Mercruiser Engine Help

ChasR

Cadet
Joined
Jun 19, 2008
Messages
15
I've inhereted a project. My daughters boyfriend didn't winterize his 2007 Maxum 2200SR3 and now says the block is cracked. I have looked all over and can't find any numbers to identify the engine other than Mercruiser 350 MAG Bravo so I know it's a 5.7 liter but there are several different horsepowers available. The plan is to repair the block if it's just a crack on the outside of the block or replace the engine if a cylinder wall is cracked. What I need is:
- How do I ID the engine to get the correct replacement?
- Has anyone ever repaired a cracked block? Successfully?
- Does anyone have a good suggestion for where to buy a quality engine?
Any experience you've had with this issue would be helpful. Even if I repair it I don't know what other items to replace. The repair estimate ($15,000) lists a module kit @ $750 and housing assy @ $170?

Thanks
Chas
 

ErieRon

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
May 5, 2009
Messages
463
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

I've inhereted a project. My daughters boyfriend didn't winterize his 2007 Maxum 2200SR3 and now says the block is cracked. I have looked all over and can't find any numbers to identify the engine other than Mercruiser 350 MAG Bravo so I know it's a 5.7 liter but there are several different horsepowers available. The plan is to repair the block if it's just a crack on the outside of the block or replace the engine if a cylinder wall is cracked. What I need is:
- How do I ID the engine to get the correct replacement?
- Has anyone ever repaired a cracked block? Successfully?
- Does anyone have a good suggestion for where to buy a quality engine?
Any experience you've had with this issue would be helpful. Even if I repair it I don't know what other items to replace. The repair estimate ($15,000) lists a module kit @ $750 and housing assy @ $170?

Thanks
Chas

There's a serial number plate just above and right of the starter. That will ID the engine at least.

Then, go here and download the free factory service manual (#31) I think.

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?p=1693398#post 1693398

I've heard/read that they can sometimes be be welded, and even repaired with JB Weld. I'm sure both depend on where it's cracked, and how badly.

You can do a search here for "cracked block" and read for days...pretty common unfortunately.

Others will be by later and you'll get lots of help.

Good luck.
 

JustJason

Vice Admiral
Joined
Aug 27, 2007
Messages
5,321
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

V8's crack internally along the lifter valley so your not going to be able to repair it with epoxy or anything of the sort.

You ID the motor by the serial number. It will be on a metal tag riveted to the block above the starter. It's almost always printed on the valve cover and any kind of plastic engine shroud as well.

There are many reputable rebuilders out there, but there are even more scrupulous ones too. It comes down to who is going to do the work. If you do it, you can buy from who you want. If a shop or dealer is going to do it. They typically will not install an engine that they don't order themselves.

$15,000 mistake huh... Bet he won't be making that one again.
 

Bondo

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Apr 17, 2002
Messages
71,082
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

It comes down to who is going to do the work.

Ayuh,... Great Point,... You mention Project, does that mean You're the wrench turner,..??
If so, are you comfortable reducing it to a Short Block,+ putting it Back together,..??
Sucessfully,..??

It's a good canidate for a 383 crate motor, if you want to pick it up abit...
 

TilliamWe

Banned
Joined
Dec 21, 2004
Messages
6,579
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

IMercruiser 350 MAG Bravo so I know it's a 5.7 liter but there are several different horsepowers available...

Not if it says 350MAG on it, there's only one HP rating and it's 300 at the propshaft.
 

boat1010

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
781
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

I busted a crank on my 7.4 had a dealer replace it with a long block. Total price for the job was $6,000.00. So if you are doing the work your self it will be quite a bit cheaper. I think the long block was $4,500.00 Some where around there. Good luck.
 

