Mercury 90 vs E-tec 90?

[JimS123]

I've been an Evinrude guy for 60+ years. Without counting, I think I have at least 40 of them hanging on my boathouse walls. Some go back as far as 1919. My classic boats all run 'Rudes.

Now, having said that, my 2 "daily drivers" run fuel injected 4-stroke Mercs. Although 30 years ago I wouldn't even hang a Merc on my transom, these days that's all I'll run.

Its Winter now, and all the boats are under cover and "sleeping". But when April comes around I am quite sure that when I dunk the boat and kiss the ignition key the Mercs will fire right up in a second,

The first current manufacture Merc I bought with some trepidation. The first time out, and after a 3 hour break-in cruise, we idled down to dock at a local restaurant for dinner. As I was approaching, I kicked her into neutral and thought.....OMG... this crappy new Merc just stalled on me. But...I could hear peeing and when I looked back and then down at the tach, she was still running. Maybe my hearing ain't so good any more, but these Mercs are really quiet.

My fuel economy is also awesome. Don't have an Etec to compare it to, but since I have 12 local Merc dealers and only 1 'Rude, I'll stick with my Mercs.

That's just my opinion. If your favorite dealer that you've been working with for 30 years only sells Bombardier, then maybe that is a better choice.

 

[jimmbo]

Service Accessibility is certainly an Important consideration. Where I am located their are several Merc and Evinrude Dealers with a splattering of Yammy and Suzuki.
While I am a 2 Stroke fan, Mercs newest V Blocks appear to have narrowed the Torque differences by quite a bit.
I liked the lumpy/uneven idle of the old 2 Stokes(4 strokes are as exciting to listen to as the Lawnmower) , and the sweet sweet smell of the burnt TCW Oil in their Exhaust.

 

[Captain Caveman]

But...I could hear peeing and when I looked back and then down at the tach, she was still running. Maybe my hearing ain't so good any more, but these Mercs are really quiet.

I would say that you should hear a Suzuki, but you wouldn't! I've got an '09 Suzuki 90hp, buddy has a '11 ETEC 115, and neighbor has a '12 Mercury 90hp. Both were cooing about how quiet their engines were. I pulled up and they asked me to start it up so we could compare. I smiled and said 'It's already running.'

All of these motors are good. My buddy loves his ETEC. You really are at the point where if you want to upgrade to a newer motor and have the $$ to do it, then go for it. All of the big manufacturers are pretty dialed in with quality products.

I've done all of the required maintenance on my 10yr old motor thus far. Oil, filter, plugs, impellers, grease....it's still not hard to do on the new motors.

 

[mrozborn]

I had a "just like new" Evinrude E-tech 25HP on my 14' boat. I replaced an older Merc 20HP. Worst thing I ever did, sure the E-tech ran smoother, quieter and better fuel economy. But it was in the shop being repaired for way too many things and I spent upwards of $1500. in 4 years plus lost vacation time. I didn't realize at the time of purchase that Evinrude is now owned by Bombardier, need I say more. Never again, reliability is more important than a few bucks saved on fuel. I now have a newer boat with a Yamaha and I'm loving it so far.

 

[QBhoy]

I think all things being equal with suitable props etc...the etec may well out perform that particular model of mercury 90. Etec seem to be well known for throwing out a little more than the badged HP

put that etec up against the most recent equivalent merc 4 stroke....not a chance.

if I was a little cheeky, I might say that of you were really thinking of changing the engine for another...on the average 18ft bow rider...I’d maybe want a little more than 90hp. Why not go larger if anything at all ?
just a thought.

 

[82rude]

I had a "just like new" Evinrude E-tech 25HP on my 14' boat. I replaced an older Merc 20HP. Worst thing I ever did, sure the E-tech ran smoother, quieter and better fuel economy. But it was in the shop being repaired for way too many things and I spent upwards of $1500. in 4 years plus lost vacation time. I didn't realize at the time of purchase that Evinrude is now owned by Bombardier, need I say more. Never again, reliability is more important than a few bucks saved on fuel. I now have a newer boat with a Yamaha and I'm loving it so far.

