Mercruiser 4.3lx - Water in oil pan and milky oil

[Lou C]

Lange Tools
7/16ths-14 thread chaser

 

[TurnerBFC]

WOW - thanks again, Lou!! I'll see what we have for that chaser up here in Canada. Another thought I had that you may (or may not) be able to answer is if a head was cracked, how does the water then get into the oil/block? I'm trying to understand that based on the amount of water I had in the oil..

 

[Lou C]

While the heads were cracked, that was not how the water got in. The water got in due to failed head gaskets which no doubt were damaged by a bad overheat in 2013, the engine ran fine after that, for the rest of ‘13, ‘14, and ‘15. Then ran fine till Aug ‘16 when I had water in cyl #2 and a mist of water in cyl # 1. I did a test for exhaust gas bubbles in the cooling water and that was verified but I did not know what the cause was (cracked head or block or bad HGs) until I took it apart. The cyls where the heads were cracked (#s 3&5) dud not have water. So you can have cracks and not aways get water in the oil or cyls. In fact I bet the heads were cracked after the overheat and I ran it 3 more seasons without obvious water in a cyl or oil. The only warning: I did an oil analysis in ‘14 and saw a slight amount of sodium in the oil (salt water cooled), so there it was.

For you the main main question is...heads, block or both? You sure your head gaskets were good?

 

[TurnerBFC]

While the heads were cracked, that was not how the water got in. The water got in due to failed head gaskets which no doubt were damaged by a bad overheat in 2013, the engine ran fine after that, for the rest of ‘13, ‘14, and ‘15. Then ran fine till Aug ‘16 when I had water in cyl #2 and a mist of water in cyl # 1. I did a test for exhaust gas bubbles in the cooling water and that was verified but I did not know what the cause was (cracked head or block or bad HGs) until I took it apart. The cyls where the heads were cracked (#s 3&5) dud not have water. So you can have cracks and not aways get water in the oil or cyls. In fact I bet the heads were cracked after the overheat and I ran it 3 more seasons without obvious water in a cyl or oil. The only warning: I did an oil analysis in ‘14 and saw a slight amount of sodium in the oil (salt water cooled), so there it was.

For you the main main question is...heads, block or both? You sure your head gaskets were good?

Ahhh ok I see what you're saying.. and yes, who knows! I can't visually see anything on the block so I'm hoping for a cracked head that way I can get it fixed up relatively cheap (compared to new block) and then get back out on the water!! As far as head gaskets, only that dark spot between the two cylinders but other than that.. I'm no expert! Nothing stood out to you guys in the photos I posted earlier so maybe it wasn't that but I could literally hear the air leak when I put my ear up to that center cylinder exhaust port (it got louder here when I removed the exhaust manifold and the valve cover) so I'm hoping magnafluxing reveals something but again... I don't understand how that would introduce so much water into the motor :faint2:

 

[Lou C]

Possibly a crack in the valve seat area? Was that cyl one of the ones that had water in it?
PS was this engine ever overheated, and was it properly winterized every year (drained and then drain holes poked to make sure it really drained), not the suck AF up the drive method?

 

[TurnerBFC]

Possibly a crack in the valve seat area? Was that cyl one of the ones that had water in it?

Actually.. yes it was! Where are you going with this...

 

[TurnerBFC]

Possibly a crack in the valve seat area? Was that cyl one of the ones that had water in it?
PS was this engine ever overheated, and was it properly winterized every year (drained and then drain holes poked to make sure it really drained), not the suck AF up the drive method?

