a park the trailer and chat and vice versa on the way back so prob hrs on it but can't say about po use but it's off tomorrow to be redone should have it on monday. I'll get all 3 done seeing as i have it stripped down it's prob best to so.

 

[nwcove]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

good call fish, do all three and you're gunna have equal compression across them. you are going to rebuild the bottom end also?

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

I replaced the water pump and housing changed lower end oil and unfortunately had to change prop too only 2months ago.Motor was fine till now so am leaving lower unit unless something really needs doing there also

 

[nwcove]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

sorry fish, i should have been more specific when i said "bottom end". i was referring to crank bearings/seals....rod bearings/bushings etc.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

oh well all that will be done , once the crank bears herself for inspection anything to be changed will be

will update as we go along. thanks ( says he with a tone of nervousness in his voice)

 

[clanton]

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

Re: I can't believe this happened (photos attached)

As you are doing the rebuild, search this forum for the service bulletins. Waterpump kit has been changed,plus contains a service bulletin fro relocating the tattle tale hose to top of block.
Thermostat and seal changed,
Carbuator jets increased in size and timing retarded,
Temp sensor changed.

After breakin, engine should be propped to turn 6000 rpms.