Need help determining year of motor

[Jeb1971]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Well,
I think I have the final analysis. Given that the carbs that are on the motor were listed for only the 150 and 235 HP motors, I decided to check the power pack #'s.
I took the # off of my power pack, '582510'.
This is the correct # for the '85 235HP. This # differs from the # for
the 150HP model.
I think, given that, that I have the 235HP model from 1985.
Why do people remove the factory ID tags?
Thank you all for your advice.
John

 

[emdsapmgr]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

The 150-200's and under had the "flatback" exhaust. If yours is a 235, it will have the "bubble back" exhaust. Look at the back of the engine. The carb part number indicates it is a 1985 235S model carb, found on the top and bottom of the intake. They are desirable carbs from the somewhat rare hi perf 235, called a 2.6. While it is not unusual to run a cowl with lower hp markings, it is unusual to run one without the cowl vents-a performance attribute to the XP/GT models. You can also check the flywheel for vents. XP/GT models from 84 up ran the 35 amp alternator. Let us know what you find. You'll eventually know it all with the help from everyone on the forum.

 

[Jeb1971]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Hi guys.
This is really coming together now!
The powerpack number indicates a 35 amp system.
I ran the numbers on the heads and they are supposedly
a desirable set, #:325638 and 325639 which are supposed to be
for the 235HP Model.
My motor does indeed have the bubble exhaust, not the flat.
I fired up this thing and cracked the throttle, and OMG.. Watch out.
This thing will achieve liftoff.
I will probably be needing a helmet..LOL
And do you want to talk about sucking gas? This thing sucked down a gallon
of gas in about 4 minutes!
Also, the 'S' in the model # which I estimate it to be (J235STLCOR), according
to a search I did is supposed to indicate a modified block, but I cant remember exactly where I read it though.
There is no doubt that the guy was running an earlier cowl, I will try to find the vented one, but wont hold my breath. I assume they are scarce.

So I guess I have a 235HP XP/GT motor. I am Soo Excited, you wouldn't believe.
I got this motor with a fiberglass boat/Trailer and paid $245.
John.

 

[emdsapmgr]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

The 235S is a pretty rare bird. Originally not HP rated by the factory, but was dynoed at somewhere around 240 at the crank. Came with composite reeds, piston cutouts and intake cutouts on the block, special porting. Other stuff, including the rare 638/638 heads, good carbs, vented cowl, hard lower motor mounts, special tuner, intake filler blocks and special gearset. One unlimited pack, one a rev limit pack. A lot of these parts will bolt onto any 235/175, so you need to dig further. If you really want to know, take off one of the intake covers and see what it looks like inside. I'd do a compression check just so you know where you are with it.

 

[Hoss the Hermit]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

My guess as to why people remove factory ID tags is because at some point it somehow came into the possession of a person who was perhaps not the rightful owner.

 

[Jeb1971]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Hi Fellas.
Well, Hoss. I hope that's not the case. Glad I got a detailed bill of sale. Also, this thing apparently sat for years, and it looks it too.. LOL
Iwobat, thank you for your advice.
I actually can't verify completly that it has boysen reeds as I just looked up the bore with a flashlight, but they are composite with a red stripe on them. They definatly aren't metal.
I will be removing the carbs and intake manifold and inspecting, because whoever worked on it left silicone smears on the block (not very tidy), and I want to inspect the reeds and reseal it.
If the reeds are indeed factory composite reeds, maby it has the stock Jets in the carbs. I also wonder about the life expectancy of reeds which are almost 23 years old. Perhaps I would do good to put a new set in.
I did a compression check after running it for a while to burn any varnish. Testing each cyl twice with all plugs removed, I got these numbers.

#1) 120 #4) 106
#2) 115 #5) 110
#3) 115 #6) 115

That low one and that high one kinda bother me. It isnt idleing well now, but I havent even cleaned the carbs yet. I am hoping to clean everything up well, reseal the manifold with either new reeds, or verifiable good exhisting ones and see where I stand.
What do you think about the disperigy in compression numbers?
Thanks, John

 

[HighTrim]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Those numbers look good, you could always try a decarb to even them out a bit .

 

[emdsapmgr]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

I'd follow HighTrim's advice on the decarb. Can't hurt. The compression numbers should run between 115-120. They appear normal for a 2.6, except the 106. You shouldn't have any running issues with it the way it is. The original reeds may have been a white, single petal composite. When you are into the intake, be sure to check all 6 of the recirculation valves. They frequently plug up and don't work. Your engine will run better if they work. Also, the recirc hoses may crack from age. If so, they leak crankcase compression, lowering hp. Just replace the hoses.

 

[Jeb1971]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Thanks HighTrim.
That is an excellant idea.
I will de-carb tomorrow, before I tear into it, and see what the compression numbers come out to.
Thanks, John

 

[HighTrim]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Compliments of TD. Invest in a can of seafoam, in a portable tank, mix 3/4 gallons of premix gas, and 3/4 can of seafoam, (assuming you don't have the vro connected). Put the remaining seafoam in a spray bottle, run the motor up to temperture, remove the plugs, one at a time, spray some seafoam into each cylinder and replace plug. Let it sit 15 minutes, remove the air silencer from the carb while waiting, restart motor, and spray seafoam into each carb, until it start to stall. Repeat until the seafoam is gone. Run out the remaining gas. It will smoke like it is on fire, and drip goo on the ground. Replace the plugs with new ones, and then do the compression check again. This procedure burns the carbon out of the motor and been known to free up rings and increase compression.