Ive see the exact opposite.Brand new 250 hp Yamaha totally destroyed ,brand new merc 4 stroke ,motor totally destroyed also.Failures can and will happen.Do I condemn all mercs and yammys now?NO.4 years ago no etecs in my neck of the woods.I had one and still do as I bought mine in another country.Point being now the 15 to 30?etecs are everywhere up north of me in the middle of nowhere.I bought mine in 2012 (2011 60 hp) and 8 years later it still runs flawlessly.We will see how long it lasts ,but my current plan is to use it at least another 10 to 15 years and by then I will be to old to use any motor due to age most likely.Sorry you had a lemon but that can happen to any mechanical object made.I absolutely love my etec and the only way id not have it would be bye the point of a gun,lol.Suzukis are great motors but rarer than t-rex,s here.Did you buy the new f25?I hear there a fantastic motor.

 

[JimS123]

In my neck of the woods there is only 1 E-Tec dealer, and he's a holdout after having sold Rudes since the 1940's. Now he carries Yamis too. Thus, Rudes now are few and far between.

I have no personal experience with them, but the people I talk to have more negatives to say than positives. The main complaint I hear is breakdowns causing replacement of parts.

 

[82rude]

Ask those same people how many of them use wing nuts on their batteries which is a big no no.The dealer where I bought mine (r and r marine ) sells merc and Evinrude .My best friend was looking for a used 60 etec and the dealer told him forget it they do not get traded in and we never see them after sale other than for typical mtc work..I feel a lot of the etec bad mouthing is urban myth and will never be gotten rid of.8th hand knowledge so to say.A hell of a lot of it is the major hang over from the early fitch disasters.After brp got erude the fitchs were way better and several examples are still happily running around here flawlessly.Merc seems to be king around here with etec building up .Yamaha has a dork for a dealer so not a ton of them though theres another new dealer now also so I expect to see more of them.Suz and tohatsu are as rare as a t rex.There has to be a regional thing in there also as when I was in Victoria b.c. in 2012 there was a million Suzuki and Yamaha,s .They were every where .The etec,s I did see were from Washington .Going back in time there were weird regional biases .Not really sure which way it was but I believe all us canucks where I live had Johnson's and my American friends all had Evinrude.Back in the early fifties to mid fifties Peterborough Ontario mfg more omc,s than anyother mfg in the world of any make.Last parts just trivia.

 

[Texasmark]

If the 90 merc is a Carbed Engine, there could be substantial Fuel Saving with the E-tec at speeds lower than WOT. My 150 FICHT burned less gas at Part throttle(30 mph) pushing a bigger boat(18 ft), than my inline 6 115 did on a 15 ft

Was your "tower" Direct Charged or not? I had one of the last ones built (bought new in '89) and it was real good on gas. No numbers, just recall, after having cross flow OMCS, it was much better on gas.

 

[jimmbo]

It was Direct Charged, which is still a Crossflow design. It even had the Power Ported Pistons. My 84 115(prop rated) was better on Gas than my 82 OMC 140(crank rated) and went faster too on the same boat.
My 98 FICHT was a DI Looper and when pushing the Bigger Boat at the same Top Speed the I6 could attain, it got better economy. When throttled back even more to where the I6 was getting it's best Economy, the FICHT was even better.

 

[QBhoy]

Not totally relevant to the original post, but whilst we are discussing such things. I’m going to put it out there with confidence....and say that the new mercury outboard range from about 2016 onwards...are just light years ahead of anything else on the market. 2 stroke or 4 stroke. That’s coming from a 2 stroke fan too !
There new manufacturing process and extreme high pressure casting process makes them about as light as an equivalent 2 stroke, but more incredible is that they are doing that whilst using a much larger displacement motor than the 2 stroke. Meaning they don’t suffer on torque like the usual 4 stroke. No timing belts to worry about either. Simply incredible. In particular, have read up on the 115hp 2.1l Command thrust motor. What a thing. I have one of these and I’m just stunned by its power and torque. It runs the bigger props too. Nothing comes close to it at all. Tests even show it outperforming a merc optimax 125hp in every way. Acceleration, efficiency and top end too. And that’s from an engine with 10hp less on the badge. Same boat, correctly propped in the test. Even the mercury techs on the day couldn’t explain it.
downside...the cost of them new.

 

[JimS123]

Not totally relevant to the original post, but whilst we are discussing such things. I’m going to put it out there with confidence....and say that the new mercury outboard range from about 2016 onwards...are just light years ahead of anything else on the market. 2 stroke or 4 stroke. That’s coming from a 2 stroke fan too !
There new manufacturing process and extreme high pressure casting process makes them about as light as an equivalent 2 stroke, but more incredible is that they are doing that whilst using a much larger displacement motor than the 2 stroke. Meaning they don’t suffer on torque like the usual 4 stroke. No timing belts to worry about either. Simply incredible. In particular, have read up on the 115hp 2.1l Command thrust motor. What a thing. I have one of these and I’m just stunned by its power and torque. It runs the bigger props too. Nothing comes close to it at all. Tests even show it outperforming a merc optimax 125hp in every way. Acceleration, efficiency and top end too. And that’s from an engine with 10hp less on the badge. Same boat, correctly propped in the test. Even the mercury techs on the day couldn’t explain it.
downside...the cost of them new.

