Looking for my first project boat

[brewern]

I'd like to have a project boat to work on over the winter and am starting to look for one.
This one caught my eye for example:
http://lexington.craigslist.org/boa/3103267901.html

But, I have hardly any experience. That doesn't scare me a bit though, I don't mind rolling up my sleeves and figuring things out and doing the work. Ultimately, I'd like to get into the business of buying, fixing, and selling boats.

Can any of you give me some advice on what I should look for, and what pitfalls lie ahead of me? Can I expect to turn a profit? What am I not considering?

Many thanks,
Neil

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

Turning a profit. Boy Low Sell High!!!! Hard to do some times. Boats are Expensive toys. Everyone is looking for a bargain. The boat you posted, IMHO will cost you a minimum of $2k - 3K to restore. Can you do the upholstery work? If not that could run you another 1.5K. Adding this all up you would have a total of 4 to 5.5 in her. You'd be lucky to get that for her. That's not counting your time. @ $20 bucks and hour you'll have a minimum of 100 hours in it so you'd have to ask 6 to 7.5k to turn a profit. Asking that much for a 24 year old boat might be an issue. With proper documentation that she is 100% restored and with some kind of warranty you might be able to get someone to pay that kind of a price. Most of us do our own to save a buck. Not to make a buck. Bayliners are notorious for having rot issues in the deck, stringers and transoms. You will find a LOT of rebuilds here on the forum with boats similar to yours. You will serve yourself well to do a lot or research here on the forum so you will know what to expect.

 

[NathanL]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

First thing you have to consider if you plan on making money is what will you have when you are done. Sorry but Bayliners are not exactly cream of the crop boats that demand top dollar. When that ad says needs floor work that means stringers and transom work as well. Put in X amount of labor plus materials to fix it. $1,000 boat purchase cost and $1,500 in materials and give away your labor and I don't think you will still come out ahead on the sell price.

If you want to fix boats and make a profit make sure the cost of what you buy + labor/materials will actually sell for a profit. Wore out busted down bayliners are a dime a dozen and ones that actually run and usuable sell for barely more.

In other words there are boats that you could get for free that won't come out ahead even if they don't require a total rebuild. Supply and demand.

If that boat had a decent interior, no rot, and ran OK what do you think it would sell for on craigslist? $2,500 - $3,000 maybe and that's a big maybe to me. That's a pretty thin margin to work on.

 

[zymox]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

I don't know about your prices over there. I envy you guys, That's an 11000$ boat here in Sweden in not to bad condition but still not great. 1$ equals somewhere about 7 Swedish kronor.
http://www.blocket.se/vastmanland/Bayliner_1952_capri__88_40537812.htm?ca=23_9&w=3&last=1
Any how, I agree to the above posters and they for sure know what they are talking about so +1 for the above answers.

To give you an idea for what you're up to, check out friscoboater. Not the same boat but I think it's a pretty similar construction. He is doing alot of what you are up to regarding the floors and stringers + alot more but it can give you an idea of what you are up against.

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=454460

 

[brewern]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

Good to know. I was just reading another post from WoodOnGlass, and he bought that beauty for only $250. I think I'll keep looking for a boat and keep my eye out for a better deal. As I find them, I may post them here for advice if that's ok. I doubt I'll be able to get a project boat until next March or so anyway after some other bills get paid off.
As for turning a profit, I fear I'll do the same thing with boats as I do with puppies. If it stays in my house too long, it becomes a part of the family. If I can get one, restore it to decent condition, and use it for a few years and sell it that'll be fine. That way, I'll always have two boats. One I'm using, and one I'm restoring. Break even would be ok in that case!

Zymox, sounds like you could turn a profit buying from the states, shipping them there, and selling at a reduced local cost! Wow!

So, can anyone give me some advice on what would be a good boat to look for? Or what I should avoid?

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

As has been stated Bayliners are low on the list. WellCrafts seem to be well constructed. I'm partial to the all closed bow Classics of the 60's. Depends on your life style and what you want to do. the Open bow Tri Hulls offer a very stable ride and lots of room for family. If you want to tow kids on tubes, then 80 to 150 hp will be needed. Look for for boats that have been stored inside, or at least covered. If not covered Stored with the Bow Up and the drain plug out. Running Motor is always good. Bouncing on the motor to check for flex in the transom. There shold be NONE. Get on your hands and knees and look UNDER the boat. Look for big gouges in the hull. Don'd sweat scratches and small pits. Cosmetics are no biggee, Upholstery, unless you want to do it yourself, can get pricey. Windshields etc are also hard to find and pricey. Get INSIDE the boat and check EVERY nook and cranny. Look for soft spots. You can't see under anything so your only clue will be soft spots. If you find ONE, then you should count on the entire deck & stringers needing to be replaced. Take a flashlight. If there's a ski locker, look down inside of it. If it's not enclosed you can sometimes see a lot about the underside of the substructure. Make sure all Titles and registrations are current. Transfer of titles in some states can be a BIG issue.

 

[NathanL]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

I can't help with what to look for in that type of boat. I only deal with bass boats. I stick to the major brands that have name appeal lik Champions and BassCat (my personal favorite because even a 20 year old boat they will help you locate parts or have them in stock like seats and will send you a new composite transom already cut to fit a 25 year old boat and will give you part numbers for pumps etc...). I avoid the numerous lesser named boats that probably built on a splashed mold anyway that are a dime a dozen like TideCraft, RayCraft, etc...there are hundreds of them out there.