 

[rudedude]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

My guess as to why people remove factory ID tags is because at some point it somehow came into the possession of a person who was perhaps not the rightful owner.

Exactly the reason.



And I figgured I did good with a 14 ft boat , trailer, and a 70Hp Evinrude for 511 bucks on ebay, I sold the trailer and boat the next day ,removed the L/U and sold it as well. (putting a jet pump on the 70) Ended up getting paid to get this motor.

 

[ezeke]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Edit

 

[Jeb1971]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Well,
I performed the de-carbon, but it didn't change the compression results.
I did it according to the instructions listed previously, and it must have cleaned since the spark plugs were cleaned, but possibly, there just wasn't much carbon buildup overall.
It did smoke a little and there was some sludge drip, but that one low cylinder (106) didn't come up. maby I will try again, on the lake where I can really open it up. If I can get a borescope, I will look in and check for any scoreing.
All the same, if it runs good, I won't worry about it. In the worst event, Ill tear it down and re-piston or re-ring..
Thanks for the advice. I plan to use the seafoam in my other motors also.
John

 

[Jeb1971]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

One last question as I decide weather or not to use this lower unit with a nose cone installed, as you guys are an invaluable resource.
I was looking at this site about the pros and cons of using a nosecone:

http://www.randrpropshop.com/tips.htm

In it, there is this passage:

The rule of thumb here is, if the lower unit cannot be raised such that the propshaft is within 2 inches height from the bottom of the boat, it may not be a good idea, at least from a speed standpoint.

As speed is the only end I want to achieve, and I do not have a jack plate, but have mounted the motor on the highesat mounting hole, and it is a 20" motor on a 18' fiberglass shallow V Kona boat:

When they say 'bottom of the boat' are they refering to bottom of the transom? 2" below bottom of the transom would leave about half of the prop eating air at top speeds wouldnt it?
Thanks, John

 

[dajohnson53]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

My guess as to why people remove factory ID tags is because at some point it somehow came into the possession of a person who was perhaps not the rightful owner.

This may indeed be true, but I had a remanufactured Johnson that had the tags removed. Reman company was a reputable company.

This also might (probably not) relate to OP's info and the stuff he's found on his engine.

My remanufactured engine had an identifier casted on the engine itself identifying a 1983 235 20" shaft engine. It had a "175 V6 VRO" hood, obviously not original because VRO was not on '83 engines and the block was not 175 hp. The fuel pump was a VRO pump with the oil side capped off. Obviously not original to an '83. The electronics (coils, etc.) were from a much later engine - I don't know what year(s), but the mechanic did tell me it was not original to the 83 engine. The lower unit was not original either, a 25 inch shaft which had a slightly different gear attachment that made it a bear to re-attach when the L/U was removed. Don't know about the carbs.

Therefore, it COULD be that none of the parts identified by OP are original to the engine, and therefore do not accurately date it. But from reading the thread, doesn't appear to be the case. Just thought I'd mention it.

 

[Hoss the Hermit]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Well, there ya go, then. Did not mean to cast aspersions, I've seen times when a tornado would just blow a whole 18 wheeler full of 56" plasma tv's into somebody's back yard.

 

[dajohnson53]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Well, there ya go, then. Did not mean to cast aspersions, I've seen times when a tornado would just blow a whole 18 wheeler full of 56" plasma tv's into somebody's back yard.

Oh, I wasn't taking your comment in any negative way. I was just mentioning the alternative as an interesting option. And, relating the story of my frankenstein engine in case it cast any light on his attempt to identify his engine on the basis of parts. FWIW, that old engine of mine was a pain in the patoot to troubleshoot and repair because of the mishmash of parts. It ran well for many years though.

The wind blew a nice new blue tarp into my yard a couple of years ago, and I'm using it to this day. I blacked out the s/n though ;-)

 

[Jeb1971]

Re: Need help determining year of motor

Hi guys.
Actually, upon closer inspection of my motor, it appears that this isn't the original tilt/trim unit as the paint dosen't match. Whoever sold this tilt/trim unit probably removed the ID tag or maby, whoever bought it so as not to mislead someone, or themselves about the make and model of the motor.
I would do the same, come to think of it, but I would either reafix the old tag or attach it to the powerhead.. But thats just me..
Anyways, about my question of the height of the lower unit with a nose cone.. I asked a guy at the boat shop. He said, indeed, the propshaft must be 2-4" form the bottom of the transom and it is supposed to be partway out of the water for maximum performance, so I am now in the market for a jack plate, but am wondering if this setup is a 'set it and forget it' whereby I would use a non-hydraulic jack plate, or is it something where I would need a hydraulic jack plate to go up and down often..
I have never used this system before.
I hope this isn't the wrong forum section for this question.
If it is, I will go to the other one.
Thanks, JOHN