I concur 100%.

My boathouse has a couple oldies that run classic 2-stroke Rudes. And even after as much as 67 years old, they still run strong and I love them all.

But up at the house, my 2 daily drivers each run two recent 4-stroke Mercs. Quiet, instant start, awesome hole shots and top ends and fuel economy that I never could have imagined.

I guess "you get what you pay for" ain't too far off...

 

[QBhoy]

I concur 100%.

My boathouse has a couple oldies that run classic 2-stroke Rudes. And even after as much as 67 years old, they still run strong and I love them all.

But up at the house, my 2 daily drivers each run two recent 4-stroke Mercs. Quiet, instant start, awesome hole shots and top ends and fuel economy that I never could have imagined.

I guess "you get what you pay for" ain't too far off...

Totally agree Jim.

Up until I got this boat with this engine fitted just before I got it (thankfully last owner took the hit on the cost of it), I have always been a 2 stroke and inboard V6/V8 VP and mercruiser Guy. Still own a mercruiser and V6 merc 2 stroke boat and love them....but honestly now. This new mercury 115 4 stroke is just decades ahead in terms of technology. No 2 ways about it. As for its power...it’s obviously not a rip snorting machine like the other two boats, but for 115hp on the badge...it makes my 19ft cuddy deep V get out the hole almost like any 135/150 2 stroke merc smoker might and certainly as good or better than any 115/125 smoker would. It powers all the way to 6000 rpm (and even sounds quite good over 3700 rpm) relentlessly. Manages to see just touching 44mph gps light with a 20” enertia. Just incredible for that engine and boat combo. Cruising at about 3500 rpm sweet spot it will do 1.6 miles per litre of fuel. About mid 20’s mph gps. Just unbearable really.
even servicing it is a pleasure. So cheap and merc have actually encouraged self service by making it so easy to do. Things like the wee oil drip tray below the oil filter That catches any spill and even has a drain on it. Amazing.

 

[Texasmark]

QBhoy.......If I were to compare a regular 115 to a 115 big foot, what would be the differences...pictures; max prop diameter?

 

[QBhoy]

QBhoy.......If I were to compare a regular 115 to a 115 big foot, what would be the differences...pictures; max prop diameter

Hi Texasmark

So as you will already know, the new command thrust is the equivalent of the old big foot really.

so more specifically with regards to my engine, I know that the gearcase is the same as the larger V6 sizes merc models, but has a lower ratio of 2.38-1. Big advantage is that this 115 is able to run the widely available big props like anything that would fit on the usual Alpha one or V6 traditional set up.

When I got the 2002 hull, it had a 2016 fitted Merc mariner 115 CT fitted and barely ran in. Didn’t know much about these new mercs to be honest but it was too good a deal not to go for. Since then, it’s just literally blown be away with how good it is.

it came with a 14.75x19” tempest plus (not totally sure about diameter but know it’s larger than normal 19”) and it managed to run the boat to about 40/41 mph GPs but on the limiter at 6150rpm.
I then got a 20” enertia for it (same fitting as the usual big gearcase) and it’s just incredible.

there is no way any other deep v 19ft cuddy should do 43/44mph GPs easily with only a 115 outboard. They are incredible machines. Big 2100 cc makes a difference.
have a YouTube at mercury 115 CT vs mercury 125 optimax. It will blow you away Texas mark.

 

[QBhoy]

QBhoy.......If I were to compare a regular 115 to a 115 big foot, what would be the differences...pictures; max prop diameter?

https://youtu.be/gej5dBiVEVo

 

[QBhoy]

QBhoy.......If I were to compare a regular 115 to a 115 big foot, what would be the differences...pictures; max prop diameter?

As for the pro XS version of this 115...just another level again. It performs like the old V6 merc 135-150 2 stroke. I especially don’t take that claim lightly. I’ve always been a 2 stroke guy and have a black max 150 on an old glastron CVX16.
I just can’t deny these days that merc 4 strokes have just got it spot on now. Nothing touches them. But they are extremely expensive perhaps.