86 century

Ensign
Joined
Sep 8, 2009
Messages
986
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

A $15000 small block or even $4500 we build 1000hp big blocks for $15000 and that is all new block,heads,crank(better steel than marine). Anyone can order an 800hp 800ftlb bill mitchell from summit racing for $16000. Am I missing something here.
 

zbnutcase

Commander
Joined
Sep 19, 2009
Messages
2,055
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

Cast iron can be repaired but only a handful of shops in the country has the equipment and skill to do it correctly. And on a run-of-the-mill Chev not EVEN worth the effort, you could buy 10 good used blocks for the price of a proper repair. 'nutcase
 

intrepidvoyager

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Mar 24, 2009
Messages
216
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

OK ...so your daughter's boyfriend "says" the block is cracked .....if he new anything about engines he would have drained the block to start with ..... so before you go pulling the engine maybe you should fill it up with coolant mix and pressure test the block ......maybe its just a leak from a semi pushed out frost plug ...wouldn't that be nice....... ;)
 

Fisnfool

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
133
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

OK ...so your daughter's boyfriend "says" the block is cracked .....if he new anything about engines he would have drained the block to start with ..... so before you go pulling the engine maybe you should fill it up with coolant mix and pressure test the block ......maybe its just a leak from a semi pushed out frost plug ...wouldn't that be nice....... ;)

They are not frost or freeze plugs. They are actually core plugs. They were designed to Hold the core in place for the water jackets during the casting process. That's all.

SEE: http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=192525

Since the boyfriend does not sound mechanical, check for other leaks unless you can see the crack.

PS: Have your daughter get a smarter boyfriend. She should be dating a guy that knows how to use his tools and hands.:eek::eek::eek:
 

ChasR

Cadet
Joined
Jun 19, 2008
Messages
15
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

Sorry to take so long to respond. I believe it's disrespectful to ask for advice and then ignore someone.
Update:
In defense of the boyfriend it was his business partner that said "Ill store the boat for you this winter" and he was the last to use it.
The marine mechanic proposed to replace the Mercruiser 5.7 liter with a 6.2 liter ??? and listed the engine cost at $9,078.00 and additional parts at $2,322.
We plan to pull the engine ourselves, I can handle a wrench, and I have an automechanic that will perform all work on the engine itself. He'll inspect the block for the source of the leak.
I am going to start searching for an engine once we determine the problem. The boyfriend doesn't want to go cheap and have problems in the future so buying from a reliable source in important. From my standpoint I want a replacement block that is exactly like the one we remove so we don't have problems fitting it all back together.
I'll write again once we have it out. Thanks for the info and help thus far.

Chas
 

Fisnfool

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
133
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

Actually it is a support that holds the core then the plugs are put in after casting is finished.

They are sold as freeze / frost plugs because that is what everybody calls them. You cast block will crack before ice would push out these plugs.
The slang term has become the common name.

Ki9nd of like a Kawasaki Doohiceky. It is actually tensioner device but the Doohiceky name stuck. http://www.digitalprovisions.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=DOOHICKEY+KIT&Category_Code=KLR+MOTOR&Store_Code=FARKLEMASTER

Ask anyone that ever had a cracked block. As ice forms in the block, it expands in the whole block cracking the block. An ice shaft may form and push out the plug but by then the block is already cracked.

Simple visual test. Take a plastic water bottle ad fill it completely to the top leave the top off.

Then freeze it. You will see ice force it's way out the top but all the water in the bottle will freeze and the bottle will expand. Same thing happens in the block but to expand, it has to crack.
 

intrepidvoyager

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Mar 24, 2009
Messages
216
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

OK OK ....guess we will have to disagree on this one ...... I have personaly seen a freeze plug pop out of a engine due to freezing with no block cracking issues so I am happy with the freeze plug designation.

I am not saying this will be the case of ChasR but it maybe. Better to check before pulling the engine ....stranger things have happened !!!

I agree with the following taking into account the 8% expansion factor and the number of plugs on both bottom sides of a 350 block., certainly more than required to cast the block.

