In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

[MRneatfreak]

I bought this 18 foot ski boat a month ago, and the previous owner had done some considerable work refurbishing the outboard and the fuel tank area. It has a 30 gallon tank in the floor, I verified the data plate on the tank. It says 1979 on it. Anyway it has all new hoses including the filler hose. It appears to not have a fuel pump. My factory service manual for the 77 Johnson 85 horse, says the fuel pickup should be no lower than 30 inches. I bet it is easily 36 inches or so. I had a hard time pumping up the system with the rubber fuel bulb like what is on a normal portable tank, gave up and used a portable for the day.

So my question is should I have to supplent the fuel tank with a 12v electric fuel pump in addition to the rubber primer? Intially I also had an atwood fuel/water setup in line after the tank and the bulb after it to the engine. Tried it both ways. But couldn't prime the system.

*edit* found another post about an electric pump on 90 merc. and decided the electric pump probably isnt the way to go. Any ideas on getting the system primed? My hose clamps were tight. Do they sell larger fuel primer bulbs?

 

[tx1961whaler]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

This is one case where I'd recommend getting a genuine Evinrude primer bulb. I have had terrible luck with some of the aftermarket ones. There's new ones on ebay right now for 20 bucks.

 

[F_R]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

I'm trying to get a picture in my head of any ski boat with the tank 36 inches below the fuel pump. Anyway, it is the level of the fuel in the tank that matters, not the end of the pick-up tube. Of course, if the tank is nearly empty, the level is down around the end of the pick-up tube.

Where is your primer bulb located? The closer to the tank you can get it, the better it will work. Also, hold it so it points up while squeezing it so gravity closes the check valves.

 

[cyclops2]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

Actually a BIG bulb with GREAT seals inside should work just as fast as the smaller bulbs. There should always be enough liquid fumes in the bulb to wet the valves to pump on the first squeeze.
F & R is right about pointing a DRY bulb up with the ....ARROW..... on the bulb pointing up. Iffy bulbs like that angle.

What can happen is for a boat to be stopped when the tank is hot at 4 PM. You might be closing the tank vent cap or the cap is a non-vented one.... with NO vent line connected to the tank. The tank cools overnight creating a POWERFULL vacuum in the tank fuel line system next morning.

NO WAY YOU CAN PUMP that fuel. I used to close the vent screw on my 6 gallon tanks to keep water out during rains.

Got me everytime with dry sparkplugs. I wore out a starter before I changed to releasing pressure or vacuum in the tanks before starting the engine.
My bulbs KEEP fuel in the line to the engine overnight. So loosening the tank screw is all that is needed to restart the engine easily. I am guessing that my lines are leak proof & no air ever gets in any part of the tank pickup tube either.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

When using a primer bulb hold it vertical rather than horizontal -- especially the cheapies. Good bulbs have good valves and seal properly in either horizontal or vertical orientation. Cheap ones seem to work best only when vertical. Once the line is primed it should work fine.

 

[MRneatfreak]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

I'm trying to get a picture in my head of any ski boat with the tank 36 inches below the fuel pump. Anyway, it is the level of the fuel in the tank that matters, not the end of the pick-up tube. Of course, if the tank is nearly empty, the level is down around the end of the pick-up tube.

Where is your primer bulb located? The closer to the tank you can get it, the better it will work. Also, hold it so it points up while squeezing it so gravity closes the check valves.

I tried locating the bulb directly after a 4 foot run of hose from the tank the hose then supplies to the water/fuel seperator, then to the outboard. I also tried with the bulb after the filter, to no avail.

My tank is vented and the pickup goes in the top. I assumed it was a solid tube to the bottom of the tank? I have gotten fuel to come out with the electric fuel pump in the yard, while I was sucking/cleaning whatever liquid was trapped in there in the beginning. I haven't tried again yet. I will get another bulb, and see what happens.

 

[MRneatfreak]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

NO WAY YOU CAN PUMP that fuel. I used to close the vent screw on my 6 gallon tanks to keep water out during rains.

Got me everytime with dry sparkplugs. I wore out a starter before I changed to releasing pressure or vacuum in the tanks before starting the engine.
My bulbs KEEP fuel in the line to the engine overnight. So loosening the tank screw is all that is needed to restart the engine easily. I am guessing that my lines are leak proof & no air ever gets in any part of the tank pickup tube either.

I know what you mean with portables and trying to pump with a closed system and high vacuum. My case is the exact opposite it won't get hard (so to speak) It was just loose, and dry, like it can't suck anything up.

I will update soon, on the latest and greatest

 

[MRneatfreak]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

When using a primer bulb hold it vertical rather than horizontal -- especially the cheapies. Good bulbs have good valves and seal properly in either horizontal or vertical orientation. Cheap ones seem to work best only when vertical. Once the line is primed it should work fine.

Didn't realize I could orientate the bulb for better action, I'll have to give that a shot.

 

[F_R]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

If the hose and filter are full of air between the primer and carburetors, AND all the carburetors are full of gas from the last time out, the primer bulb will not function because there is nowhere for the fuel to go. You just keep compressing the air in all that hose.

If you are still having trouble getting it to pump, try removing one of the drain plugs to drain its carburetor. That will make the float drop, opening the float valve, and letting the air out as you pump. Once you have it purged, you won't have to do that again unless you run the tank completely dry.