I was out on a friends 6m cobra rib revently with a new merc V6 225 4 stroke. What a thing this machine was. As strong a pull off it as any big yamaha 225 V6 2 stroke I’ve been on. And that’s saying something.

 

[82rude]

Sorry guys I have to disagree.For pure torque ,grunt,muscle the etec wins hands down.Mercury compares its performance vs Yamaha because they know they cant match the pure grunt of the etec.Test after test has been done by Evinrude and independent testers that prove for a given size boat to preform the same as a four stroke from any mfg you can use a smaller sized hp etec.I defy anybody to come on my boat and smell smoke !Now don't get me wrong ,I like mercs and yamahas but don't try to fool yourself that you can match the grunt of an etec because you will lose every time, command thrust included.Erude has been using large gearcases for a long time now.My etec 60 can use props from the 13 tooth large gearcase erudes which goes up to 140 hp .Im using a omc sst prop which was repitched to 16p and no matter how much you load up that 16 footer and trust me ive had it severely loaded she will grunt,dig a hole in the water and off she goes with maybe 2 mph loss or so.Its 27 miles to camp by water and I might use 2 to 2 1/2 gallons to get there.Test after test also proves that etecs are cleaner burning than the 4 strokes!Up to 85 percent cleaner in some tests,and those are not erude tests either rather independent companies.Sorry about rambling on but I had to defend the honor of etec :joyous: To the op,s original question a much closer comparison would not be a 90 etec but a 75 vs the 90 merc.

 

[QBhoy]

Sorry guys I have to disagree.For pure torque ,grunt,muscle the etec wins hands down.Mercury compares its performance vs Yamaha because they know they cant match the pure grunt of the etec.Test after test has been done by Evinrude and independent testers that prove for a given size boat to preform the same as a four stroke from any mfg you can use a smaller sized hp etec.I defy anybody to come on my boat and smell smoke !Now don't get me wrong ,I like mercs and yamahas but don't try to fool yourself that you can match the grunt of an etec because you will lose every time, command thrust included.Erude has been using large gearcases for a long time now.My etec 60 can use props from the 13 tooth large gearcase erudes which goes up to 140 hp .Im using a omc sst prop which was repitched to 16p and no matter how much you load up that 16 footer and trust me ive had it severely loaded she will grunt,dig a hole in the water and off she goes with maybe 2 mph loss or so.Its 27 miles to camp by water and I might use 2 to 2 1/2 gallons to get there.Test after test also proves that etecs are cleaner burning than the 4 strokes!Up to 85 percent cleaner in some tests,and those are not erude tests either rather independent companies.Sorry about rambling on but I had to defend the honor of etec :joyous: To the op,s original question a much closer comparison would not be a 90 etec but a 75 vs the 90 merc.

Totally agree with you, all up until the new mercs of about 2016 onwards. Have a look. This 115 CT 2.1l I have would certainly rival any etec the same size and more. They outperformed a 125 optimax with 10 more HP in every department. Honestly have a look.

 

[82rude]

Sorry you cannot rival the torque of the etec .The etec produces power on every stroke vs a four stroke taking double the strokes.Thats why the etec are not bigger persay cc wise than the merc they don't need to be.Theres one telling test out there in youtube land which I cannot find where they took a 34 foot offshore boat and bolted a 150hp etec to it and right beside it a 200 or 250 Yamaha .Both were propped correctly .Boat was rated for 400 plus hp.the Yamaha could not even get it on plane .The etec did .Optimax isn't even in the same league as the etec,s .Ive looked at the command thrust specs and tests and sorry there not their yet other wise they would be touting their superiorty over etec but its not happening they keep hounding Yamaha instead .I suppose we will have to agree to disagree as were firmly entrenched in our camps,lol.All in all ive had 8 years of flawless performance so im a pretty happy camper .I use maybe a gallon of oil in 2 years and I boat a fair amount .My 60 sips it like its the most precious thing in the world.Everybody is proud of their new motor ,please enjoy yours and may she give you many happy years.It is kinda sad ,Evinrude went from producing more outboards than all other mfg,s combined in 1995 to a disaster with fitch and a super fund fiasco to brp bailing them out .Many people will never trust erude again which is a shame because they make damn good motors right in the States.They are a former shadow of themselves but at the very least BRP saved the Evinrude name from the dustbin of history.Id like to see them adapt the A.C.E. four stroke teck to outboards and bring back Johnson as the 4 poke arm of their brand.In the snowmobile world their 4 and 2 strokes survive nicely together.It gives the consumer a choice .