My new Garmin FF is clicking!

[waterinthefuel]

Ok, so I hear ranting and raving about not getting a Humminbird. I swung by the local shop and pick up a brand new Garmin 240 Blue FF, and got the temp-sensing transducer with it. Within 24 hours of purchase I'm installing it on my boat at the lake. <br /><br />I turn it on and hear this rapid "click" noise. I try to figure out where it's coming from and it's from the transducer! I can hear it clicking!!! It drives me up the walls!! It sounds like someone tapping a toothpick on a table. I know its the transducer because when I turn off the unit, the clicking stops. If I adjust the scroll speed of the display, the rate of the clicking changes with the scroll speed.<br /><br />Tell me this isn't normal, and if it is, how come it does this? I've never heard a transducer click before!<br /><br />

 

[NOSLEEP]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

They all click now. You shouldn't be able to hear <br />it when it is fully submerged.

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

I hear it the entire time I'm out on the water.

 

[SingleShot]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

I have the standard 240 and I can't hear anything, I wonder if it's because of the dual frequency xducer.<br /><br />SingleShot

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

Singleshot, you hit on something. If I set it to just one of the frequencies (I can't remember which one) I don't hear it. I think its the 50khz that I hear. If I have it set to either 50khz or dual, I can hear that irritating clicking noise.

 

[Boatist]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

What the transducer does is send out sound signals then wait for the echo and send out another one. Yes the rate will change with the chart speed. Mine I can here if I am near the back of the boat in the water. I can also feel it if I put my foot under it.<br /><br />The 50 Khz is at a frequency close to the humman hearing range. For me worked in too many Computer rooms for too many years to here something that high unless I right next to it. <br /><br />Did you do a shoot thru hull or a transom mount.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

Human hearing is estimated at 20Hz – 20kHz. That is for health males, 17-19-years of age, pre-Walkman era. You should not be able to hear the ‘ping’ of a 50kHz transducer. Dogs can’t hear much above 45kHz. What you are hearing may be coming from the transducer but it is something besides the ping. (It is possible for the freq to be altered by the substrates it penetrates…but enough to be audible?)<br /><br />You may want to contact Garmin, and definitely Airmar, to find out what is going on. If you do, please let us know what they say. I’m really curious about this, in particular because so many companies use Airmar products made with similar ceramic elements. Why would Garmin’s use of the Airmar elements be audible, but not other’s use of the same internal elements?

 

[NOSLEEP]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

Does it not have something to do with the signal,<br />amount of power the transducer is sending.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

I have no idea. I suggest you contact Airmar, and maybe Garmin, too. I would be asking “why is my transducer audible and others are not?”<br /><br />Fwiw, Airmar makes ceramic transducer elements that need to fit into a wide spectrum of applications. They are not optimized for any one make/model/or manufacturer.

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

I did a transom mount. I haven't stuck my foot under because the water is 50 degrees and that's too cold for me and my 24 year old foot. <br /><br />I will contact Garmin and ask what is going on with it. The problem is, I'm not going to accept a new one. This one is so beautifully installed and sealed, no way am I willing to undo the hours of work I did making the installation neat and clean.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

WIF – is this a brand new unit? … new install? Or have you had a chance to use the sounder prior to the clicking?<br /><br />As for your 24-year old foot, I feel for you, man. In northern California we get our warm water in the winter and cooler water in the summer. The difference in temp between the two is 2-degF, averaging 52-degF year round.

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

18rabbit, it is a brand new unit. I didn't get a chance to use it prior to dropping the boat in the water. Well more accurately, I didn't think of doing it. I only turned it on briefly to ensure that my connections were holding up.

 

[havinfun]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

I have the 240 red, I can clearly hear it clicking<br />transome mounted submerged.

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

Having fun, hot damm I'm not nuts!! You can hear it clicking can't you?!?!?!!??!

 

[wilde1j]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

waterinthefuel, metal boat and transom mount xducer? If you have a decent power DF, the 50 kHz should be clearly audible in air (i.e. boat on trailer). I can hear my 600 w Eagle Z9500 easily out of the water. However, I have a heavy fiberglass boat and can't hear it at all when the boat is in the water.

 

[DJ]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

I could hear all of the Eagles I have owned. Especially on the trailer when I forgot to turn it off. <br /><br />They were much more audible on the aluminum boats, while in the water, than on glass boats. It think the aluminum may have much different acoustics.

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

Wildeone my boat is fiberglass. In fact, my transom is solid fiberglass. My boat is not metal.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

Fwiw, you cannot hear the 50kHz signal from your transducer. If you have “perfect” human hearing, you can hear as low as 20Hz, to as high as 20kHz. Some (not all) dogs can hear as high as 45kHz. They can’t here the signal either. They can hear a ‘silent whistle’ at 25kHz, but you can’t.<br /><br />What you are hearing is either an arc from a bad solder connection inside the transducer (maybe); the slapping of an electrode against the Piezoceramic element from a sloppy build (likely); or the sound of the element crashing into the encapsulating material if too high a voltage is applied across the electrodes (not likely) or if there was not enough resistance on the acoustic window (very likely). Whatever it is, it is not the sound of the sonar frequency…unless…just maybe…you are secretly Superman…then you can hear anything…but you’re not because you have a fishfinder and Superman doesn’t need one because he also has X-ray vision and he can see the fish without a fishfinder… <br /><br />In any event, Airmar transducers are designed to function with the resistance of water against the ‘acoustic window’…that would be on the bottom of a properly installed transducer. Operating the transducer without that resistance is damaging it. The more you ping the pavement, the more damage you are doing…until it fails altogether. I am aware some manufactures suggest operating the transducer for a few seconds to test the function but you are doing so at the risk of damaging the transducer. Airmar claims a single, 60-second ‘no damage’ dry runtime on their products, but I am skeptical.

 

[Franki]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

18 rabbit, <br /><br />I have been able to hear nearly all the transducers I have been around over the years, even my old hummingbird which only works in a very narrow band of speed/level is audiable if I put my head near the transom of my boat..<br /><br />They can't all be faulty, especially since they were generally all working... (my HB is the exception as it shows all the signs of "working" but it really isn't.) <br /><br />I just figured that although the 50k freq was what resulted in the correct reflection used by the DF, it was probably not the only frequency produced by the unit during a ping...<br /><br />(obviously a human can't hear 50khz but I've never seen a manufacturer claim that their transducer produced only that exact frequency in its pinging.)<br /><br />Thanks for the tip on dry usage though.. i wasn't aware of that and it says nothing about it in my HB manual. thankfully, I've never run it out of water other then to test the unit has power for a few secs.<br /><br />regards<br /><br />Franki

 

[18rabbit]

Re: My new Garmin FF is clicking!

Franki- the transducer’s frequency and transmission beam size are a function of the ceramic element’s size and wall thickness. After the ceramic is molded, it is machined to spec. Basically, they are tuned. The variance from transmit to receive is only a couple of kHz.<br /><br />Airmar mass produces transducers for recreational use. They are not exactly on the cutting edge of anything. Since the same 50/200kHz (dual frequency) element is used to support all the manufacturers that spec a single-element transducer, how come you can hear some, but not all of them?