My Battery Questions

[LuvBoating]

Ok, we have a NAPA Starting battery that came with the boat when bought in April '09 and was bought new by the previous owner in Feb '09. The "First Mate" and I have discussed it and decided we want to get a new battery. The battery we got just doesn't seem to start the engine as quickly as we'd like it to, but want to keep the battery in a compartment next to the engine as a back-up. So, do we get a Dual Purpose one or a Deep Cell one? The main purpose of the new battery will be used to start the engine and perhaps run the CD Player, small Fish Finder/Sonar (when we use it), a small portable GPS and, when we do stay in the cuddy cabin, the cuddy "mood" lights (small lights around the inside of the cuddy and two reading lights. West Marine has a SeaVolt? Dual-Purpose AGM Deep Cycle 32Ah Group U-1 for $109 w/core, while Batteries Plus has a Extreme Dual Purpose for $85 w/core, plus $10 rebate. Have never bought a marine battery before so don't know how good Batteries Plus or West Marine is. The Marine Service Center we take our boat to sells Barracuda for $108 w/core. We live to far from Bass Pro to make their price good for us.
As far as installing a Battery Switch, will do that later. Battery Switch sounds great, as long as someone remembers to use it........right?
Recommendations, please!

 

[jmarty10]

Re: My Battery Questions

Dual Purpose. Its going to give you what you want. I just bought a dual purpose marine battery from Autozone for $90. It has a three year warranty. I will not purchase another battery from a marina due to them being the middle party on a warranty dispute.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: My Battery Questions

There are a number of things to look at when buying a battery. First -- what purpose must it fulfill. Since you have a spare (the current battery) as you've been advised, a dual purpose battery is fine for your needs. Next, technology tends to cloud people's mind about what they are buying. Hi Tech batteries (like the AGM) are great batteries. But are they worth the expense? In my view NO! Capacity is the key number in this debate. Why would you spend well over $100 to get the same or less capacity than a garden variety battery from your local auto store, farm store, or department store for $80. Batteries are sold by group size (22, 24, 27, 31, etc).. The bigger the number the larger the physical size. The larger the physical size GENERALLY the higher the capacity (stored energy) the battery has. Look at the label. The numbers you are insterested in are CCA/MCA (cold cranking amps/marine cranking amps). Bigger is better. You will also see numbers like RESERVE MINUTES xxx @ 23 amps. Again, bigger is better. I think you will find that the standard battery in most cases has the same or higher capacities than the high-tech varieties. Will the high-tech last longer?? Maybe -- maybe not. I would also suggest that for only $20 difference in price you are not comparing the same group size or capacity.

 

[BoatNoobie]

Re: My Battery Questions

You didn't state what motor you have. Big motors need bigger batteries. Higher CCA/MCA, the better.

That U-1 battery is not going to cut it. I think those are for small applications like jet skis, scooters and stuff like that.

Mininum you'll want at least a Group 24 sized battery. But without knowing what you have, best to go with a group 27.

I bought Cabela's AGM batteries. Have a group 24 for cranking/accessories, and group 27 for my trolling motor. Powers up my Merc 60 4-stroke with ease and leave the fish finders on all day without issue.

Bought on sale, so they were a good deal.


Things to think about.

How much power do you need? How much do you want to spend? Where will you buy it from? Assuming if the batteries fail within warranty time periodm Is the store local for an easy swap?

 

[jjacobs007]

Re: My Battery Questions

deep cycles rule!

 

[Boatist]

Re: My Battery Questions

It is far more important in how you care for your battery than brand or where you buy it.
I have got all my batteries from Costco, actually my deep cycle is from Price Club before they changed the name to Costco. My 1980 I/O boat has not had a battery last less than 6 years.

Most batteries do not die on their own, they are killed by their owners.
All lead acid batteries self discharge whether they are used or not.
When batteries are discharged damage is done. The longer they are left discharged the more damage is done. As the temperature climes they self discharge faster so in summer you charge your batteries once a month. In winter charge very other month.
After a trip fully charge your batteries as soon as possible.
Use your boat on the weekend and leave your batteries discharged until Friday night and you will be buying new battery every year and telling everyone how bad a battery it was.

