New Gimble Bearing

[DamnitBadger]

78 Cobalt w/ 260 mercruiser (pre alpha)<br />After adjusting the lower shift cable and getting the boat to shift without dying I took it out the other day for a quick run to check it out. Well, the run did not go well. First off their was what I would describe as a gravel noise coming from the lower So I think the Gimble bearing is shot. Second when warm the starter does not function. Upon pulling it out of the water after only 45 minuites I drained over 20 gallons of water after pulling the plug. Closer inspection revealed the U-joint bellows was not seated on the transom side. Bellows looks new but the transom ring has a grove in it and the bellows does not so I suspect the bellows installed was not the correct one. The previous owner ran in saltwater so I can imagine the worst. <br />I'm in process of installing a new gimble bearing and atempting to remove the lower unit. Sounds simple enough but the unit will not give more that an inch off of the six studs(yes it's in forward). I suspect the shaft is frozen in the gimble. It won't budge any futher. I have tried using wedges made from oak so not to marr the gasket surface but this is not working. Anybody got a sugestion?

 

[Don S]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

You will need a new gimbal bearing, plus the bellows, along with new ujoints, and probably a new yoke that goes into the drive and a front seal. That yoke gets rusty and eats up the seal. You may also have water in the drive, better check it.<br />I just did a new Volvo that had salt water in the bellows. The drive was an XDP and the gimbal bearing has a snap ring holding the bearing in, as yours may have (they used them back then). I finally ended up removeing the engine and hammering the shaft out of the gimbal bearing. Not a pretty site...........

 

[fireship1]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

Hello, Did you try lifting up on the drive and letting it drop on it's own? A little downward "slamming" is sometimes necessary to pop a stuck upper unit free. As a last resort put the trim rams back on. Keep the six mounting nuts off and keep the unit in full fwd gear. Then trim up. It should pop right out with help from the hydralics. If none of the above work you can try cutting the drive shaft belows off and using heat to free the driveshaft. Be very careful when doing this around gasoline. Drain the boat's fuel tank and make sure all the fuel vapors are gone. The last, last, last resort? Pull the engine and hammer the driveshaft out from inside the boat. Let's hope it dosen't come to this! Let us know how you make out.

 

[DamnitBadger]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

Man I have been lifting and droping for over an hour just to get it to move an inch and a half out. The studs are now even with the outdrive housing and it seems it does not want to move any futher. I tried useing the rams and that did not work for me. I gave up for the night and will resume again tomorrow.<br /><br />Don, your bummin me out with "pullin the engine and hammering the shaft out" Man that would be a major drag.<br /><br />I've got a new correct bellows and gimble that will be here tomorrow along with gaskets and a new heavy duty starter. Will wait to see what the Ujoint and yoke looks like If I can get this #&*^!?~ lower off. HELPPPPP. LOL

 

[Don S]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

To me, pulling an engine is about an hours job, and I don't consider it a big deal. Of course, I do this for a living and have an overhead air hoist, so it's not a biggy.<br />Plus, that Volvo XDP drive I was talking about is the new "Plastic" drive and doesn't take well to torches, and it's impossible to pry on anything without damaging things.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

esaiest is to pull the engine. I cant remember when the merc units quit usuing the snapring. you may try shoving the unit back on and spraying it down with PB blaster from the inside. what has most likly happend is some rust is on the shaft and bearing ID and its locking it up. spray the outside then reinstall it with the nuts and spray the inside. if it does not work you may try the heat trick. if anything make sure your tank is full not empty. you dont have the equipment to fume free it.but your no where close to any fuel sources on the outside. just make sure you dont light any glass on fire but with a good tip and oxy/acetylene the flame is easy to cntrol. heat the inner bearing race.<br /> like Dons, I have had several that the engine got pulled and drove the shaft/gimble bearing out then tossed the shaft. you most likly will need the complete shaft assy. its about 250 and a yoke seal. if you have been having shift proplems check the slide pocket for corrosion or water. if its there odds are the shift cable has water damage and will need replacement as well.also check the upper shift shaft seal in the exhaust passage. they fail a lot. so now ya have enough to keep ya busy all weekend <br />sometimes you can lift the drive and insert the hammer handle on the gimbal ring and bring the drive down on top of it. and sometimes ya just gotta pull the engine and drive it out.

 

[rabidfish]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

I wave my magic wand and they fall off...<br />Gawd I love freshwater! <br />You know... you can even drink the stuff!<br />

 

[seahorse5]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

I do a few a year where everything is frozen up due to neglect, especially after salt water gets in the bilge and gets the engine wet.<br /><br />Depending on the accessability, I've held a fine tooth hacksaw on the exposed driveshaft inside the boat at the transom. Carefully have someone start the motor and holding the hacksaw, it will cut thru the shaft fairly quickly. You can then pull the outdrive and then the motor out of the boat for repair.<br /><br />This procedure is not for the careless person and requires a lot of common sense around a running motor and moving parts, but it does work great on stuck MerCruisers.

