Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

Mikekee

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Feb 15, 2013
Messages
26
It will not start up. I read about the main jet in the carb from another posting and checked it out. It's clean and free of stuff.
I have put everything into this motor. New rings,head gasket,crank seal,new starter cord and handle,plugs,carb gaskets. I put Gasket maker non hardening on every thing, including the block. Torqued the heads down, and checked every bolt. Re built the fuel pump with the instructions and pics of every part. Installed the pump to the motor, attached a drill to the nut on the fly wheel and gave it a try, fuel is coming out of the hose. So I checked the points, 20 thou each, free from dirt and grim, works and looks great, checked both the plugs are firing.

So I have spark, fuel, compression, and not a thing is running. WTF... is going on here people??? The reeds look good too, they both lay flat on the surface. This is the last part to find to replace these. Is it worth it or not? Why is this not running? Someone help me please...:grumpy:
 

Joe Reeves

Supreme Mariner
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Feb 24, 2002
Messages
13,262
Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

Assuming the flywheel nut is torqued properly and the flywheel key is not sheared, and you have compression...... are both the points set properly? (as follows)

(Point Setting Of Magneto Models)
(J. Reeves)

Set the points as follows. Have the flywheel key aligned with the fiber rubbing portion of the ignition points. Adjust the gap so that a .020 gauge will pass thru but a .022 will not. Should there be any question of the points being dirty (touching the contact with your finger would cause them to be dirty), clean them with a small brush and acetone or lacquer thinner.

NOTE 1: Should the operating cam have a small portion on it with the word "SET" imprinted, align this portion with the fiber rubbing portion instead of the flywheel key.

NOTE 2: Should the cam have the word TOP imbossed on the top of it, that is a cam that could be installed upside down and this is simply telling you which side is up. It is not a position where one would set the points.

Check the fuel for water (it happens). The spark plugs should be either J4C or J6C plugs, gapped at .030. The J6C is slightly hotter and may provide improved performance either at idle or full throttle.

Is carburetor set properly? (As follows)

(Carburetor Adjustment - Single S/S Adjustable Needle Valve)
(J. Reeves)

Initial setting is: Slow speed = seat gently, then open 1-1/2 turns.

Start engine and set the rpms to where it just stays running. In segments of 1/8 turns, start to turn the S/S needle valve in. Wait a few seconds for the engine to respond. As you turn the valve in, the rpms will increase. Lower the rpms again to where the engine will just stay running.

Eventually you'll hit the point where the engine wants to die out or it will spit back (sounds like a mild backfire). At that point, back out the valve 1/4 turn. Within that 1/4 turn, you'll find the smoothest slow speed setting.

When you have finished the above adjustment, you will have no reason to move them again unless the carburetor fouls/gums up from sitting, in which case you would be required to remove, clean, and rebuild the carburetor anyway.

Not a good idea to be applying sealer on "all" of the gaskets as small passageways may be blocked by that substance.

(Gasket Sealers)
(Usually available at any reliable automotive parts type store)
(J. Reeves)

Do Not use any type of sealer on outboard carburetor or intake manifold gaskets as this would cause blockage of various fuel/air passageways. Also, there are new type gaskets, including head gaskets, which are used through out the engines that are coated with a substance that gives a shinny appearance to them. These gaskets are coated with a self sealer and are to be installed as is.... no sealers! Older style head and fuel related gaskets that are not coated with this substance are to be simply coated with oil.... nothing else.

All other gaskets (hopefully I've not overlooked anything above) should be coated with Gasket Sealer (the type that comes in a can that has a small brush in its screw off cap). This also pertains to some water pump installations that use a gasket between the plate and the lower unit housing.

Marprox Sealer 1000 or OMC Adhesive or Boat Armor Sealer 1000 (same substance)[See Below Note] should be used on any metal to metal (Unless GelSeal Is Called For) or metal to plastic surface (such as impeller hsg to plate, and plate to lower unit surface) to eliminate air leaks. It should also be used on the Spaghetti tubing that is used on many powerhead crankcase halves, lower unit skegs, etc. I have found that this substance works quite well on various "O" Rings such as what are found on lower unit carrier and upper driveshaft bearing housings (Note that this substance is obviously not to be used on all "O" Rings). This substance also works quite well in sealing the surfaces between the lower unit and the exhaust housing to which it attaches, eliminating the unsightly water spray between the two after completing a water pump installation.

NOTE 1: I am under the impression that Marprox Sealer 1000 and Boat Armor Sealer 1000 is no longer available.

NOTE 2: OMC Adhesive is now Bombardier 3M Product #847 .

DO NOT use any sealer on the large "O" Rings that are used on the upper and lower crankcase heads (The housing/heads that slide over the top and bottom of the crankshaft). On those "O" Rings, use only a coating of grease.

The exception of surface to surface contacts pertains to the later model matching crankcase (block) halves (which does not incorporate spaghetti tubing) which call for "Gel-Seal", or any other surface that calls for Gel-Seal. This substance seals in the absense of air, and if called for, must be used. One other form of Gel Seal that can be substituted is "Loctite #518". Nothing else that I know of will do!

I advise against using silicone or permatex on a outboard engine. It simply will not function properly. The exception to this (as per OMC's recommendation), is to use the black Permatex (heavily) on the gasket 306242 which seperates the inner exhaust tube from the exhaust housing on the 1959 35hp and 1960 to 1970 40hp OMC outboards.
 