Battery size is important. Starting batteries should not be discharged below 80 percent. Deep cycle should not be discharged below 50 percent.
So if you have a large electric trolling motor get a very large battery group 27 or 31. If you have a 1000 watt stereo same thing.
GPS/Fish Finder or VHF Marine radio in receive are very low draw and can run off the starting battery.

You need a way to fully charge your batteries in a very easy way.
Simple Automatic will fully charge with out over charging, but you have to clime in the boat and hook up to your batteries. I like charger at least 10 amps so even a deep discharge will fully charge in less than 24 hours.
On board chargers with a bank for every battery is more expensive but makes it easy to fully charge all your batteries without over charging and without claiming on board. You simply plug in the AC Power to an external plug.

You can buy batteries at 4 times the price but I do not believe they last any longer.

Costco and Wal-Mart have good prices. Costco Starting batteries have a 3 year free replacement and a 100 month pro rated warranty. If you buy a battery from Costco make sure you make a copy of the recite as they will fade out long before the warranty is up.

One thing that you will see is the same people have batteries troubles year after year and always blame the batteries.

 

[LuvBoating]

Re: My Battery Questions

Excellent info here!! Man are you RIGHT with this (in red below)! Just like taking care of a vehicle......oil change, rotate tires, change air filter, etc.......people complain how their vehicle is running/driving, but fail to do the above maintenance things when required.

It is far more important in how you care for your battery than brand or where you buy it.
I have got all my batteries from Costco, actually my deep cycle is from Price Club before they changed the name to Costco. My 1980 I/O boat has not had a battery last less than 6 years.

Most batteries do not die on their own, they are killed by their owners.
All lead acid batteries self discharge whether they are used or not.
When batteries are discharged damage is done. The longer they are left discharged the more damage is done. As the temperature climes they self discharge faster so in summer you charge your batteries once a month. In winter charge very other month.
After a trip fully charge your batteries as soon as possible.
Use your boat on the weekend and leave your batteries discharged until Friday night and you will be buying new battery every year and telling everyone how bad a battery it was.

Battery size is important. Starting batteries should not be discharged below 80 percent. Deep cycle should not be discharged below 50 percent.
So if you have a large electric trolling motor get a very large battery group 27 or 31. If you have a 1000 watt stereo same thing.
GPS/Fish Finder or VHF Marine radio in receive are very low draw and can run off the starting battery.

You need a way to fully charge your batteries in a very easy way.
Simple Automatic will fully charge with out over charging, but you have to clime in the boat and hook up to your batteries. I like charger at least 10 amps so even a deep discharge will fully charge in less than 24 hours.
On board chargers with a bank for every battery is more expensive but makes it easy to fully charge all your batteries without over charging and without claiming on board. You simply plug in the AC Power to an external plug.

You can buy batteries at 4 times the price but I do not believe they last any longer.

Costco and Wal-Mart have good prices. Costco Starting batteries have a 3 year free replacement and a 100 month pro rated warranty. If you buy a battery from Costco make sure you make a copy of the recite as they will fade out long before the warranty is up.

One thing that you will see is the same people have batteries troubles year after year and always blame the batteries.

 

[LuvBoating]

Re: My Battery Questions

How much battery is used when running something (CD, cuddy cabin lights) on ACC/ignition switch? Quess part of that question depends on length of time running, right?
As far as keeping the battery charged, doesn't it help to disconnect the battery cables when storing the boat before the next outting? We have a "trickle charger"........is that good enough to completely charge up a boat battery?

 

[Silvertip]

Re: My Battery Questions

Trickle chargers are just that. They typically have a 1.5 - 2 amp output and are designed to MAINTAIN a fully charged -- not to charge a battery that is partially or deeply discharged. Look at it this way. If the accessories you run with the engine off draw 10 amps (total of all) and you ran them for 6 hours you would have pulled 60 amps from the battery. Your 1.5 - 2 amp charger would need to be on for a minimum of 30 hours to replace that juice. A simple ON-OFF battery switch does serve the same purpose as disconnecting the positive battery cable during storage.. As for current draw, a CD player draws very little current unless it is also feeding a killer amp. How many cabin lights you have and what type they are and how long they are on determines how long they can be run without killing the battery. 1 amp each (incandescent bullbs) vs a few milliamps for LEDs.

