Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

[captmello]

Hi guys,

Im hoping you can steer me in the right direction. I've got a 2001, 90 hp, 2 stroke, looper, vro, etc.

It ran great for the last 3 years, since I bought it. *I rebuilt the carbs when I bought it because they leaked fuel badly(float bowls) and its run great since.

So, anyway, ran great but has now got a problem. It will not idle without me raising the Throttle only lever high. then it will start and idle at rpm's over 2000, otherwise it dies. It will run over 2000 rpm, but misses and sounds rough. Under power, I can get it up close to normal WOT rpms, but it will still be missing, and hesitating throughout.

These symptoms came on over a weeks time. Sometimes it would idle fine, other times, not. Now it won't idle under 2000 rpm.

The gas is new, and I replaced the fuel/water filter, and fuel line and tried running it on another fuel tank with no change, so I believe the fuel supply is good.


To me, it seems like a fuel issue, but I don't know how to trouble shoot it.

I'm hoping someone will help guide me through. I'm very capable of doing repair work but Outboards are new to me.

Thanks.

 

[sutor623]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

Have you checked each cylinder for proper spark? Sounds like you may have dropped a cylinder. If spark is good to go, add a quart of seafoam to a gallon of gas and let it run. See if that clears up any issues. Check compression just for the heck of it.

 

[captmello]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

Have you checked each cylinder for proper spark? Sounds like you may have dropped a cylinder. If spark is good to go, add a quart of seafoam to a gallon of gas and let it run. See if that clears up any issues. Check compression just for the heck of it.

Thanks! I will check spark and compression and let you know what I find.

 

[pn]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

i'm guessin it's the dredded vro. double check your fuel/oil line connections for leaks. or bury your vro and go with a premix.

 

[captmello]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

Have you checked each cylinder for proper spark? Sounds like you may have dropped a cylinder. If spark is good to go, add a quart of seafoam to a gallon of gas and let it run. See if that clears up any issues. Check compression just for the heck of it.

I checked the spark and compression all at once. I checked each spark plug and wire and all sparked when the engine was turned over. So I have spark...Compression was at 130-135 for all 4 cylinders.

One thing that stood out was that the spark plugs where all covered in oil. they were all the same. They looked brand new, covered in oil. I'm not sure if thats normal since this is my first two stroke outboard.

Once I finished the testing, I put it back together and tried starting it. It is pretty consistent now. when trying to start it, it fires but kills right away. If I raise the fast idle bar, almost all the way, it will start and run roughly until i lower the fast idle lever lower and eventually dies, around 2000 rpm.

Heres a couple of pics

Oily spark plug. They all looked the same

Do you still think I should try the seafoam?

i'm guessin it's the dredded vro. double check your fuel/oil line connections for leaks. or bury your vro and go with a premix.

Just a guess? How would i check?



Thanks again guys for the replies. Keep the help coming!!!

 

[captmello]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

I just thought I'd add one more pic. This is the same plug, but the flash went off on this one. You can see the reflection in the oil on the plug.

I'd like to hear from someone about this.

these plugs are 3 years old, with about 50-75 hours on them.

 

[sutor623]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

Man could be a lotta things. It is possible you fouled the plugs out. Easy to swap in new ones and see. Could be dirty/varnished carbs. I have had idle issues from vacuum, fuel or oil line leaks. Also you can check the ignition armature and make sure all is well. If your timing somehow got thrown off (loose hardware or throttle linkage) it would prevent a good idle.

 

[pn]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

i think its mandatory that everyone dissassembles their vro/fuel pump before posting.

 

[captmello]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

Man could be a lotta things. It is possible you fouled the plugs out. Easy to swap in new ones and see. Could be dirty/varnished carbs. I have had idle issues from vacuum, fuel or oil line leaks. Also you can check the ignition armature and make sure all is well. If your timing somehow got thrown off (loose hardware or throttle linkage) it would prevent a good idle.

I'm going to pick up new plugs and an adjustable spark tester to try to eliminate them from the issue. I went over the motor closely and don't see any leaky/damaged oil or fuel lines. Frankly, the engine looks like new. I don't think its ever been worked on.

 

[captmello]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

i think its mandatory that everyone dissassembles their vro/fuel pump before posting.