 

[cyclops2]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

MR

Take a close look at the bulb. There should be a arrowhed on it somewhere to show the fuel flow direction. Check that you are pumping in the right direction. I have had to cut the clamps off 1 of the to get the long hose going to the motor.
Tank is right under the 9.9 hp.
New rejects ARE possible.
The electric pump MAY HAVE SUCKED UP GOO into the pickup tube & the goo is stopping the hand bulb from working.

Put a pail next to the inboard tank. See if you can then pump with the bulb. Hope the bulb is not clogged. If it is .. Somehow use the electric to suck 0r push any GOO out.

If goo is mooving, your filter / seperator will be blocked.

Get lucky

 

[kmarine]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

Did you check to see if the anti siphon valve is gummed up? If so it will take forever to suck fuel through it. same with a kinked fuel vent line. Alcohol in the fuel plays havoc on older fuel system parts.

 

[cyclops2]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

Alcohol plays hell with my 74 year old parts.

 

[cyclops2]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

MR

This is a stretch. BUUT
Is there ANY possibility that someone connected the fuel bulb hose to the VENT fitting ??
Connected the VENT hose to the pickup tube ??

Maybe the boat was never run after the hoses were changed ??

 

[MRneatfreak]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

MR

This is a stretch. BUUT
Is there ANY possibility that someone connected the fuel bulb hose to the VENT fitting ??
Connected the VENT hose to the pickup tube ??

Maybe the boat was never run after the hoses were changed ??

That is a good possibility, as the hoses are all brand new from the looks of it, and at first I was confused at the routing of the hoses. The fuel line itself is blue in color and reads as ethanol resistant, and is either 5/16 or 3/8 not sure. The vent hose is about a 1/2 inch or so and is routed to the starboard side gunwale. I bought the boat with a non running 85horse johnson, all it needed was a different power pack, and different carbs

I'm 85% sure I have the correct hose selected for fuel. The vent line would never allow me to suck out 9 of the 10 gallons of gas I put in would it? Cause right after I realized nothing would come out after bulb priming it, I sucked it out with the electric pump, using the blue line. If I remember correctly all three hoses go in the top, the filler, the fuel line, and the vent line. The filler is a no brainer it is humongous.

 

[MRneatfreak]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

Did you check to see if the anti siphon valve is gummed up? If so it will take forever to suck fuel through it. same with a kinked fuel vent line. Alcohol in the fuel plays havoc on older fuel system parts.

Where is the anti-siphon valve at?

 

[MRneatfreak]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

MR

Take a close look at the bulb. There should be a arrowhed on it somewhere to show the fuel flow direction. Check that you are pumping in the right direction. I have had to cut the clamps off 1 of the to get the long hose going to the motor.
Tank is right under the 9.9 hp.
New rejects ARE possible.
The electric pump MAY HAVE SUCKED UP GOO into the pickup tube & the goo is stopping the hand bulb from working.

Put a pail next to the inboard tank. See if you can then pump with the bulb. Hope the bulb is not clogged. If it is .. Somehow use the electric to suck 0r push any GOO out.

If goo is mooving, your filter / seperator will be blocked.

Get lucky

Didn't see any goo per se, but did see about a gallon of a white creamy mixture get pumped out. I pumped with the electric pump into clear gallon jugs, after the tank was dry, I shook the jugs up, waited for them to settle, and pumped the gas off the top, then through the water fuel seperator and then back into the tank. I also stopped half way through and emptied the water/fuel filter. I'm pretty sure I have good fuel in there now. I also tilted the trailer left and right, up and down, when I was sucking from the tank, to get as much out as I could. I also added stabil, and star tron, to the fresh fuel.

 

[cyclops2]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

You might have the slowest outboard around for a while. There should be lots of water sloshing into the gasoline as soon as you start emptying the tank while running the boat.
Do not be suprised if you engine gets running problems for quite a while.

Drain the fuel / water seperator after 2 or 5 minutes of a high speed run. Get a feel for how fast you can fill it up. If it fills up. Water then fills up the carburator bowls & you are walking home.

Good luck

 

[kmarine]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

The anti siphon valve is usially at the top of the tank. It keeps fuel from filling the bilge in the event of a fuel line leak. Some fuel tanks are different. Do you know if your fuel pickup tube in your tank has a filter on it? If so it may also be cloged. You should be able to pump fuel easily with any primer bulb,

 

[MRneatfreak]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

The anti siphon valve is usially at the top of the tank. It keeps fuel from filling the bilge in the event of a fuel line leak. Some fuel tanks are different. Do you know if your fuel pickup tube in your tank has a filter on it? If so it may also be cloged. You should be able to pump fuel easily with any primer bulb,

To the best of my knowledge the tank is one piece and looks to be sealed, with the only exception being the inlet, fuel line, and the vent. Maybe I should remove the fuel gauge sender for a better inspection.

 

[kmarine]

Re: In boat fuel tank, supplement with electric pump?

That could posibly rule out a damaged fuel pickup, You will also be able to see any gunk on the bottom of the tank which could clog your pickup tube. You may want to reverse the primer bulb and backflush your pickup tube. Use a remote tank to the main fuel tank and backflush the dirt.