The freeze plug operates to stop up a hole in the engine block which opens into the block's coolant channel. The objective of the freeze plug as opposed to a core plug is to protect the engine block, i.e., to keep the engine block from cracking, in the event the liquid coolant freezes in cold weather. Specifically, and when the system operates correctly, the freeze plug functions to pop out of the engine block's hole, instead of the engine block cracking, when the liquid coolant in the engine expands upon freezing. The freeze plug functions in this manner because the plug itself is design sized and fitted sufficiently into the engine block's hole so it takes less expansion pressure to pop the plug out than to crack the block. Note that the plug holes along the bottom of the block are larger and more numerous than would be required simply for casting purposes.

Regrettably this is not always the case ....Ya ...in my 40 years exp about 50% of the time the block IS cracked ...BUT 50% of the time its OK!!!

oh...of course your bottle in the freezer cracked ..it had no freeze plugs ..;)
 

Fisnfool

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
133
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

Sorry Intrepidvoyager. This is not a flame but you are way off.

I agree that a core plug may be forced out by freezing but that is not the design or intent of the plug.


Nice attempt at a engineering type explanation. True the bottle was a poor attempt at explaining it. Your are unfortunately wrong. I should have replied with the service bulletin. They are designed as core plugs. Sorry to have mislead you.

Even with your experience you misidentified their true purpose. That is why your example has a 50% failure rate. Proof again that a common slang term has defined the use of part and how it is sold and continues to be spread even though it is false information regularly accepted as true by the uniformed.:eek:

You are missing the main point. I did not make the original statement. The definition was made by the Mercruiser Engineers.

In fact my original comment earlier in the thread had a link to the sticky that includes a link to the service bulletin. This subject has been beat to death on this forum. That is why the sticky was posted. Too bad you skipped using the link I added to my original post. I am not trying to make you appear dumb or stupid. I would say that in the past 40 years you have remained uneducated as to the real purpose of the plugs. Now you know the truth and can help spread it. Welcome to the ranks of the core plug educated.

Please tell the rest of your associates the true purpose by printing the service bulletin. Even us old guys can always learn something new. And by explaining this to your customers, you may lose some work but they will save the cost thinking FREEZE PLUGS may save a block.

See the Service Bulletin at this link.
http://www.boatfix.com/merc/Bullet/87/87_14.pdf

Excerpt Quote from the Mercruiser Service Bulletin Number No. 87-14
Boldface is their designation:

Freeze Damage To
MerCruiser Engines


Freeze damage to MerCruiser engines is usually
identified as a horizontal crack that has one edge of
the crack pushed out slightly. A freeze crack in the cylinder
block usually happens just below the core plugs
or along the upper edge of the cylinder block just below
the cylinder head (Figure 1). V-6 and V-8 engines
can also crack below the intake manifold in the valley
area of the block (Figure 1). Exhaust manifolds and
exhaust elbows can also crack from freezing. Heat
exchangers, oil coolers, and transmission fluid coolers
that freeze can either crack a cooling tube internally
or push out the end caps.

All MerCruiser engines have the water drained out of
the seawater section of the cooling system in the factory
test cells upon completion of testing. This is done
to ensure that engines will not freeze during shipment
or storage.
Because of the precautions taken by Mercury Marine,
freeze damage to MerCruiser products is not a defect
in material or workmanship and will not be covered
by our warranty policy.

IMPORTANT: Core plugs, often called freeze
plugs, are not designed to pop out when a block
freezes. A core plug is installed to cover a casting
hole where sand was removed when the block
was cast. The block will normally crack before the
core plugs pop out.


I rest my case:D
 

Fishermark

Vice Admiral
Joined
Oct 19, 2003
Messages
5,617
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

The boyfriend doesn't want to go cheap and have problems in the future so buying from a reliable source in important.

Instead of rebuilt then, I would suggest buying new. You can get a brand new short block straight from GM for comparable money to a rebuilt. Like this one:


nal-12568758_w.jpg



(They have other models available - that is simply a quick search showing what is available - the engine pictured above is under $1,900 from here.


