My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

[mscher]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

I work for a fuel prepossessing company, that does quite well, off water contaminated E10.

A common problem is when water leaks into underground gas station tanks and start absorbing in to the E10 ethanol blend. People get a fill up and soon their car does not run well - maybe not at all. A tow-in and time troubleshooting, reveals the problem and the customer is handed a nice bill. Two hundred cars may have contaminated fuel in them, before the water problem is discovered.

They often don't understand where it came from, (and the garage is no help) thinking it might just be condensation, so they just eat the costs themselves.

Pretty much the drill, as with every other ethanol fuel related problem.

Great for business, though

 

[DirtyOldBoat]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

I have one of those little 2 stroke generators that Harbor Freight sells. It's been full of mixed E10 (no stabilizer) since I moved my shop in August '11 and buried it in the corner. I just dug it out a few days ago and I thought for sure I'd have to clean the carb out from that evil ethanol. That thing fired up on the second pull (!) and ran without a hickup for about 5 hours with a 500w halogen light for a load.

 

[bigdee]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

I have one of those little 2 stroke generators that Harbor Freight sells. It's been full of mixed E10 (no stabilizer) since I moved my shop in August '11 and buried it in the corner. I just dug it out a few days ago and I thought for sure I'd have to clean the carb out from that evil ethanol. That thing fired up on the second pull (!) and ran without a hickup for about 5 hours with a 500w halogen light for a load.

Pre-mixed 2 cycle oil is not affected by ethanol because it is stabilized by the oil. That is why you never need to add Sta-Bil to 2 stroke equipment.

 

[hblair]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

I have three 2 stroke dirt bikes (01 rm250, 01 yz250, 01 KTM 380exc), we can't leave them parked in the garage for more than three weeks without cranking them if they have ethanol gas in them. The carbs have to be pulled, main and pilot jets blown out, put back together. Yeah, I guess I can get used to it, but I really don't want to drain the carbs every time we put the bikes up. As far as the oil in a 2 stroke serving as stabilizer, it is a fact that castor 927 does not.

 

[Jim Hawkins]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

I, personally, am very fond of alcohol and would think it mean to deprive my boat of the same pleasure.

Moderation.

 

[oldjeep]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

I, personally, am very fond of alcohol and would think it mean to deprive my boat of the same pleasure.

Moderation.

Golf clap

 

[oldjeep]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

I have three 2 stroke dirt bikes (01 rm250, 01 yz250, 01 KTM 380exc), we can't leave them parked in the garage for more than three weeks without cranking them if they have ethanol gas in them. The carbs have to be pulled, main and pilot jets blown out, put back together. Yeah, I guess I can get used to it, but I really don't want to drain the carbs every time we put the bikes up. As far as the oil in a 2 stroke serving as stabilizer, it is a fact that castor 927 does not.

There is some serious crap build up in your fuel lines if that is the case. If you are running pure gas and E10 interchangeably then how have you got the carbs adjusted?

 

[ondarvr]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

While there is a difference in how E-10 and E-0 will run in a two stroke, these bikes typically come jetted slightly rich, and even if they aren't, unless you're racing profesionally you may not notice much of a difference, other than possibly slightly less power when using E-10.

My bikes have set for a year or more with e-10 and can be started rather easily. I do have one that has sat for about 8 years with non stabilzed fuel, at two years it still started, at four years it started but the low speed jet was plugged, haven't tried since then but I don't expect it to start now.

 

[hblair]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

There is some serious crap build up in your fuel lines if that is the case. If you are running pure gas and E10 interchangeably then how have you got the carbs adjusted?

No, no build up in the lines. Ethanol gas and small engines don't like each other. The carbs are set up right. They are jetted right. Never foul plugs, run strong, even idle reliably. Ethanol gas has clogged the pilot and/or main jet in as short as 3 weeks and will every time if left for more than 5 weeks. Believe it. These bikes are kept inside in controlled temp. This has happened like four separate occasions. (My teenage boys are supposed to be helping me look after them, but that usually doesn't go as planned)

 

[hblair]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

While there is a difference in how E-10 and E-0 will run in a two stroke, these bikes typically come jetted slightly rich, and even if they aren't, unless you're racing profesionally you may not notice much of a difference, other than possibly slightly less power when using E-10.

