Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

[MI_Boat]

Hi all- first, I'm a brand new member - and new to boats for that matter (so be easy on me

I'm looking at a fairly old boat later today. It's a 1985 Four Winns Marquise. Pretty small- but at this point it's about the right price. From the photos, it appears to be in very good shape. Garage kept etc. It's an I/O (looks like there was a version of this boat with an outboard option as well). It's got the 140HP (Mercruiser?) motor - rebuilt within the last 5 years. I assume this is a pretty standard motor - in terms of maintenance and parts availability.

What things should I be on the lookout for when checking it over this evening. Are there any specific area's for mid-80's four winns I should look out for.

Any tips/help are appreciated. I expect I'll be spending plenty of time on here in the future- as I hope this boat is just a stepping stone along the way to a bigger and newer boat at some point in the future.

Thanks

 

[madurodave]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

Good for you! I came here looking for answers AFTER I bought my rig. Get a survey...200 to 300 bucks is money well spent. IN the very least, test on the water, test compression, look for soft spots in the floor, etc.

 

[Vipercwf]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

Recently went looking for boats and had mechanic check them out before buying (altough the one we ended up buying was too far away for him to check, but I learned alot of what to look for from the first 2)

Check oil in the engine as well as the outdrive, look for any signs of water/metal shavings, etc (SOME, minimally, amount of metal shavings in the outdrive is O.K. as the gears are always working in there and are constantly wearing. If boat is out of the water, check the integrity of the back of the boat where the outdrive hooks up to the boat, you can use a rubber malet and tap to see if it sounds solid all on the back of the boat(on each side of outdrive on the boat itself). The first two boats we checked out there was a notible difference and you could hear the hollowness as it was begining to rot out. I would also check the prop shaft, look at the very middle of the prop and spin it, make sure it doesn't wobble as it rotates or the prop shaft is bent.

Nothing beats taking the boat for a spin if its in the water to see how it handles and see that there is no signifcant vibrations.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

I assume this is a pretty standard motor - in terms of maintenance and parts availability.

In this case you are correct. However you don't want to necessarily make that assumption with other boats. There are DEFINITELY some powerplants you want to stay away from. The Merc 140 is a good one though.

 

[Sparkinator]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

Double check on the motor/drive. You posted that you thought is was a Mercruiser, and if it is, that is good, but unusual. Almost all of the older Four Winns came with OMC's and they are obsolete. OMC went out of business 12 years ago and finding parts and someone to work on one that was manufactured in 1985 would be a problem.

If it has the OMC, I wouldn't bother with a survey. I'd just keep looking.

If it is a Mercruiser, do like others have posted and get someone knowledgeable to check it out with you.

Good luck!

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

^^^^Good point

 

[MI_Boat]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

Double check on the motor/drive. You posted that you thought is was a Mercruiser, and if it is, that is good, but unusual. Almost all of the older Four Winns came with OMC's and they are obsolete. OMC went out of business 12 years ago and finding parts and someone to work on one that was manufactured in 1985 would be a problem.

If it has the OMC, I wouldn't bother with a survey. I'd just keep looking.

If it is a Mercruiser, do like others have posted and get someone knowledgeable to check it out with you.

Good luck!

Great. Thanks for this. I was just about to ask if anyone knew for sure that it was/is a Merc. Sounds like there were possibly 2 options - a 120hp and 140hp motor (this one is listed as 140). The seller states that it's a Merc in their for-sale information. I assume this will be easy to determine when looking it over?

If it's a Merc, would it be the 3.0 - or something different?

This is the sort of 'tribal' knowledge I'm looking for.

 

[Kracken]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

if it says: OMC on the outdrive...run away.

Nothing against OMC owners, I was one until last year. The problem is: Everytime you need a part, its off to EBay world to over-pay for used crap that might be worse than what you already have.

 

[MI_Boat]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

So I'm looking for both the engine and outdrive to NOT be OMC. Are motors and outdrives generally matched pairs (Merc/Merc, OMC/OMC) or is it possible/likely that they are mixed? Thanks again for the novice help here.

 

[Kracken]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

Yes they would be the same. OMC Motors and outdrives are usually Charcoal.

 

[clockwatcher]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

I'll add one. Even if the floor feels solid, check for a drop ridge where the floor meets the outer edges of the hull. When floor starts to rot, it's real easy to cut some plywood and lay it over the old and screw it down, then carpet over it. Feels nice and solid, but there's a disaster below.

 

[Fordiesel69]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

Small boats are easy to check, except for the floor and stringers. Owners may get mad if you check them the right way!!!!

Tansom: Use a flat or phillips screw driver and try to gently gouge the transom down very low and around the drive area.

Floor: feel for soft spots.

Hull: check for wavy areas where repairs were made. check for trailer scrapes, or stress cracks.

