no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

[farginicehole]

Okay, I'm starting a new thread to continue my "Evinrude 150 XP won't fire" thread. Each day this week, I've started the motor using the hose and muffs. Every time, there are a couple of cylinders that have no spark. I've determined that it's nothing to do with the plugs or wires, by doing the swaps, and I'm even fairly confident it's not the coils. It is an intermittent problem, and the no spark problem jumps around to different cylinders in what looks like a random pattern. I haven't had a chance to do the resistance check or the peak voltage checks on my stator, as described in my Clymer manual, but plan to a.s.a.p. My question is, since this is so intermittent, is it likely that these two tests will catch the problem (if the stator is indeed the root cause)? I'll gladly replace it or whatever else is failing, but several of these ignition parts are pretty pricey and I don't want to replace anything that doesn't need to be! Expert advice would be greatly appreciated - thanks in advance!

 

[duck64]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

try the search menue

 

[farginicehole]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Okay, I did that using the keyword "stator". I read a few threads, and realize that I should mention another symptom that's been going on for a while. My tachometer has been acting goofy lately. Sometimes it doesn't work at all, other times it appears to be working properly, and still other times it goes way higher than the actual RPMs (I know the boat well enough to be sure) and then lower. Maybe this is another important clue to diagnose the problem(s)?

 

[farginicehole]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

I've read more threads from the search using different keywords, and am still confused because my problem seems a little "unique" in that my no-spark problem jumps around to different cylinders. One cylinder that was firing good and hot just minutes earlier will just stop. Then another one that was not sparking at all will start firing hot. I'm hoping that these clues (along with the intermittent tach problem I mentioned before) will help some of you experts narrow this down for me. I'd love to solve this problem without a trip to the $tealer!

 

[Walker]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

In this situation, I'd pull the flywheel and check the stator, timer base, rectifier and all associated wiring for signs of leaking, of corrosion or even muddobber nests.

 

[DHPMARINE]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

I followed this thread,had an idea,and lost interest in helping.<br />Many people try to help here.I happen to work at.....and as....<br />Never mind.Thanks for calling me a "$tealer".<br />Maybe I should stop posting here.<br />DHP<br />PS: anyone who owns a boat NEEDS to find a "$tealer"he can trust.Actually ...<br /> <br /><br />Find a DEALER you like,treat him fair,he'll treat you the same.DOUG

 

[farginicehole]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

You really shouldn't be so sensitive, DHP. I'm referring to the "$tealer" that I bought the boat from. I've had nothing but bad experience with this place, and so have many others that I have talked to. If I had a dealer in the area that I trusted, I surely would have taken it there as I've lost a lot of time on the water this spring. That's why I've turned to this great forum for some advice, and also bought a manual. I'm picking up a peak-reading voltmeter and doing the stator, charge coil, timer base & sensor coil tests as outlined as soon as possible. Since you work for a dealer that I could trust, where are you located? Within reasonable driving distance of southwest Michigan? If not, sorry to offend, but I'm sure many others here have had experiences with dealers and other shops where they left feeling taken advantage of, and may have left after paying a big chunk of change and still had a motor that didn't run correctly. On the other hand, I'm sure that many have had very positive experiences as well.

 

[farginicehole]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Took the flywheel off this morning to inspect the stator. Didn't see any discoloration or anything oozing out of it. Put the flywheel back on and did the charge coil resistance test with the following results: A-B - 928 ohms, C-D - 928 ohms. My manual says 980 +/- 25 ohms, so these are out of spec.<br /><br />Also did the sensor coil resistance test. On the port side, I got: D-A - 719 ohms, D-B - 663 ohms, D-C - 684 ohms. My Clymer manual recommends two completely different readings, depending on which of two meters you are using. They say 360 +/- 30 ohms if using a Stevens AT-101, and 970 +/- 100 ohms if using a Mercotronics M-700. Unfortunately, I am using a Sperry DM-5300, so I'm not sure what conclusion to make from my numbers. I also am a little confused as to why meters would read this resistance so differently!? Anyways, I am still losing spark to as many as 3 cylinders at any given time, and the no-spark problem continues to jump around to different cylinders in an apparently random pattern. Also, the tach isn't moving a bit. The motor model # is E150STLCEM, and the serial # is R08173240.