 

[wifisher]

Re: My Battery Questions

How much battery is used when running something (CD, cuddy cabin lights) on ACC/ignition switch? Quess part of that question depends on length of time running, right?
As far as keeping the battery charged, doesn't it help to disconnect the battery cables when storing the boat before the next outting? We have a "trickle charger"........is that good enough to completely charge up a boat battery?

The load depends on what the accessory is. What kind of light, and how many, small portable cd, or stereo with large speakers, etc. For every 12 watts, it will draw 1 amp. You can use that to figure total amp draw and interpolate the battery life based on your RC of the battery. This will give you a rough estimate of when it will die, not a guarantee.

Dissconnecting the battery cables will make no difference unless there is some kind of a load on the boat. If everything is wired properly, and everything is turned off, leave the cables on, it just saves you time.

My opinion about trickle chargers is that they are a bad idea. Batteries do not like to be overcharged. Most trickle chargers will continue to charge all the time. I would just use the regular charger until it is full, then take it off and you are ready to go next time. If the boat sits unused for more than a month or two, check the charge again before you head out.

 

[LuvBoating]

Re: My Battery Questions

Ok, I done my homework/driving around......here is what I found:

Sears and Costco: only Deep Cell and Starting......no Dual Purpose
Batteries Plus: Xtreme Dual 810 Group 27 w/mca 685, cca 550, Ah 80 for $84 + tax + $10 mail-in rebate
West Marine: SeaVolt Dual 810, Group 27 w/mca 810, Ah80 for $154 + tax
Advanced Auto Parts: only Deep Cell and Starting......no Dual Purpose
Wal Mart: only Deep Cell and Starting.....no Dual Purpose
Auto Zone: DuraLast Dual Purpose Group 27, mca 1000, cca 800, Ah115, Res 180 $106 + tax
So, does Auto Zone look like the best?

 

[BoatNoobie]

Re: My Battery Questions

If Autozone is close, sure. See if they price match with their online price. It's only $100 on the website.

Also, i doubt it's 115Ah. Probably more like 90Ah. But it does have better stats than the other posted. 3 year warranty too. Dont know if it's replacement or prorated though.

 

[Boatist]

Re: My Battery Questions

I would never buy a Dual purpose battery they are just priced too high.
I have not seen an engine that would not start just fine off even a group 24 deep cycle battery. A group 27 has even more starting current.

I use a regular Auto starting battery. In my opinion if the battery is in the stern of the boat then you do not need marine starting or dual purpose battery. The stern does not have any more shock and vibration than the front of a car. The auto battery also has a much longer warranty and is a lot cheaper.

If the battery is up front to run the trolling motor then it should be a marine battery or put in in the back and spend the bucks to run the large cabels up to the front trolling motor.

As said above trickle chargers have no voltage regulation and will over charge if left on. Float chargers or battery maintainers will not over charge but a deep discharge on a group 27 battery might take over a week to recharge. While it discharged the lead acid battery will be being damaged.

Many will tell you slow charging is better for the battery. I do not believe that. My I/O has a 65 amp alternator that I charge my starting and deep cycle batteries with through a battery isolator. I have never had any battery problems. I put a plug on the front of the boat that also feeds my battery isolator and charges both batteries. This makes it real simple to charge batteries in the off season with out taking the cover off or climing on board. I also have a 12 volt line from my trucks 100 amp alternator that runs back to the trailer. So I can charge my boat batteries while driving down the road by just pluging the boat into the trailer 12 volts line. The line is 8 guage but about 30 feet long so probably good for 20 amps max by the time it gets to the back of the boat. I hardly ever use it but when night fishing for sturgeon with lights on till about midnight and just a short run back to the launch then I plug it in to charge battery up on our 1 hour trip home.