 

[cmyers_uk]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

Carefully have someone start the motor and holding the hacksaw, it will cut thru the shaft fairly quickly

Very clever, its for tips like these that I try and read all the threads.

 

[Don S]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

Pulling the drive yearly and putting some grease and new orings on the shaft each time will prevent you from ever needing that tip.

 

[DHPMARINE]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

Your drive sounds like it has started to come off.Keep trying.You might try this : Drive unit down,bolts off,cylinders connected.Cut a 2x4 to fit between the top cover of the drive and the gimbal housing (transom assembly).Hit the up button for the drive,and see if it helps.Once the drive clears the studs,you may have to install longer studs (one on each side).<br /><br />Won't say where I got this tip,but I was skeptical,then impressed.<br /><br />DHP

 

[DamnitBadger]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

Halleluiah! Thank heaven for "Kroil". "A little dab will do ya" The secret is to hold yer mouth just right use oak wedges and jump up and down on that sucker with a piece of wood between the ears and the bell housing. Got her off and the u-joints are fine and took grease, Tollerance ring and all came out and even it's reusable. The bearing was totally destroyed. I drove the balls from the bearing and sepparated the races so as not to damage the tolerance ring so I could reuse it. Heated the shaft race and with a chisel removed the shaft race. I'm home free now. There was muck in by the slide but the shift cable is OK. The new bearing is a sealed unit but will be checked every year. New o-rings all around and I'm about good to go.<br />Thanks to all!

 

[rodbolt]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

dude<br /> if the ujoints had water they will fail. so will the input yoke. I have one in the yard now that failed. the last repair tech just greased everything after it sank. took 3 months. chipped a section of the flange that the gimbal bellows fits when the caps slung apart. lucky I have a friend that can weld suberbly. we welded the thumbnail size chip back in and all will be well.<br /> most shops would have replaced the shield assy. I would have except its a ragged old boat and he has paid another guy twice to fix it and both times I got it back. the other guy bills at 35 an hour and I bill at 75. the welder cost him 25o, my labor is going to be around 450 and the parts are going tobe around 1800. while it was tearing up the yoke had failed and lost all the upper unit lube and when the ujoints finally failed and allowed water in it filled the drive. there was nothing left to repair on it. so what went from a simple sinking that should have been a gimbal bearing and ujoint replacement for about 175 or so will cost him about 2500 or so. dont get cheap now. remove the input yoke for inspection and replace the ujoints. the only special tools are the retainer spanner,a ftlbs torque wrench and possibly a dial type inch pounds torque wrench, depending on which input bearings you have. if yours is still the old style just a standard torque wrench. some units set the bearings with a rolling torque and some set with a tightening torque. always use a new drive gear nut and tension washer.<br /> be aware that if the shift cable has had water in it it will fail as well. and always remember to check the seals on the upper shift shaft in the exhaust passage.<br /> fix it once,fix it correctly and go play. its usually cheaper to do it that way. DO NOT reuse a tolerance ring. the new bearing will come with one. dont use the notches facing aft method to replace the bearing. I have had to many **** when trying to remove the drive and had to remove the drive and gimbal bearing. seems there was a shade tree about that installed a lot of them notches aft. and do make sure the grease hole in the bearing is lined up with the hole in the gimbal bearing pocket on reassy.

 

[Don S]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

I agree with rodbolt 100%, replace the ujoints now, and at least pull the yoke and clean the seal surface and replace the seal. Those things get rust built up fromt the salt water and will destroy the seal just like running on sandpaper. Then you loose the gear lube into the bellows and the dry drive goes belly up........at great expense.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

DonS<br /> ya ever notice that with a v8 when the upper lets go from lack of lube there is nothing left to fix ?

 

[Don S]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

Oh Yea....

 

[DamnitBadger]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

Is there an automotive equivelent to the u-joint? My local merc dealer quoted me 65.00 each and my normal source (25.00 ea) would not ship until monday making it wed. or thursday before I can get this thing back together. Just curious? 65.00 sounded way high.

 

[Don S]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

If you can find them, the Spicer 5-1306X work fine.

 

[DamnitBadger]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

Thanks, the local bearing house will have it and is open Saturday till noon. You guys have been a great help.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: New Gimble Bearing

dont forget to inspect the yoke seal. its easy to replace. takes an hour or soif the drive is already off, like I say, do it right do it once and go play. there is a lot going on and if you fail to stop a problem before it starts its over. by the time you realize the yoke seal failed and leaked all the drive oil from the upper to the bellows you will be posting about an upper housing failure. happens all the time. like I said a lack of lube failure usually renders the upper case usless and feeds metal to the lower while its failing. and it normally fails with NO warnings. just cruising along fat and happy and wham. I know ya wanna go but fix all the future problems now.