Mikekee

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Feb 15, 2013
Messages
26
Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

Thanks Joe for a fast reply. I put Black Permatex (non hardening) on the block and some gaskets. Not the head gasket. I will check the points as you described in your post. This has been a three week project :grumpy: I will not be defeated.:joyous: Here is the pic of this beast.
HPIM0419.jpg
 

Mikekee

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Feb 15, 2013
Messages
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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

I just checked the points and did what Joe said.:joyous: I checked the point gap with the key way pointing to the wiper on the points and found one that was 18 thou. gap. Reset the point to 20 thou. I looked at the cam and it says "TOP" on it so it's not upside down. The key is good on the crank. The fly wheel is not rubbing on any thing.
How do I know if the reeds are any good? They lay flat on there surface and are clean.
 

OptsyEagle

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Sep 13, 2006
Messages
1,359
Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

A couple things come to mind. Have you tried taking some premix gas and squirting some into the carb throat and seeing if you get a short burst. I might even try putting a teaspoon of this gas mix in each spark plug hole after to see if that gets a small burst of life. The other thing you could try is reverse the spark plug boots and see if that makes her go. Perhaps you got them reversed after the tune up and as you probably know, she will never run that way.

The next thing is your start up procedure. Ensure the choke is working and turn the throttle full on (ignore the grip labels for now) and give her a couple pulls that way. If that works, perhaps your carb was not synced with your throttle cam.

I think Joe mentioned about the carb adjustments. Are they set for initial start up?
 

Mikekee

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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

Yes I tried to reverse the plugs, It back fires. So I put them back on with out crossing the wires as they pass along side of the motor. I tried some fuel in the carb, no luck not even a puff of life. Everything looks good as far as the throttle and choke goes.
 

OptsyEagle

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Sep 13, 2006
Messages
1,359
Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

So it's not fuel. You might want to try some in the spark plug holes to rule out a problem with the reeds and crankcase.

When you said you had good spark. Did you use an external spark tester to confirm that your ignition can jump at least a 3/8" gap?
 

Mikekee

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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

I took out the plugs and held one at a time next to there hole and turned over the engine with a drill to the fly wheel nut. And each one had flames coming out, and occasionally a back fire from both. I don't have a spark tester here. But there new and gaped at 30 thou.
 

Mikekee

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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

Now that I have replaced the rings and the engine has not yet started up, the compression from both cylinders are at 50 PSI. I know that when this gets running that should increase some right? The bores are good and clean.
 

nwcove

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May 16, 2011
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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

50 psi is quite low for easy starting, but it should start with a few drops of fuel put into each plug hole.
 

Mikekee

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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

It has fuel as seen when I put a plug next to the hole and cranked her up with a drill. Almost burned up my sweater... HAHA :lol: You think my compression is low? Maybe I should buy pistons and rings and pay money to get it bored out. Crap, what's that cost????:facepalm:
 

Joe Reeves

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Feb 24, 2002
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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

No spark tester..... Use a #2 philips screwdriver which will fit inside of the coiled ring inside the rubber spark plug boot, then hold the shank of that screwdriver approximately 1/4" - 3/8" away from the block while cranking the engine over. That should give you the strong blue lightning like flame (SNAP) I spoke of. Testing spark with the spark plugs is a waste of time... don't do that.

The compression PSI will vary with the speed with what the engine is cranked over. the 50 psi is low but enough that the engine should start. I suggest that you don't go the piston and rings route just yet.

Squirt a little premix into the plug holes and see what that does. I feel that the leaf valves are okay and that possibly you've overlooked something within the carburetor. Let us know what you find.
 

Mikekee

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Feb 15, 2013
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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

Why do I see three rings on pistons that are for this model engine listed in E-Bay? My pistons have two rings each. And if I replace them with 30 over pistons, where do I get the hole set from. Rings and pistons and clips?:rolleyes:
 

Mikekee

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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

Getting my screw drivers out now, and let the games begin..:laugh:
 

Mikekee

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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

Well that was a fun spark test.:lol: Got my A.. shocked. Yes it blew a spark from both at 1/4" or better.:whoo::whoo::whoo:
 

steelespike

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Apr 26, 2002
Messages
19,069
Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

50 psi is low but little motors are known to run reasonably at 60 psi I would think it would at least fire.
Are the plug wires on the right cylinders?Try squirting some oil in the cylinders.
spin it with the drill.Squirt some fuel mix into the carb. Be careful.
Are the coils lined up with the bosses on the stator plate.
Does the carb open up when throttle is advanced all the way in neutral?
If you remove the plugs and turn it over you should be able to feel and hear the crankcase compression.puck-puck.
If your getting fuel into the cylinders and spark it would appear the timing is off somehow either in relation with the flywheel magnets or in relation
to top dead center.
 

Mikekee

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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

So the fuel that I got was from my friend.:facepalm: He said it was fresh and mixed at 50-1. So should I trust him?:lol: Or just decide to go and mix my own?:decision:
 

Mikekee

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Feb 15, 2013
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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

I put a power drill to the engine and check everything, then give her a pull and she's not happy.:mad:
 

Mikekee

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Feb 15, 2013
Messages
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Re: Johnson 6hp 6RL76A Motor Not Starting

I got a few sputters from pulling the rip cord, and well I got pissed and removed the carb again. :mad: Well I puffed up and blew it out and every hole is clear.:rolleyes: What the hell else is in here..:mad-new:
 
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