Ignition, starter or alternator?

[ajinid]

Boat just died on the lake in the middle of tubing. When I tried to start up again, the starter stayed engaged and the engine sounded like it was choking, I had to disconnect the battery to stop the starter. After repeating this one time, the third try resulted in an inability to start the boat, no turn over, no click. Checked the battery and its still good (1 yr old optima) stilll good, all other elctronics work OK, (radio, trim). The starter was replaced 2yrs ago.

Any ideas what would cause boat to die then have trouble starting?? alternator resistor? starter solenoid?

5.8FLPHUE

 

[Reel-hip]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

My guess is the starter. Can you jump (hot wire) the starter? if it stays engaged then you know it is not the ignition.

 

[Maclin]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

Diagnosis depends quite a bit on what model of engine you have.

 

[Don S]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

Any ideas what would cause boat to die then have trouble starting?? alternator resistor? starter solenoid?

Lots of things cause engines to die.
Lots of things can cause the starter not to turn the engine. and a lot of things can cause the starter to not stop turning.
But the alternator resistor has nothing to do with any of it.

Perhaps we should start off with some basics. Some of those minor details, like what engine, what model, what year.

 

[ajinid]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

I have a 1996 Glastron GS 205 with a Ford 351W and Volvo Penta duoprop outdrive. -AJ

 

[Don S]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

Carbed, EFI? Need a full model number or a Volvo engine serial number.

 

[ajinid]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

5.8FLPHUE Carbed engine

 

[Don S]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

Did it overheat? Was you pulling someone and it died, or did you bring it back to idle and it died? Makes a big difference.
Lot of questions that have more than one answer. So lets take them one at a time.

Why won't it crank over.
Here is a thread that should help you answer that question http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=167035

Why wouldn't it stop cranking over.
Could be the switch, slave solenoid, starter solenoid, or even the starter itself from rust on the shaft. I would bet that when you find why it no longer cranks over that that is probably why it wouldn't stop.

Why did it die?
Do you have spark? Do you have fuel? One is probably missing.

 

[dennis461]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

I'd look at the ignition switch first.
Why?

Easy to get to.
Low cost to repair.
Could explain both cutting out at speed (start alone can't do that) and no start condition if the switch internals fell apart due to corrosion.
Maybe all three wires are touching now (B+, starter relay, ignition +)

 

[Don S]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

I'd look at the ignition switch first.
Why?

Easy to get to.
Low cost to repair.
Could explain both cutting out at speed (start alone can't do that) and no start condition if the switch internals fell apart due to corrosion.
Maybe all three wires are touching now (B+, starter relay, ignition +)

What the heck does cost of repair have to do with it? You should be troubleshooting with a meter and/or test light to find what the problem is. Not pick a cheap, easy to get at part and replace it.

Did you even look at that link I posted? If you did, did you understand any of it?

If you are expecting someone to come on and say go push this EZ button and it will work fine, forget it.

 

[ajinid]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

So I looked at Don's great engine starting guide. I used a light test as described and found:

Key in off position:
B Terminal -no light
S Terminal -lights up
I Terminal - lights up

Key in run position: Only the S Terminal Lights up

Key in start Position: no lights on S or I terminals, boat starts up when touching the B term.

I assume this all means I need a new ignition switch. Would this also be the cause of the boat just quitting in the middle of accelerating while pulling a tube?

 

[ajinid]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

Had a little trouble figuring out a replacement part. Will a generic 3 position switch work such as this?

http://www.iboats.com/Replacement-I...9375220--session_id.852457460--view_id.191201

 

[dennis461]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

...What the heck does cost of repair have to do with it? ....it.

Just trying to help the guy out.
Should he try replacing the most expensive part first?

I've seen too many posters go straight to replacing a starter or replacing points ignition with electronic.

Signing off of the thread now...

 

[Don S]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

Key in off position:
B Terminal -no light
S Terminal -lights up
I Terminal - lights up

I think you have the wiring all wrong on the switch. B should be the red or red purple wire and have power rather the key is on or off.
The S terminal should be the yellow/red stripe wire for cranking the starter.
The I terminal is for the ignition and should have the purple wire/s on it.

Here is what you should have

Key off B light, S & I no light.
Key in run position, B light, I light, S no light
Key in crank position light on all terminals.

Not sure how it could get messed up like that out on the water.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

Should he try replacing the most expensive part first?

Don's point is that you don't diagnose by installing parts.

 

[ajinid]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

Don, here are some pictures of the wiring on the switch. I've never done anything to the wiring, it's been like this since I've had the boat 3 years. It appears to be correct. What else could be causing the odd results? -AJ



Key in off position:
B Terminal -no light
S Terminal -lights up
I Terminal - lights up

Key in run position: Only the S Terminal Lights up

Key in start Position: no lights on S or I terminals, boat starts up when touching the B term.

 

[Don S]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

I don't understand why you don't show power on the B terminal. Do you have a regular 12V test light and have the clip attached to ground?

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

I have this funny feeling he has the test light attached to +12V and then he is probing.

The boat starts when touching the B terminal because whatever circuit that is normally supplying power to the B terminal isn't doing it. Could be a blown fuse for the ignition circuit.

 

[Don S]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

I have this funny feeling he has the test light attached to +12V and then he is probing.

That's what I am thinking too. which means his I and S terminals are going to ground. But who knows.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Ignition, starter or alternator?

which means his I and S terminals are going to ground. But who knows.

They go to ground through the windings of the starter solenoid and through paths in the ignition circuit. Plenty of ways to get to ground to light a test light.