Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

it also shows the thugs and druggies, that they are there and going to be there. so maybe those guys will go some where else.

 

[QC]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Lay off the cops . . . QC. .

OK, so I have cooled off and erased 90% of the reply that I intended. Reread the %$#@ post!! I have not layed into any cops. I made it very clear that I teach my kids respect for the police and law. I am suggesting that in this instance that pursuit may have been made more difficult . . . Jeez. You know me better than that!! How do you know that the kid was "mouthy"? I suppose you think my kid was "mouthy" too. What I think is that he was g'damn scared!!!

I386, reread as well as I also said that I regretted that stance immediately. I posted all I know, because I wanted to be fair to all. Thought it might be a decent discussion. Still think it is . . .

Frankly, other than above, I agree with JB . . . there cannot be a skate park without rules. I also think those rules have to have teeth or they won't be adhered to. I also think that fines probably pay to offset the ridiuculously high insurance premiums caused by overzealous and greedy lawyers. I also think most lawyers are decent people. I also think that some cops are bad just like some people are. I also think I posted a note this morning that may help explain why a cop with a spilt second to make a decision may have shot an innocent man. Annnnnnd, I would and have told this story exactly how I have told it to my cop friends. Which, frankly, I have! Ultimately I think my beef is with the City Council, but in no way have I told my kid that he is innocent of anything. He's paying it!!! I have told him that when kids miss school and courts are overcrowded that this may be a good example of a decent idea that has gone very wrong. I stand by that!

 

[QC]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Yeah same kid with the dog bite. Still has a scar on his cheek . . . City PD. Obviously they are doing "sweeps" there for some reason. Just seemed strong armed for kids. Plus the mandatory appearance and the overcrowded court alomost struck me as funny . . .

I wasn't there, but I do trust his story. Not that I trust all of his stories by any stretch, in fact I trust the kid he was with more.

 

[i386]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

I386, reread as well as I also said that I regretted that stance immediately. I posted all I know, because I wanted to be fair to all. Thought it might be a decent discussion. Still think it is . . .

I was just about to leave from work when I posted that. I should have waited until I got home to think about it more.

I don't know everything that was said and done in the time between you regretting the stance (having second thoughts) and making him pay for it. I would guess you had to explain that your initial reaction was wrong which is hard for a father to do. If that's what happened, then he learned 2 things.

 

[JB]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

The bottom line here is that we have gotten only one side of the story, and only from hearsay at that.

Lotta people going off half cocked here.

Thank your lucky stars that if you get accused, then gossiped about, you will have a chance to defend yourself before any lynchings take place.

If you teach your kids to respect the law and law enforcers and your kid broke the law what kind of example are you setting with anti-law and anti cop rants??? Kids are not above the law and must be accountable for their behavior now or they may never be.

I agree that it is a stupid law, but we live in a stupid society that makes it necessary.

 

[ob]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

It would seem to me that if safety is the motivating force behind the significant fines imposed for not conforming to safety gear ,and since the skatepark is likely comprised primarily of juveniles , that there would be an adult person in charge of said facility to screen the kids for the proper safety gear before they were allowed in the skating area.There are obviously paid officers present.Sounds a little bait and hook to me.My recommendation is to just pay the fine and pose my above concern and see how the authorities react.

 

[QC]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Well despite JB's assertion that I have only supplied one side of this relatively simple story, I am absolutely 100% positive I had to take time off work and take my son out of school for a ticket issued in a skate park for not having knee pads I am also 100% positive the fine is $77.

The paying of the fine is not in discussion anymore. He made the decision that he would pay it rather than come back for a trial. No do over, that is a done deal he basically plead guilty. He has until 12/29 to save up the bucks. I explained to him immediately after my mistaken suggestion that he could come back and hope that the officer didn't show, that it was basically wrong. I explained that this system is in place because he has the right to face his accuser. He definitely learned a lot from this. I hope mostly that he just didn't like the place and would rather avoid further visits

This City Park is very large but also very visible form major intersections. Basketball courts, Baseball Diamonds, even batting cages. It is not manned in any way other than routine patrols, gardeners, and a guy that gives tokens for the cages. This was a scheduled sweep by multiple officers. They could've been looking for specific things and also making sure that compliance would be heightend in the future. My problem with the alledged kick is once again I WANT MY KIDS TO TRUST THE POLICE. If I am not being clear then I am not sure what else to do . . .

Where JB gets the message that I teach my kids to mistrust police and that I go off half cocked, and leave the impression that lawlessness is accpetable, I have no idea . . In fact WTF

 

[puddle jumper]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Wow I thought the helmet law for riding your bike was kinda reaching out there. But getting a ticket for no kneepads kinda blows my mind.

I gess anything to keep our kids safe.

 

[Bob_VT]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

QC.... When he runs for President of the US you know this "criminal activity" will come up again

 

[QC]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

LMAO at Bob VT. I'm not sure that is much of a concern anymore considering the habits of some of our aspiring and recent editions . . .

