Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

[squale]

I just got a 2004 Caravelle 22' Deckboat (the only deckboat they make). It has a depthfinder, but I wanted to get a good fishfinder with a nice screen, and with built in gps. It's important that what I get has good maps, etc. for fresh water lakes and oceans. I keep the boat on a lake and that's mainly where I will use it.<br /><br />I see there are different brands out there like Hummingbird, Garmin, etc. but I don't know what's the best to go with. I know that Garmin is the BEST (in my opinion) for GPS units.. but I don't know about fishfinders, etc. So I have some questions..<br /><br />1.) Who is the biggest manufacturer of Fishfinders?<br /><br />2.) Who do you think makes the BEST fishfinders?<br /><br />3.) What is the difference between a chartplotter, fishfinder and a sounder? I just see some units advertised as sounders and some as chartplotters and others as just fishfinders, but I don't know the differences?<br /><br />4.) How hard are these to install on your boat? where do you have to mount the sensor on the bottom of the hull? and do you need to drill any holes, etc.. or does the sensor just "stick" to the bottom of the boat?<br /><br />5.) BTW, do you know by chance who makes the depth-finder that is built into the dash of my boat? is the depth finder taking the reading from the bottom of the back of the hull or from the bottem of the propellor?<br /><br />Thanks guys..

 

[JB]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

Hi, NTBM.<br /><br />My first suggestion is to get your post in the correct Forum. I will move this to Electronics for you.<br /><br />I have had best results with Lowrance sonars and with Garmin GPS.<br /><br />If I was to get a combo unit I would probably go with Garmin. Check out the Mega Mall for the various models.<br /><br />Good luck.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

NewBoatingDude - It will be helpful if you tell us more about what your expectations are, how you want to use the electronics, and the budget you want to work within.

 

[squale]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

okay, up to 1K dollars, and I want to be able to find fish, mark my fishing spots via gps, see the depth and temp of the water, be able to see what the structure of the bottom of the lake/bay/ocean looks like. Find underwater wrecks, fishing holes, etc. I want a nice color display that can be read fine in direct sunlight. Something that has a wide angle to see a lot of area below the boat, and something powerful enough to go 100+ ft deep in the water. Little other things like alarms, alerts, etc are nice but not a must.<br /><br />I keep seeing the major brands as Lowrance, Eagle, Hummingbird, and Garmin. Looking at them all, Eagle and Hummingbird mostly all seem black and white, the Lorances are okay looking. The Garmins from what I can tell have the nicest displays and I know the Garmin GPS is second to none, but I just don't know much about Garmin fishfinder and Sonar quality versus the competition. I know that the other brands have been around longer so I don't know if that makes a real difference or not. Mapping is also very important to me because I want a unit that can act like a chartplotter AND a fishfinder. So obviously the map software is going to make a difference in how good the details and readability of the maps are. Again, I don't know who the best company to go with is..<br /><br />It just SEEMS to me at this point, something like the Garmin 178C (which should start shipping this month) has more features than the rest, has great mapping and nice color graphics. But again, I am new to this neck of the woods so I don't know how a unit like the 178c compares against some other units. I also don't know if I need Single frequency or dual frequency. I will most likely be in lakes all the time fishing, but would like to be able to take the boat to bays and oceans to fish occasionally too. I just don't know if there is an advantage/disadvantage to getting a dual frequency versus a single. Like for instance, does a Dual frequency do everything the single frequency does PLUS more? or is the accuracy/scanning area not as good on a dual frequency as it is on a single frequency? what do most of the big commericial fishing boats use for fishfinders/gps/chartplotters?

 

[JB]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

Sounds to me like a Garmin 188C, plus Mapsource Fishing Hotspots CD and necessary interfaces to download maps to Garmin cartridges. <br /><br /> http://www.iboats.com/mall/index.cgi?keywords=electronic>chart% <br /><br />Good luck.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

Funny you should mention the Garmin 188C. Last month’s Powerboat Reports (March 2004) evaluated it compared to the Dynamic Duo, Si-Tex’s two-unit system (ColorMax 6 Plotter/GPS and CVS-106L fishfinder). Price difference: $20. Here’s the bottom line:<br /><br /> In our opinion, performance differences are minimal. The garmin does this a little better, the Si-Tex does that a little better. The real question: Do you have enough console space to install two large screens-and do you need them? If you answered yes to both questions, you’re probably a serious fisherman with a large console and we’d suggest the Dynamic Duo. The pair is our top pick for those needing a dedicated sounder. If you don’t have the space or just aren’t that serious about fishing, then stick with the Garmin. It’s a good machine. <br /><br />I would never recommend a sounder and plotting combined in a unit with a single 4” screen like the Garmin has...and forget about split screen of the functions. Either use it as a plotter or a ff, not both. Each Si-Tex unit has it’s own 4-½ inch screen…better, but not by much. The plotter screen is horizontal and the sounder screen is vertical…the way they should be, IMO. For a differnce of $20 this is not a hard decision...although Si-Tex is not the only option available for deciated units.