My bikes have set for a year or more with e-10 and can be started rather easily. I do have one that has sat for about 8 years with non stabilzed fuel, at two years it still started, at four years it started but the low speed jet was plugged, haven't tried since then but I don't expect it to start now.

Yeah that'd be nice. I wish mine could sit that long without problems. These are three different bikes, different carbs, 2 different gas suppliers, one was exxon 93 octane down the street.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

Next time try this.

Before you try to start it grab one of the vent lines on the carb and blow into it rather hard for a few seconds, then give it a kick.

 

[DirtyOldBoat]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

Ethanol gas has clogged the pilot and/or main jet in as short as 3 weeks and will every time if left for more than 5 weeks.

Sorry, but ethanol doesn't clog things. It's a liquid and it stays a liquid. If your jets truely are clogged then something else is causing it. As stated before the ethanol might be cleaning out other gunk that could clog it. Or it could be old gas. (much older than 3 weeks though) It's not the corn juice. Ethanol alone cannot clog anything.

 

[hblair]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

Sorry, but ethanol doesn't clog things. It's a liquid and it stays a liquid. If your jets truely are clogged then something else is causing it. As stated before the ethanol might be cleaning out other gunk that could clog it. Or it could be old gas. (much older than 3 weeks though) It's not the corn juice. Ethanol alone cannot clog anything.

My whole point here is to share whats happened to me. Whether ethanol clogs or causes clogs is not my point. The fact is our pilots and someyimes main jets are clogged in a short period of time. Our bowls are clean. This didn't happen with non ethanol gas.

 

[bigdee]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

Sorry, but ethanol doesn't clog things. It's a liquid and it stays a liquid. If your jets truely are clogged then something else is causing it. As stated before the ethanol might be cleaning out other gunk that could clog it. Or it could be old gas. (much older than 3 weeks though) It's not the corn juice. Ethanol alone cannot clog anything.

Ethanol is corrosive and when mixed with certain blends of gas it has been proven to clog jets: Ethanol Free Fuel - Another Warning MTBE and Ethanol

 

[oldjeep]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

Ethanol is corrosive and when mixed with certain blends of gas it has been proven to clog jets: Ethanol Free Fuel - Another Warning MTBE and Ethanol

Hasn't MTBE been banned for years?

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

Hasn't MTBE been banned for years?

Exactly. Just people looking for ways to blame ethanol for the same old fuel problems that have existed for YEARS. Neglect and improper maintenance.

 

[hblair]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

Exactly. Just people looking for ways to blame ethanol for the same old fuel problems that have existed for YEARS. Neglect and improper maintenance.

If by "improper maintenance" you mean I didn't drain all my carb bowls for a 4 week storage with ethanol, then yes, you are correct. Otherwise you are wrong.

I'm not here to argue, I don't care either way. I'm all for corn fuel if it works. I'm against it if it doesn't. I'm not a dummy. I've been around gasoline engines all my life. Here's our shop.. Blair Auto Body - Home. Here's the bikes I'm talking about...

The tanks are clean as they can be, fuel lines are clean. The one thing I've learned in the auto collision business is you can never say never. Just because you haven't experienced or seen something yourself doesn't mean it isn't true. You guys who are saying "never" might want to retract that.

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

Who's saying "never?" We are saying that there is another (possibly simple) explanation. And the proper maintenance for ethanol fuel storage is to drain tanks and carbs, yes even for just 4 weeks. So we are back to "improper maintenance". It isn't fair, I know, but that's what is required. I have nothing to retract, sir.

 

[oldjeep]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

Who's saying "never?" We are saying that there is another (possibly simple) explanation. And the proper maintenance for ethanol fuel storage is to drain tanks and carbs, yes even for just 4 weeks. So we are back to "improper maintenance". It isn't fair, I know, but that's what is required. I have nothing to retract, sir.

I've never heard of anyone draining tanks and carbs for a months worth of storage. Hell we let the sleds sit for 7 months with fuel in the tank - I usually run the carbs dry.

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: My Ethanol Experience.....yes here we go again, but it happened to me

Okay, I hear you oldjeep. But Mr. Blair says that after 4 weeks his cycles are gunked up. So it's not his fault, apparently, but ethanol's fault. And you are saying you have no such problems? If both are true, (and I believe you both) then why such a difference? It would seem that in Mr. Blair's case, proper maintenance would be to drain. In your case, not so much.