 

[LuvBoating]

Re: My Battery Questions

Stopped by the marine service center where we've taken our boat before. The head tech told me he doesn't care for/like dual purpose batteries and they don't sell them there. He told me not to use one in our boat. He knows the electrical stuff we have on our boat and suggests we just go with a Group 27 Starting battery. They handle the Barracuda brand and it's $118 and very powerful.....I read the specs on it. He said "you don't need anything else because you don't have enough amps going out of your electrical stuff when the engine is off to need a deep cell or dual purpose". He told me that keeping the Starting Battery we have right now as a back-up and buying another Starting battery should be just fine for our boat. He also told me that numerous service centers and boat owners have different ideas/likings about different types of batteries including the Dual ones and that's why it's all so confusing to a rookie marine battery buyer......ME!. And, he also told me to never by a boat battery from Wal Mart or an auto parts store. He said go with a marine service center or marine store for batteries, because they specialize in them.
All I can say is "here we go again.......a mixed up consumer just trying to get the right marine battery!" Sure looks like that Group 27 Starting Battery is the best now.

 

[wifisher]

Re: My Battery Questions

^^^always remember that when you are talking to a salesman, his product is the best in the world. The marine shops only sell marine batteries, as it is their trade. The batteries are still made by the same manufacturers. If you find a good battery for a good price, I wouldn't worry about who is collecting the final mark-up on it.

 

[LuvBoating]

Re: My Battery Questions

Wasn't talking with a salesman, he was a repair technician that I've talked to before. The Dual Purpose battery from AutoZone that I liked is a Group 27 for $106 plus tax. This tech said all we need is another Starting battery, of which he said their Barracuda Group 27 Starting Battery would be great.....and it's $118 plus tax ($10 core charge applies cause I'm keeping our battery). As already stated, this technician doesn't like Dual Purpose batteries for reasons he told me. He's worked on boats for over 20 years, so he knows a WHOLE LOT MORE than I do!

^^^always remember that when you are talking to a salesman, his product is the best in the world. The marine shops only sell marine batteries, as it is their trade. The batteries are still made by the same manufacturers. If you find a good battery for a good price, I wouldn't worry about who is collecting the final mark-up on it.

 

[wifisher]

Re: My Battery Questions

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that he is giving you bad advice, or trying to rip you off. Just saying that there is a very limited source for batteries. If you know and trust him, by all means, heed his advice, and buy his product. His price is pretty close anyway.

 

[bouttime007]

Re: My Battery Questions

^^^always remember that when you are talking to a salesman, his product is the best in the world. The marine shops only sell marine batteries, as it is their trade. The batteries are still made by the same manufacturers. If you find a good battery for a good price, I wouldn't worry about who is collecting the final mark-up on it.

I agree.

I bought my deep cycle everstart at Wally World and have absolutely no complaints what-so-ever for 5 years.

 

[BoatNoobie]

Re: My Battery Questions

Wasn't talking with a salesman, he was a repair technician that I've talked to before. The Dual Purpose battery from AutoZone that I liked is a Group 27 for $106 plus tax. This tech said all we need is another Starting battery, of which he said their Barracuda Group 27 Starting Battery would be great.....and it's $118 plus tax ($10 core charge applies cause I'm keeping our battery). As already stated, this technician doesn't like Dual Purpose batteries for reasons he told me. He's worked on boats for over 20 years, so he knows a WHOLE LOT MORE than I do!

Cant find any info on the Barracuda, so have no idea what the specs are.

By any chance, do you know what the specs are? Is it similiar to the Autozone, or less? What's the warranty on it?

 

[LuvBoating]

Re: My Battery Questions

Barracuda brand started (Trademark) Jan 2008 from Battery Dist. Southeast here in Jacksonville, FL. The battery is made by Deka. The Barracuda battery I was told to get is a Group 27 Starting, since we have very little accessories running after engine stops (basically CD Player and perhaps cuddy cabin "mood lights which are small LED type around part of the inside.....if and when we do spend the night in the cuddy). The AutoZone one is Dual Purpose Group 27, MCA 1000/CCA800/Ah115/Res180. The Barracuda has just as high CCA/MCA, but lower Ah and is $12 more in cost. Since the marine repair tech told us that we don't need all of that Ah, that is why we are considering the Barracuda one.

Cant find any info on the Barracuda, so have no idea what the specs are.

By any chance, do you know what the specs are? Is it similiar to the Autozone, or less? What's the warranty on it?