Need some steering expertise.

[Subtle]

I have two Johnson 275 HP engines, they were designed to be mounted and ran together, however I'm only wanting to use one for my current project and keep the other for spare parts... I have already mounted one engine, its running fantastic, however I have no steering. I'm starting to think that one engine steers only left and the other engine steers only right. the two steering cylinders work together and can not work alone. I will include pictures so you know what I mean.

My question is, is this how they work or should I be able to use only one if so which one.

 

[Subtle]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

Nobody!?!?!

 

[Will Bark]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

I can't answer your question but be patient; the gurus aren't on the site the whole time, hopefully they'll pick it up in the next couple of hours. Good luck

 

[Will Bark]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

Well mabey no one knows the answer

 

[Bosunsmate]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

Looks to me like you are just missing the linkage from ram to pivot pin point on front of motor

 

[82rude]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

Looks to me like you are just missing the linkage from ram to pivot pin point on front of motor

im with you .your missing a linkage as far as I can see.all the twins ive ever seen turn both ways not just one .

 

[Subtle]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

Yes, I have all the linkage that came with both engines. I have the second image engine already mounted on the boat,I know I have no linkage installed but the cylinder still doesn't move, and the wheel just keeps turning in either direction. I was about to take that engine off and put the other one on. But didn't want to as I know the engine already on the boat works great and the other one I'm not sure. I just don't want to take the time to do all of this and it not work either.

Thanks.

 

[82rude]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

is that a hydraulic system?maybe the fault is with it .might have to be filled and bled???its not the motor if you have It disconnected and the cylinder still wont turn .

 

[Subtle]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

I know the motor has nothing to do with it but you have to take the motor off to switch the cylinder anyway or so it looks so I figure it would be easier to switch it all together verses trying to break all those old bolts loose.

 

[Subtle]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

And yes its hydraulic.

 

[Subtle]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

My thoughts are that the left and right connections are on the same side on the lower pictured unit were as they are on opposite ends on the upper pictured unit. So wouldn't it make sense that only the upper pictured one can turn left and right? Also I'm used to seeing the rams on both sides on the steering cylinder instead of on one side.

 

[Bosunsmate]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

The top one looks normal. I cant see what the end of the ram with the feeder lines looks like clearly to decide about that second photo one. Another photo would be useful.
If you are turning the wheel and nothing is happening then i agree with 82rude that it needs to be bled/filled.

All steering can move left and right or otherwise once they have moved one way they will never be able to move back the other so you would go around in a circle permanently. Steering systems differ in how much left or right travel they allow for but they all do, getting the linkage to centre the motor when the ram is centred in the cylinder is how its done

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

Looks like you need the link from the hydraulic steering rod to the motor steering arm. Remember the hydraulic steering arm will need to be centered in it's cylinder, and the motor pointing straight ahead, to steer both ways properly.

 

[boobie]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

Could you post some more pics of the whole system ?? As the old saying goes, 1 pic equals 1000 words.

 

[F_R]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

Well, I confess I'm totally unfamiliar with that particular system, but I can tell you that those are what are called "unbalanced" cylinders, meaning the rod only comes out one end. Therefor, the displacement inside is greater on one end than the other because the rod partly fills one end. No big deal, except the unequal displacement will make it steer faster and harder in one direction than the other, which will be slower and easier. Also, the oil coming and going from the ends will be greater on one end than the other. This means the helm must be capable of constantly adding to or getting rid of the excess or shortage of oil as you steer back and forth. The unbalanced design is normally not an issue because they are mounted in opposite directions and cancel each other out.

I said all this simply to say that I don't know whether or not your helm is capable of doing that. So, your first priority must be to find the answer to that question. My gut feeling is that it is not.

I can't believe the cylinders are single action as you suggested. My guess is that they are double action (work in push AND pull direction). But as I said, I am not familiar with those particular ones.

IF, IF, the system is compatible with single cylinder operation, I would have to agree it probably needs to be filled and bled.

My qualifications: I worked 20 years in a plant that builds marine hydraulic steering systems. But I didn't build this one.

 

[boobie]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

My suggestion would be, just get rid of it and get a new steering system for a single motor.

 

[oldman570]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

The cylinder in the #1 photo appears to be a double acting cylinder. You might have to block off one of the inlet ports on each end and run the hoses to the other ports. The cyclender in the #2 photo looks as thow it had 2 hoses that ran from the photo 1 cylinder to it, and would cause it to work. More photos of the hoses and just how many sure would help.
JMO
Oldman570

 

[Subtle]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

Thanks for all your advice. I have figured it out. The motor in the first picture does in fact steer left and right but it would only do so after disconnecting the attached center I guess guide rod pin. Turns out the pin was seized preventing it from turning. The only question I have now. It to the guy that was talking about my helm might not be correct. This helm has always been used with these engine since they were new. And the engine were ran together since they were new. This will be the first time they will have been ran independent of each other. Will I be okay running it by itself.

 

[crab time]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

I don't see any reason why you couldn't run it by itself. Should be fine

 

[F_R]

Re: Need some steering expertise.

Thanks for all your advice. I have figured it out. The motor in the first picture does in fact steer left and right but it would only do so after disconnecting the attached center I guess guide rod pin. Turns out the pin was seized preventing it from turning. The only question I have now. It to the guy that was talking about my helm might not be correct. This helm has always been used with these engine since they were new. And the engine were ran together since they were new. This will be the first time they will have been ran independent of each other. Will I be okay running it by itself.

That is exactly what I was trying to explain to you. A pair of unbalanced cylinders mounted on opposite sides will cancel out the unbalanced situation. As you say, it has been that way since new. HOWEVER, you are now wanting to run just ONE unbalanced cylinder. I question whether or not the helm can tolerate that much difference in the amount of oil that it takes to steer hardover starboard vs hardover port. Going in one direction, it has to store that extra oil somewhere. Then going in the other direction, it has to feed that stored oil back into the system. And all the while, keeping any air from infiltrating the system. As I said, I don't know about your particular helm. But you need to find the answer.

Judging by your pictures, it looks like the piston rod is about 3/4" diameter in a cylinder of about 1 1/4" bore. That is several cubic inches of oil that is displaced by the rod. That oil has to go somewhere.