You keep coming back to the VRO pump. Are you suggesting I pull and disassemble the pump before posting anymore? That doesn't seem like the logical way to go. I have been reading up on the pump and will most likely be checking it out if the spark tests come out normal.

Can you offer any useful advise for me regarding checking the vro pump?

 

[itsaboattime]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

Brother if your VRO died your outboard would have died shortly afterwords. He's just being facetious.
I would definitely go ahead with the Sea-foam. And the new fuel lines from the tank.
And just for clearification.....When you pulled the plugs for the pics, was this after she died on her own? The reason I ask is because if she was starving for fuel, the plugs wouldn't be covered in oil, in my opinion.
Your compression is good, you are going to check spark with a tester, and you have new lines from the pump up. Right?
As said before, I would try new plugs first. I change plugs every year, but then I put at least 100 hours a year on my boat.

 

[captmello]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

Brother if your VRO died your outboard would have died shortly afterwords. He's just being facetious.
I would definitely go ahead with the Sea-foam. And the new fuel lines from the tank.
And just for clearification.....When you pulled the plugs for the pics, was this after she died on her own? The reason I ask is because if she was starving for fuel, the plugs wouldn't be covered in oil, in my opinion.
Your compression is good, you are going to check spark with a tester, and you have new lines from the pump up. Right?
As said before, I would try new plugs first. I change plugs every year, but then I put at least 100 hours a year on my boat.

thanks for the reply.

Yes, I've now got new fuel line from the tank to the fuel intake on the motor. Primer ball pumps up nicely. I just changed the plugs and tested the spark at all 4 wires. Each wire was throwing the spark about a 1/2 an inch, so that seems good.

I agree, its not starving for fuel, yes those wet plugs are how they looked after shutting down.

Now, After changing the plugs and testing the spark, I tried starting it. this time it started and Idled for about two minutes before it killed. I was able to restart it by raising the fast idle bar, but once I lowered the idle down under 2000rpm, it would die.

I'm going to go try the seafoam...

 

[captmello]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

Seafoam seems to be helping...

I mixed the first batch of one gallon gas and about 1.5 cans of seafoam (16oz cans). For the first 10 minutes the motor ran terrible. It kept on killing if it dropped below 2000 rpm. I was constantly working the fast idle lever to try to keep it running. the fast idle lever is not working very well...anyway, after fighting it for a while, I finally got it to idle down to about 800rpm. It then kept running for the next 15 minutes. It was smoking like crazy! But I knew it needed to idle lower to get the gas to be flowing through the idle circuit. So I ran it this way until the gas ran out. I then reconnected the boat fuel and restarted it. It idled for a while, as I waited for the smokey fuel the clear.

So, since that seemed to help, I went and got another gallon of gas and one more can of seafoam.

 

[captmello]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

Well just when I thought the seafoam was working. I seem to be back to where I started. It is still not running right. It will Idle sometimes for a few minutes, and sometimes it won't. Even when it won't stay running, it always fires briefly then stalls. I'm stumped.

Please let me know what to do next.

 

[wayneo99]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

I think there are some safety circuits build into this motor, shift switch which kills half of the powerhead to allow easy shifting. over temp switch which shuts down cylinder spark. optical switch maybe?

not sure but good luck, keep posting and a factory service manual is very helpful in times like this.

 

[captmello]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

I just thought I'd follow up on this thread. After agonizing over this for a few weeks and spinning my tires I finally called in a Pro. I turned out to be the Power Pack was malfunctioning and dropping all the spark. It was difficult to test for since whenever we tested for spark it was always good, and whenever we tried to start it, it would fire and then die. What stood out to the mechanic, was the way it would just cut out completely, with no sputtering, or choking, it would just quit, dead. Anyway, It's fixed now. What have I learned? Well, in the time I took trying to fix it myself, I learned a lot more about the motor and how it works, which is good. but I also learned that one needs to know his limitations and that, while these forums are great, It's very hard to identify and solve these odd issues at the computer. Sometimes calling in a pro is the right answer.
Now to make up for the lost boating time!!!

 

[sutor623]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

Cool man glad you fixed it. With electrical problems you can only find them when the issue presents itself. It is sometimes hard to duplicate electrical issues!

 

[boobie]

Re: Need help trouble shooting! '01 johnson 2 stroke

pn. Sometimes a little trouble shooting works good instead of just guessing.