 

[Boatist]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

NewBoatMan<br />I recommend Lowrance Web sites below as a good starting point. There is one for sonar/fishfinders, one for GPS/Chartploter, and a link to product emulators you can download to your PC and try at home and see what everything does.<br /><br />Sonar/fishfinder are the same thing. There are many types but today you will want a LCD screen as big as you can afford. Color does not give you any more information but it does make it much eaiser to see. Mono units OK if you are right in front of the unit, get off to one side or stand up and hard to see. Color can see from any angle or even from the back of the boat. These units will send out a sound signal from the transducer usually mounted to the back of the boat. Then they wait for the sound echo to come back and plot on the right most row of dots every thing that returns a signal. Next it moves that row of dots one row left and repeats the process to fill in the right most row again. So the right most row of dots is what is under the boat, every thing left of that is history of what was under the boat before.<br />Standard Cone angle of 200Khz units is 20 degrees, that means in 30 feet of water you will see a 10 circle on the bottom. Half way down you will see a 5 foot circle. The 200 khz unit will do a better job at seeing small fish as several fish instead of a bigger mark. The 200Khz unit best in fresh water and shallow salt water. For deep saltwater (200 feet and deeper) 50 khz works better. The standard cone angle for 50 khz is 37 to 45 degrees, so in 30 feet of water see about a 20 foot circle.<br /><br />For fresh water down to 200 feet I like Lowrance best mainly due to the way they change depth scale with no jumps. For deep saltwater no body better than Furuno. Garmin still pretty new but many seem to like them also.<br /><br />Dual Frequency unit are the way to go if you really are going to fish Fresh and Saltwater. When you get out to water 300 feet or more you need at least 500 watts RMS power or 4000 watts peak to peak.<br /><br />GPS/Chartploters, A chartploter is a GPS that diaplays your boat position on a electronic chart. A nonchart ploter GPS would display your position as latitude and lognitude numbers and give you heading information to another point in your route. Chartploters will also give you heading numbers and your Lat/long position.<br />Picking a Chartplotter is very hard. Lowrance I think give you the best base map with Buoys and navagation aids. Garmin base map on units I have seen do not give you any Nav aids and buoys unless you buy the extra cost detailed charts. What make it hard to pick a unit is the extra cost charts. Inland lakes most charts do not cover or if they do they only cover the bigger lakes. All the extra cost charts cover ocean water but some have more detail than others. One brand may be better in one area and not as good in another.<br /><br />All I can say is go to a large dealer like West Marine and compare units. Zoom in on lakes you like to go to and see what detail it comes with. Ask them to demo the chart for that area and compare the different brands. If saleman says they are all the same then go somewhere else because they are not. Many inland lakes have very poor charts or no chart. When you find what works best for you get the price and check here on IBOAT they have very good prices. For me if the salemans treats me right and they do price matching I will buy from them. If they don't want to help then I would buy here unless find a much better price somewhere else. <br /><br />One thing I would Question is a deck boat in the ocean. In over 40 years of fishing I have never seen a deck boat offshore. Actually seen very few even in San Francisco bay. I do not think it would be safe in even light swells. Other may have a different opinion.<br /><br />If you have the room and the money get seperate fishfinder and chartploter. If get a combo unit get a big one.<br /><br />Good luck and report back what you find.<br /><br /> http://www.lowrance.com/Tutorials/Sonar/sonar_tutorial_01.asp <br /> http://www.lowrance.com/Tutorials/GPS/gps_tutorial_01.asp <br /> http://www.lowrance.com/Software/PCSoftware/demos.asp

 

[squale]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

yeah I doubt I will ever be in 200ft or more of water with the boat, so are you saying I should just get a single frequency 200mhz tranducer? like in say 50ft of water, what is better, a single or a dual tranducer? in your example you said in 30ft of water, I 200mhz single will give you a 20 degree cone so you will see 10 feet of the bottom of the lake. Now in the same 30 foot of water with a dual tranducer that has a bigger cone, say 45 degrees, you said I will see about 20ft of the bottom. Now to me, I think it would be more beneficial to see more of the bottom and a bigger cone angle? what do you think?<br /><br />I just don't understand why people even go with a single tranducer with a smaller cone size if they can just get the dual transducer with a bigger cone angle? like why wouldn't you want a bigger angle.. I don't understand?