From my standpoint I want a replacement block that is exactly like the one we remove so we don't have problems fitting it all back together.


The good thing about Chevy 350 engines is that most of the parts are interchangeable between the various years -- Just make sure to buy the appropriate vintage to make sure the coupler, etc fits. (In other words - you have a one piece rear main, make sure you buy one with a one piece rear main). The new crate engines will even already have brass freeze plugs (or core plugs ;) ). If you buy an engine for a truck replacement, it will have essentially the same cam... or you can swap that out if you see fit.
 

intrepidvoyager

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Mar 24, 2009
Messages
216
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

Agreed Fishmark .....if chasR's block is toast .....better to buy new ...way better/cheaper than messing around with a rebuild and you know what you are getting ....just got a brand new 3.0 from Volvo for same price as a rebuild.

And re the freeze plug symantics issue......

OK .... here are some Mopar guys that know something about blocks ......

Everything you've ever wanted to know about blocks and more... Blocks are one of the most misunderstood aspects of building a big block Mopar engine. Never has there been more misinformation, propaganda and rumors floating around.

On the side of the block just above the freeze plugs, sometimes you will find a strengthening support or "rib" cast into the block. This was started in the 1969 model year on 440's (E 440 code on the ID pad), or approx mid '68 casting date. This is an improvement that was instituted around this time and lasted until the end of production. Every 400 block we have seen has this support, and NO 383 blocks we have seen have it, (Another small reason to build that 400 stroker...) Yes, blocks do occasionally crack around the freeze plug area, so it is considered desirable to find one that has this strengthening rib, however it is not a necessity, and certainly no reason not to use a nice 66-68 440 block you may find or have. As mentioned above, this rib has nothing to do with HP or non-HP. Notice also there is a slightly raised area in the center of the block, starting at the oil pan rail and leading up the skirt to the freeze plug area. The machined part of this (by the oil pan rail) was used to stamp the engines serial numbers. When an engine has the strengthening rib, it will usually have this pad as well. This explains why serial numbers were first used in this location in 1969. The only exception we have found is 70-71 383's... they will have the pad without the rib.

Notice what these guys call the plugs.

Also LOCK-N-STITCH Inc. a world leader in block repair technology calls them freeze plugs.

Nobody in their right mind is going to rely on these plugs popping to protect the engine in a freeze situation .....that is why Mercruiser et al belabor the point that they won't.

But that's not the point anyway ...... in the posted situation by ChasR ....... all I am saying is it is "POSSIBLE" that he has a freeze plug leak ...so why not check ????? ...If so maybe he will be part of the 50% that don't have a cracked block.

Also I had to laugh about the ......tell your customer part ...he he he ...... I don't have any customers ...well no paying ones anyway, he he he ..... i am just an old retired mechanical engineer who knows a bit about boats and engines. As for my associates ...well they are the ones that call me and ask me if I am busy next weekend cause they just bought two 6.2 GM diesels to replace the gas big blocks in their boat ...hummmm ...I wonder how a borg likes running in reverse under full power ....;)
 

Bondo

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Apr 17, 2002
Messages
71,082
Re: Mercruiser Engine Help

And re the freeze plug symantics issue......

Ayuh,... Sorta like calling the Refrigerator a Frigidare,...
Or the Copier machine a Zerox,....

Core plugs have been Called Freeze plugs since the 1st 1 popped out,+ saved some guys motor...
That don't make a Core plug a Freeze plug...

Btw,... Core plugs will only save a block if subjected to a light partial freeze, rather than a sub-freezing Freeze, lasting more than a few hours...
With a light freeze, the Core plug is pushed out,+ when it rewarms, the water runs out, Saving the block...
If it stays Cold,+ doesn't rewarm,... The Core plugs won't save a danm thing, she's Junk...
 
Top