 

[farginicehole]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Put the boat in the water Saturday evening. Started right up, idled smoothly, and jumped out of the hole without hesitation. The tach had come back to life, and if you can believe it, the motor revved to 5600+ rpm when trimmed out. The speedometer showed about 2 mph faster top speed than I've ever seen the boat do (and the most rpm I've ever seen previously was 5000). After a while, it started missing and the rpm dropped to 4900-5000. I still haven't replaced any ignition components, because I'm still not sure what is the culprit. I'm not quite sure how to interpret the results of the resistance tests I ran in my last post. Does anyone have any ideas? At this point, I'd settle for a list of prime suspects, prioritized in order of most likely to least likely, then I'll start replacing them one at a time until she runs the way she's supposed to! Thanks again, and I would also like to apologize to any honest dealer technicians that I may have offended.

 

[james roach]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Check all of your grounds. Check the connections in the terminal box for your rectifier and replace the ends as needed. Remove and clean the grounds for the coils. It sounds like you have a connection that is corroded. As it heats up the trouble becomes apparent. I just replaced some of my rectifier connections yesterday that was making my tach act up as you stated once the motor warms up. BTW be easy on the dealers. You might need one.

 

[farginicehole]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Thanks for the reply, James. I will check these as soon as I can. My problem with various cylinders having no spark does not appear to be heat related, at least I don't think so anyways. Anyways, is the terminal box you are talking about the black plastic box on the rear side of the engine, right between the two banks of cylinders?

 

[boatin]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

BTW, Ive read your posts and you seem like a nice guy but you really need to get rid of your screen name. A bit offensive. good luck on your problem.

 

[farginicehole]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Well, sorry to offend you, Boatin. It came from a funny old movie, Johnny Dangerously, and my love of ice fishing. As far as I can tell, most people that know me don't think I'm such a bad guy, but maybe I'm more of an acquired taste. Thanks for the wish of luck on the motor problems and, at this point, I think I'm just going to start replacing expensive components one at a time until I get consistent spark on all 6. I haven't found any electrical connections that look questionable so far, so I'll probably start with a new stator. Maybe I should be starting with the rectifier/regulator though, since I'm not sure if the stator would be causing my tach problems? Those two parts alone are going to run upwards of $500 I think.

 

[BrianTindall]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Do the timing light trick like I did. Wait till a cylinder drops out then put the timing light on and move it around to find the dead cylinders. Also check the shift interupt switch if you have one. That kills 3 cylinders to ease the drive line load when shifting to nuetral. On mine, I replaced the power pack and solved my problem. Do you have two packs or one up top behind the flywheel?

 

[boatin]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

I thought I had seen all the old movies!! I missed that one. Im not a pro at this but if I were to start replacing components at random, the stator would be my guess. I like the previous idea of checking under the flywheel for voltage leaks.<br />Maybe one of the pros can read through this again and have some better ideas.

 

[kgw]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Icehole2,<br />I had the same prob with a friends 120 Rude. Turned out to be the female pin inside the rubber plug on the power pack to charge coil. The pin was broken inside the rubber. must have been that way since it was made and after 10yrs finally seperated enough to cause the same prob.

 

[james roach]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Concentrate on the powerpack and stator. It is my experience that these fail for more often than timer bases. Before replacing anything, take it to the water and unhook the shift interrupter switch and see if this solves the problem. Be careful though you may have to use the choke to turn the engine off with that switch unplugged. Good luck and please post your results.

 

[farginicehole]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Thanks for all of your replies! Kgw, do you mean your friend's 120 was having the intermittent spark problems that would jump around to different cylinders? Brian T. and James, I'm not sure if I understand what you are suggesting with regards to the shift interrupter switch. If I understand Brian correctly, this disables 3 cylinders? Are you guys thinking that maybe this switch or a connection is going bad, therefore causing between 1-3 cylinders to intermittently go out at any given time? Does this switch cause three cylinders to go out only one one side (either port or starboard), because I think I have had each of the six cylinders go out at different times. I haven't done this with a timing light, but when it's running rough and obviously dropping one or more cylinder, I'll pull the spark plug wires one at a time and find which ones are no-fires. Thanks again for all of your suggestions - I really do appreciate it!

 

[james roach]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

The switch kills the starboard side.

 

[farginicehole]

Re: no spark on 1 or more cylinders, but. . .

Hmmmm. I would say that the the majority of my "no-sparks" have occurred on the port side, although it doesn't seem to discriminate all that much. Just starts with #4 & #6, then #6 comes back to life and then #3 goes out, etc. etc. (just an example, but appears to be totally random in my estimation). I've got to get to the bottom of what are the correct part numbers for my components too, as I've sent requests for quotes to two different online parts houses (supplied each with my model # and serial #), and both of them sent back ignition part #s that not only do not match what is currently on my engine, but they don't even match each other. Granted, I haven't owned this boat since it was new, so who knows who has replaced stuff on it in the past and if they used the proper part numbers, but the two suppliers not even agreeing on what I need really makes me wonder!