 

[squale]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

Okay, I think I pretty much narrowed it down to the following units... what do you guys think is the best one to go with for the money..<br /><br />1.) Garmin GPSMAP 178C (http://www.garmin.com/products/gpsmap178c/)<br />$1000<br /><br />2.) Lowrance LCX-18C (http://www.lowrance.com/marine/Products/LCX-18C.asp) $1000<br /><br />3.) Lowrance LMS-330C (http://www.lowrance.com/marine/Products/LMS-330C.asp)<br />$650

 

[JB]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

While the Lowrance unit's GPS hardware performs very well, I don't think their accessory software is nearly as good as Garmin's Mapsource, NTBM.<br /><br />On the other side of the coin, Lowrance's "Skimmer" transducer is the best in the business for sonar.<br /><br />I'd still go with the Garmin.

 

[squale]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

I am going to be using this on Lake Hopatcong in New Jersey, will I NEED the Fishing Hotspots and Recreational Lakes CD-Rom or can I just get the pre-programmed Data card? the preprogrammed data card ONLY comes with Fishing Hot spots... and NOT recreational lakes. But I am not sure that it matters for me, because I think that Lake Hopatcong is listed under Fishing Hot spots and NOT recreational lakes? is this true?<br /><br />can somebody verify this for me?<br /><br />how do you feel the Garmin mapping is compared to the Navionics mapping, etc?

 

[JB]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

For salt water I would consider the Navionics maps, but for inland and fresh water I think the Mapsource maps are superior.<br /><br />If you get the Fishing Hotspots on the cartridge you wont need the CD and you wont need the Rec. Lakes.<br /><br />I use my GPSMAP 162 in my truck as well as my boat so I have several of the Mapsource CDs so I have street and route detail when traveling as well as Hotspot quality maps when fishing.<br /><br />If you consider that application as well as the boat, I highly recommend the US Roads and Recreation CD or cartridge.

 

[squale]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

well explain to me how I can use it in the boat and car with built in fishfinder..<br /><br />by the way, does your unit have auto-routing?

 

[JB]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

Hahaha. <br /><br />I was referring to using the GPS only. I simply unplug it from the boat, take it out of the mount and reinstall it in the truck with the 12V adapter. To do the same with the 178C would require unplugging the transducer cable and maybe plugging a dummy load into the unit.<br /><br />No autorouting. That requires a Streetpilot, which would not be very useful in the boat, and Streetpilots are not available with the 5" screen.

 

[Boatist]

Re: Need a good FISHFINDER with GPS.. any suggestions?

NewBoatMan<br />Cone angle, 20 degree 200 Khz or 45 degrees 50 Khz?<br />It not as simple as you think. To start with a 200Kkz frequency will seperate fish better. A fish laying on the bottom will be easier to detect. Several fish close together will look like several fish. <br />The 50 khz transducer the fish on the bottom will likely look like the bottom. Several fish close together may look like one big blob.<br /><br />Will you see more fish with a 20 or 45 degree transducer? This kind of depends on the type of bottom you are fishing. I will try to explain and see if I can find a picture to help. Big flat bottom with out any big rocks, cayons, troffs, hills, cuts then the 50Khz should see more fish with the 45 degree transducer. Schools of fish may look like a big blob instead of 10 indivial fish. You will see more bottom. However if it is rough bottom you may see less fish. Lets say there is a big 10 foot high rock in your cone angle and along side this rock there are 4 big bass also in your cone angle. You will not be able to see these 4 big bass. When you send out a ping you are only filling in the right most row of pixels on your screen. So when your ping hits this rock everything from the top of the rock down is going to be filled in as black. Since the fish are below the top of the rock and they do return a echo but the pixel is already filled in as black so you have no idea the fish are there. With a 20 degree transducer the rock is not in the cone angle so you will be able to see the 4 big bass. I hope this makes since.<br /><br /> http://www.vexilar.com/help/tips/tip006.html <br /><br />Dual or single, Lowrance's dual frequency transducer the 200 khz is 12 degrees and the 50 khz is 36 degrees and 1000 watts RMS power.<br />Lowrance single frequency 200Khz transducer is 20 degrees and 375 watts RMS power.<br /><br />Garmin's dual frequency is 200khz 15 degree and the 50 khz is 45 degrees both have 500 watts RMS power.<br />Single 200 khz is 20 degrees and 400 watts RMS power.<br /><br />Lowrance X18C has the biggest screen 6 inches but the lowest resolution with just 240 vertical pixels. In the mapping mode I like Lowrance's colors much better than Garmin. Lowrance can use mapcreate, navionics, freedom maps, classic, and hotmaps for the detailed maps. Unit has 1000 waypoints.<br /><br />Garmin 178C has the smallest screen 4 1/2 inches but has 320 vertical pixels. For mapping mode I think the colors they use are not bright enough. For detail maps it can use mapsource or blue charts. Unit has 3000 waypoints.<br /><br />Lowrance LMS 320 screen size 5 inches and 320 vertical pixels. Can use same maps as X18C. Does not come with a speed sensor. 1000 Waypoints.<br /><br />If you go to a store that has both check the mapping colors and the map detail for where you will use the most before you make your decision.