My family has owned the boat since 92'... my father and uncle had the marina take care of it up until the point where it was left in storage for 4 years, then we took it out and after that summer is when I was wise enough to start taking care of it to save the marina fees and that's when I did the oil change and noticed the water! The marina wasn't the best around... so to say would I be surprised if they were at fault? No... probably why that marina is no longer around. As far as over heating... I asked this to my father and previous to this we were on a cruise and I would say the boat was a bit overloaded and it actually ended up spinning the gears in the upper unit of the out drive so that had to be replaced before this. I suppose it is possible that it overheated during that?? But I don't think the head gasket shows evidence of that.. but again, I still have yet to remove the port side head and maybe there is something going on in there

 

[Lou C]

Well as it sat before being winterized that water found have seeped into the cyl and then got past the rings and wound up in the oil. On my engine I was testing it for like a week before I narrowed down the cause. Ran it and then pulled plugs and check for water. Didn’t see any right away.... however, I let it sit overnight and sure enough when I checked the next morning as the engine cooled off there was water in #2 cyl.

 

[TurnerBFC]

Well as it sat before being winterized that water found have seeped into the cyl and then got past the rings and wound up in the oil. On my engine I was testing it for like a week before I narrowed down the cause. Ran it and then pulled plugs and check for water. Didn’t see any right away.... it let it sit overnight and sure enough when I checked the next morning as the engine cooled off there was water in #2 cyl.

Hmmm... well I guess that'll show up during magnaflux if there is a crack there

 

[TurnerBFC]

I was looking again last night at the photos I took earlier and I noted in this one that the this one bolt hole out of the rest had the oil residue in it as well as this rust stain under (or on top) of the gasket near the water jacket between the two cylinders.. Is it possible water was spraying into my lifter valley from here? I don't know.. just thinking out loud.

 

[alldodge]

I don't think so

 

[TurnerBFC]

I don't think so

Ok time for me to stop overthinking and get these heads checked!

 

[Lou C]

I think what's going to tell the tale is when you get the heads checked and clean up the block surface really well. I will post up a pic of my old head gaskets I still have em in my bin of old Chevy parts.

 

[TurnerBFC]

Just an update, heads were finally dropped off yesterday for magnafluxing. Also, I cleaned up the block surface and found nothing - I think I'm going to remove the lifters to try to get a better visual at the lower portion of the block while I wait to hear back from the machine shop, maybe the crack could be in the lower portion.

Does anybody know of anything that will clean up the milky oil on the block? It's a bit difficult to work with, lol.

I still feel like I'm chasing a ghost with this one... I'm hoping we turn up some answers soon, guys!!

 

[Lou C]

I just used a bunch of shop towels lol. Yes it was a mess but I didn’t want to get solvent in the motor oil. Before I took it apart I changed the oil 3 times and drained the water out each time. Then I ran it after putting it all back together and changed it a few more times. Oil still stays nice and clean and it’s 3 years later....

 

[Lou C]

If you remove the lifters do one at a time so you don’t get them mixed up. On mine the lifters and cam lobes looked brand new, no wear and no corrosion either surprising due to the salt water in the motor oil!
its amazing how simple these engines are to take apart isn’t it?

 

[TurnerBFC]

If you remove the lifters do one at a time so you don’t get them mixed up. On mine the lifters and cam lobes looked brand new, no wear and no corrosion either surprising due to the salt water in the motor oil!
its amazing how simple these engines are to take apart isn’t it?

Yup it sure is, and I have everything labeled so far for the rockers and push rods, I'll do the same for the lifters (I'll do one cylinder at a time, clean block, place back in). Sorry I went quiet for a week or so there.. super busy with re-leveling our cottage !

 

[Lou C]

Question:
how do you re-level a cottage? Sounds dangerous!

 

[TurnerBFC]

Question:
how do you re-level a cottage? Sounds dangerous!

Basically digging new holes for concrete pads about 4' deep, 2'x2' and then lay some gravel, pour some concrete and then jack it up and set it down on new pier block haha!

 

[TurnerBFC]

Update, I got the call from the Machine Shop and the heads are fine. He says no cracks, etc! Told me to continue looking at the block. What are you guys thinking I should do next? I need to know where this leak is... it’s driving me nuts !!