Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

[mssmit19]

I have a 1960 75HP Johnson, with a magneto style ignition. Model # V4SL-12. I have replaced the points, condenser, spark plugs, and ignition coil, and still no spark. I have also purchased a repair manual for additional help, and have followed each procedure to test for a spark = nothing. Next I tested the rotor to see if it was grounding out on the shaft, but it was ok.

I attempted to isolate the no spark problem by checking for voltage at the coil. I disconnected the main cable coming into the engine, disconnected the kill switch and the battery was not connected. I also removed the rotor and cap, leaving the coil installed, and hooked up a voltage meter and pulled the rope start. The voltage meter did not move. Any advice to help solve this problem would be appreciated.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

was it a put-together set of coils, if so make sure the pin in the center of the coil is in the center of the wire. also i cut back insulation on the plug end and wrap it around the connector before forcing the boot on.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

If you remove the timing belt and black killer wire and spin the rotor, the coil should produce spark. The magnets in the distrbutor housing spin past the coil to produce the voltage. If you remove the point wire, you may use a ohmmeter or test lamp to set the points accurately.

OK, That motor has two sets of points. I presume you replaced both sets and set each to the correct gap, using each's timing mark on the distributor pully and pully base. The wire under the pulley that connects them together can easily break or ground out, killing the spark to all.

No battery voltage is used in the ignition system. The coil has a brass pin that touches the spring on the distributor cap. The carbon electrode touches the rotor to allow the spark to get to the cap. Pull the cap and see if you have spark on the coil's pin. One of the coils wires must have a good ground, and the other must connect thru the distributor's body to the external screw that connects to the point wire. If the coil wire grounds to the dist. body, you will not have spark.


Good luck troubleshooting, and post back. BTW it is a wierd, but reliable ignition system.....

 

[mssmit19]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

Ignition Problem = No Spark

Thanks for the responses.

After reading the replies I checked to see if it was grounding out on the brass screw that goes through the distributor cap, but it was fine. The following is the procedure that I used to test it. I disconnected everything including the points, condenser, rotor and plug wires. I isolated the system to check for a spark from the coil. The only components in the test were the rope start to turn the shaft which turns the magnetos by the coil. The ignition coil was in place with one end grounded, and on the hot end I removed the brass screw and let the hot end hang below the coil. I made sure that it was far enough away from the distributor housing that it would not ground out. I placed an alligator clip on the hot end of the coil wire and held the opposite end of the alligator wire about 1/8? of an inch away from the engine block (ground). I still did not have a spark. I tested several different ground positions and no spark resulted.

Could there be something wrong with the permanent magnets in the housing?

There seems to be nothing wrong with the shaft that turns the magnets, and everything is clean.

Do I need to dissemble the housing and look for the problem there?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thank You

 

[F_R]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

If I read that long explanation correctly, you got it all wrong. You will not get a spark off the "hot" wire, which I assume you mean to be the wire that connects to the through-screw. Nor will you get a spark off the coil button with that wire disconnected.

Connect everything back up, making sure you have good clean connections to the screw and no shorts to ground. By connect everything, I mean including the points wire, but not the kill wire. Now hold a screwdriver against the magneto housing and with the tip 1/4" away from the coil's button contact. Rotate the pulley and you should have spark to the screwdriver. Also listen for sparking that might be going on up inside, around the coil someplace, which would indicate a bad coil.

If you don't get any sparks off the button, it is back to square one. Something wrong with the points, connections, coil, or whatever.

If you do get spark off the button, but none off the wires, there is something wrong with the distributor cap, rotor, or plug wires. Most likely the rotor.

Nothing goes wrong with the magnets unless it went through a major fire or demagnetizer machine. However, rust between the pole pieces in the housing and the laminated core of the coil will affect it.

 

[mssmit19]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

Thank you FR I will give it a try.

 

[mssmit19]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

Finally have a spark!!! The problem was that the brass post going through the distributor housing was shorting out on the housing as it went through the hole. Since it was such a small voltage the typical signs of a short was not there. I made a rubber insulator to insert in the hole and reconnected everything, and now have a great spark coming off of the coil button.

However, I still do not have a spark on the plugs. I checked for continuity in the rotor, distributor cap and plug wires, everything is fine. The rotor and cap look to be in good condition, but appears to be what is wrong now.

Can anyone give me a source to order a new rotor and/or dist.cap for a 1960 75 HP Johnson, model V4SL-12

 

[F_R]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

Is the carbon brush in the distributor cap? (The one that picks up the voltage from the center of the rotor) If yes, and you have spark at the coil but not at the wires there are only 3 possibilities:
1. The rotor is arcing through (common)
2. The cap is cracked or carbon tracked
3. The wires are open, no continuity.
4. Well, four possibles. Car wires? It needs to have copper core "wire" wires.

Betcha it's the rotor.

The rotor is part number 580260 and is available from any Johnson or Evinrude dealer $45. I think the cap is no longer available and you wouldn't want to pay for it if it was.

 

[mssmit19]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

Yes, there is a carbon brush (looks like a small cylinder) in the distributor cap, attached with a small spring. The cap and the rotor both look to be in good shape, what are some signs of #2 carbon tracked? The plug wires are copper and have continuity. There are no visible signs of the rotor or the cap being cracked.

Thanks for your help

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

I had a cracked rotor on my '58 Fat-Fifty, and it would work great until it heated up, and then I had a no-spark conditon. Was a real Bit#* to find. Luckily in those days (mid 90s) the rotors were only $7.

You might look up a Sierra Tune up kit and see if the rotor comes as part of it. it may save you a few $$.

 

[mssmit19]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

I have a rotor on the way $44. I hope this will solve the problem, I have also tracked down a dist cap if it comes to that.

 

[mssmit19]

Re: Ignition Problem- No Spark(Updated)

Finally I have a spark at the plugs. I installed the new rotor and also discovered that the wiring harness from the electric start box to the engine was bad. Due to the age of the harness the insulation was brittle and had some cracks, which caused everything to ground out to each other. After some repairs it is as good as new.

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