 

[JB]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Where JB gets the message that I teach my kids to mistrust police and that I go off half cocked, and leave the impression that lawlessness is accpetable, I have no idea . . In fact WTF

I get no such message, QC, and I have not claimed that I have. I was reacting to the tone of the thread. . .bashing cops. . . and the message it sends to kids in general.

 

[kenimpzoom]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Dont know what to say about the cops other than they should have better things to do than handout no kneepad fines.

Anyway, whoever thought of a 77 dollar fine for no kneepads is an idiot. Maybe a communtiy service time or something else, but not money. Just stupid.

Ken

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

I don't know what to think. I mean if he knew the rules and just didn't abide by them, then he is at fault 100 percent. But if he didn't know, you can't blame him. But you do the crime you pay the fine. That's how it goes.

Whether or not you agree with the penalty is irrelevant. Don't commit the offense and you won't have to worry about the penalty.

 

[roscoe]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Is Chino Hills in Venezuela or Cuba?

 

[Dunaruna]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

I am dumbfounded by the topic of this thread.

The fact that Brian was wearing a helmet and elbow pads shows that he has respect for common sense rules, even if he only respects them because his parents tell him too. O/K, he wasn't wearing knee pads, big friggin' deal - HE IS 12 YEARS OLD. I would be very surprised if the cop in question did not have the option of giving a warning, but court, WTF??????????

He is 12 years old for goodness sake!

 

[Dunaruna]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

In light of the guilty plee, does he now have it on permanent record?

 

[mlukich]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

I pesonally would like to hear a little more about the "kick" before deciding whether the cop was "abusive" or not...

Did the cop tap the kid with his foot to get his attention or did he drop kick him across the pavement?

I can visualize the kid sitting on a bench, yakking on the phone and basically ignoring the cop. Said cop "kicks" the foot/leg of the kid as a way of getting his attention and letting him know that the cop will not be ignored. In this situation, I'm fine with the cops action... Much better than a backhand across the head...

If, on the other hand, the kid asked/informed the cop that he was calling his parents and the cop kicked the kid hard enough to knock him down or bruise him or something along those lines, then I'd say the cop was "abusive"...

And while I fully understand believing what your own kid says or another trusted individual says - the fact remains that the adult did not see the incident and therefore cannot be 100% sure of what happened... And as much as I love my kids, I KNOW they will stretch the truth if they think they're in trouble... maybe not outright lie, but...

I always say that there are 2 sides to every story and that the truth is usually somewhere in the middle...

Mark

 

[Caveman Charlie]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Oh how I wish it was like it used to be. But, it's not. First of all, in th old days most cops were good and a few were bad. These days it seems most cops are bad and a few are good.

Second, it all about revenue. It has nothing at all to do with good and bad, right and wrong, it sometimes doesn't even have to do with legal and illegal. It's just that someone (usually a lawyer) has figured out how to make a buck out of the deal. Nobody cares about anything anymore but, how much money they can make.

Third, teaching the kid to stand up and fight it out in court is not a bad thing. Some other young and/or poor person will get a brake because the court system is all tied up with a trivial matter. Everyone should plead not guilty to every little thing. If we did thing would get backed up so bad that they would have to stop pressing charges over the dumb stuff and concentrate on the people that should have been concentrating on in the first place.

I wish with all my hart that it wasn't like this but, it is. And anyone who doesn't think so it sadly misinformed. I'm not knocking people who are but, they are.

 

[Caveman Charlie]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

In light of the guilty plee, does he now have it on permanent record?

In my area yes. And, because he does it will show up whenever a cop calls in his name or drivers license number (I know he doesn't have a license yet but, he will someday) Because it shows up it makes him look like a lawless kid and there more likely to give him a lot more tickets in the future. After about the second ticket he becomes known to the local police and they start harassing him over every little thing. Now, this is in my area! Other places could be different. Also, it is a worst case scenario. If he doesn't get in any more trouble for 5 years it still is on his record but, the cops tend to ignore it. (unless it was a more serious ticket. then it takes longer before he can get a break)

Oh, and in MN your record is no longer cleaned when you turn 18. So, this ticket will be there forever.

 

[QC]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

In light of the guilty plee, does he now have it on permanent record?

Good question.
1) It is an infraction, below a misdemeanor, like a parking ticket, and from a City ordinance, pretty low level stuff
2) It is not a Sate "moving violation" so no impact on any driving record
3) Would be wiped clean at 18 years old anyway
4) I'll check with a cop friend if it is on his "record", but I doubt any long term repurcussions actually

I want to clarify something about the "alleged" kick. While I believe my kid, I do not know more than I have posted, and other than here I have taken no action. What I do know is that what he witnessed has made him less trusting of the Police. I don't care about much else in this situation . . . Whether or not the cop was provoked, or my kid exaggerated, or the other kid deserved to be water boarded, again, I don't care. It is an extension of this whole issue. I thought relevant, BUT, it is in no way an indictment of cops in general.