 

[MI_Boat]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

Thanks All. This is great information. I've been trying to find as much information as possible on this model boat before going to see it.

I read in another thread that a good way to handle the water test is to agree on a price first- and make it contignet on a sucessful in-water run.

The problem for me is that the nearest water is 45+ mins away.

 

[Sparkinator]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

Here's a pic of a OMC stringer drive

Most I've seen are white.

Most engines, regardless of the drive manufacturer are Fords or Chevys. Ford got out of the marine I/O business in 96 I believe so parts for them are not as readily available as Chevys.

I'm not sure what a 140 Merc outdrive was coupled to what engine, but some of the more knowledgeable posters I'm sure will chime in shortly.

Google 1985 OMC Stringer drive and you can get an idea of what to avoid as far as the drive goes.

Hopefully, the guy is knowledgeable about his drive, and it is a Mercruiser.

 

[Sparkinator]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

I think the old 140 HP was the 3.0 litre 4 cylinder; and the 165 HP was an inline 6 and I'm not sure of the displacement.

 

[Kracken]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

Here's a pic of a OMC stringer drive

Most I've seen are white.

Most engines, regardless of the drive manufacturer are Fords or Chevys. Ford got out of the marine I/O business in 96 I believe so parts for them are not as readily available as Chevys.

I'm not sure what a 140 Merc outdrive was coupled to what engine, but some of the more knowledgeable posters I'm sure will chime in shortly.

Google 1985 OMC Stringer drive and you can get an idea of what to avoid as far as the drive goes.

Hopefully, the guy is knowledgeable about his drive, and it is a Mercruiser.

learn something everyday.

I have never seen a white OMC Drive. I had a 90 OMC Cobra Drive with the 5.0 HO motor in a 21 foot Four Winns. I almost purchased a 1996 24ft Four Winns but it also had the OMC Cobra Drive. Both were Charcoal.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

Yeah stringers were usually white. Those are a real nightmare parts-wise. Cobras were charcoal and parts are a little better but still not great. A King Cobra, from what I understand, is absolutely impossible for get parts for.

You also want to avoid a Mercruiser 470. It had some other names but was always a 3.7L 4 cylinder. Those had a problematic design and a number of NLA parts. Most other Mercs and Volvos should be fine.

 

[MI_Boat]

Follow-up

Follow-up

Hi all- just to follow up. I went to see the boat last night. Unfortunately it was not nearly as nice looking in person as it was in the pictures. I was actually pretty surprised how bad it did look in person. I tried to look closely to see if it just required a good cleaning- or if things were just worn out. The floor had all kinds of debris and the seats had several tears in them. I guess I expected it to be 'dolled' up for sale. No way this one would have passed the WAF.

Mechanically it looked great. The engine ran/started/sounded/looked great. Very clean and appeared well cared for.

Guess I'll keep looking. I may need to increase my budget a bit to ensure I find something newer.

Thanks all for the help- it will certainly help as I continue my search.

 

[RotaryRacer]

Re: Follow-up

Re: Follow-up

I just want to clear up a little bit of confusion in the posts up above for others that may come accross this thread.

Four Winns was an independent family owned business unitl 1987-1988. They predominately used Mercruiser outdrives and only offered OMC stringers and the later Cobras as options.

Starting in 1988 all Four Winns were powered by OMC (the new parent company) and that lasted up until 1995-96 when the OMC/Volvo-Penta joint venture when the Cobra SX was first used. After that you could get Volvo-Penta only.

In 2001 Four Winns was once again sold to a new parent company. Genmar. Genmar offered Volvo-Penta or Mercruiser drives starting in the 2002 model year.

A little time line:

1975-1988 = Mercruisers standard...OMC optional (not common)

1988-1995 = OMC only

1996-2001 = Volvo-Penta only

2002-current = Volvo-Penta or Mercruiser (most seem to be VP, however there are plenty of Mercs also)

 

[RotaryRacer]

Re: Looking at an older Four Winns tonight- tips?

I think the old 140 HP was the 3.0 litre 4 cylinder; and the 165 HP was an inline 6 and I'm not sure of the displacement.

You are correct....HOWEVER, the inline 6 Chevy block was last used by Mercruiser in 1981. It is a great motor. They were labeled as 165HP for most of the time they were offered...the really early ones were labeled as 160HP. They displace 250 cubic inches (4.1 L).

The 3.0 liter motors that are 130-140 HP were/are actually based on the inline 6 block. They are also good motors that are still being used.


That being said, if you ever see a Mercruiser that is advertised as a 165HP-170HP that is later than 1981....it is the dreaded 470. This is a 4 cylinder block that Mercruiser actually made on there own and they used a Ford big block cylinder head on it. These motors have many potential problems and really should probably be avoided if you are a novice.