Every region is different. You could have a 1988 Bayliner just like it rolled out of the showroom floor here and it would only sell for $3,500. At least the one you posted didn't have the infamous Bayliner/Force combo which you can't even give away and commonly see them advertised as trailer for $300 with free boat/engine attached in an effort to unload them.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

I'd suggest you look for a project boat that someone else has started the gut, but NOT the put back. Esp if the Mrs/Admiral wants it out of their yard/garage/driveway. Those can be a bargain, but you may have fewer references to use for put back. It's always going to be a trade off.... Good boat, bad motor should be avoided unless you have access to lots of donor boats. Jamestown & Somerset are a great place to look for parts, pieces & project boats. Even if you don't boat @Lake Cumberland, you might use it as a source. Most marinas will have boats for sale posted alongside the big fish caught near their dock. And all the storage & dock auctions for back rent.

And don't be in a rush. If you like the look of the 80's Bayliners, they can be put back better then new too. Friscoboater did a great job w/ his, and it's well documented w/ text & video, plus his YouTube channel is very helpful.

But it's unlikely you'll make any money flipping older boats. Material & time are too costly, and in the end it'll still be a $2-3K boat. If you want to use it, you may spend $2-3K but it'll be 'worth' much more to you. And may be better then a $5K used boat, but not in real sellable dollars. Boats are like old generic, plain jane cars, not rare vintage expensive beauties

 

[brewern]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

...At least the one you posted didn't have the infamous Bayliner/Force combo which you can't even give away and commonly see them advertised as trailer for $300 with free boat/engine attached in an effort to unload them.

LOL, just found this:


1987 bayliner with a 125 force motor. It has 6 seats , 18.7 in length, 8.0 beam and trailer. Needs work $400.00.
http://lexington.craigslist.org/boa/3090685419.html

Thanks for the advice NathanL

 

[mrdjflores]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

i had that almost exact boat before i bought my current one....construction was pretty poor, but one promising thing from the photo is how straight and even the windshield is where the center section closes. as the substructure and deck begin to go, the consoles and windshield will tend to dip towards each other, causing the center window to no line up and close correctly.

of course, the PO may have rigged up some supports under the deck to compensate

 

[brewern]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

What are the reputations on Dynasty Elans? Nice looking project boat I think...

http://lexington.craigslist.org/boa/3170812103.html

 

[jasoutside]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

Well brew, that there looks like it might have a 4 cyl Merc in it? If it does it may make for a great donor boat to rebuild something metal eh!

If the engine actually check out it might be worth about 1/2 asking price maybe?

Yah, for sure rebuilding old boats would be a terrible way to turn a buck.

Cheers man!

 

[brewern]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

Well brew, that there looks like it might have a 4 cyl Merc in it? If it does it may make for a great donor boat to rebuild something metal eh!

If the engine actually check out it might be worth about 1/2 asking price maybe?

Yah, for sure rebuilding old boats would be a terrible way to turn a buck.

Cheers man!

Thanks jas. You may have seen me post in oops' thread that I'll probably be choosing a tinny for my first porject. Seeing what oops, frisco and other glassers have went through compared to what you go through definitely puts me on team tinny! I've just not found the right boat yet. We're not into fishing, so I need a runabout. Basically, I want a tinny with the features of a runabout. The right boat will present itself sooner or later.

 

[jasoutside]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

Metal boat guy convert, yah baby!

Your learning curve is quick!

Most of the other glasser guys endure years of pain, agony, torment and frustration before leaving the dark side.

Brilliant!

KoolAid is searved

 

[brewern]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

Metal boat guy convert, yah baby!

Your learning curve is quick!

Most of the other glasser guys endure years of pain, agony, torment and frustration before leaving the dark side.

Brilliant!

KoolAid is searved

Yum, KoolAid!

Yep, I'm leaning towards a StarCraft. Perfect blend of tinny and bow rider. Something like this:

http://lexington.craigslist.org/boa/3149513427.html

 

[jasoutside]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

Ah, now we're talkin!

That one is a little pricey. But! It has a nice engine on it, loaded with fishing gear (not that you care about that stuff) and looks in good shape. If she's actually water ready that would be a very fair price.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

Metal boat guy convert, yah baby!

Your learning curve is quick!

Most of the other glasser guys endure years of pain, agony, torment and frustration before leaving the dark side.

Brilliant!

KoolAid is served

I resemble this remark....

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

Yum, KoolAid! Yep, I'm leaning towards a StarCraft. Perfect blend of tinny and bow rider. Something like this:http://lexington.craigslist.org/boa/3149513427.html

The fishing gear would go quick posted in Jas neck of the woods. In KY might take some time, but it'd probably still sell. Downrigger setups aren't cheap...

 

[brewern]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

Ah, now we're talkin!

That one is a little pricey. But! It has a nice engine on it, loaded with fishing gear (not that you care about that stuff) and looks in good shape. If she's actually water ready that would be a very fair price.

Check out this tinny I just found:

http://lexington.craigslist.org/boa/3162884455.html

I'm not in the market right now, but that's a heck of a boat for $500 I think, even with a little engine repair.

 

[brewern]

Re: Looking for my first project boat

We went to a family function today, and the owners vacation cabin is in a gated community on a small lake. Yes, I'm jealous if you were wondering. But they are great, wonderful kind people.
When their son was younger, he learned how to stand up in this canoe and paddle all over the lake. He eventually did it instinctively and could cruise around that lake with minimal effort. Well, he grew up, and went away to do adult things and now the canoe was just sitting there collecting leaves. And after talking about boats for a while, they offered it to me for free.

They said some canoes are real easy to keep upright, however, this is not one of them. They had named her "Tippy Canoe", and I'll not be changing that.

Thank you family and friends!


So here she is, my first glasser project. A canoe! LOL

I'll post more details about it soon. I only just noticed in the pic there's a tag in there I should take a look at. I'd run out again right now, but I tore a ligament in my left calf last weekend. Now I'm in a boot and not moving too fast, but it could be worse.

brew