no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

[fishfeatures]

1989 johnson 60hp.

it's a new to me powerhead and when I went to start it for the first time it wouldn't even try to fire. All the electrics are off the old powerhead and they were working before it seized. Now i have checked spark plugs and bottom two are fine good spark and properly gapped. Top spark plug won't spark , so I swopped around the #1 and #2 coils and nothing again on the top.The coil fired when swopped into middle cclinder so I know my problem is not the coils.
What next ? I'm thinking cdi trouble but can these go bad from just sitting around on a shelf for a few months.
Any help please, it's been months since I was out in my own rig and was so looking forward to it today when I bolted everything back together but now it looks like a day of frustration in even trying to start it up.

 

[HighTrim]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

You will need a DVA meter or attachment before troubleshooting further. Do you have one?

Did you swap the plug wire/boot with the coil when you moved it?

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

You will need a DVA meter or attachment before troubleshooting further. Do you have one?

Did you swap the plug wire/boot with the coil when you moved it?

No DVA meter , would a multi meter do somehow?

Yeah I swopped plugs wires/boots more than once and even used spares i have just to be sure..

I have a mate with a 70hp and may borrow his CDI tomorrow.

 

[cyclops2]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

Be VERY GREATFULL the spark has died COMPLETLY.

Intermittant modules can take months to catch for sure. Had a baddy that would ALWAYS run fine in the shop for HOURS.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

ok well I swopped over the CDI from a 70 and I am getting what can be called erratic sparking in no.1 ,
it leads me to think after reading older posts that maybe my Key has sheared. My torque wrench doesn't do ft/lbs only Nm so I thought I torqued it correctly but maybe not. I'll whip off the flywheel during the week and see if it's sheared. I can't think of any other logical line of thought.

 

[cyclops2]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

I thought a sheared key would screw up ALL sparkplug timing ?? Or have all firing randomly. Do you have 3 sensors ?? under the wheel ? Then you would be right if 1 came loose or intermittant.
Check it out before risking a flywheel to the puller.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

3 sensors ??????????

 

[cyclops2]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

Only asked if you knew. I do not. I could not find any free schematics for Even Or Johnson of your year or hp A V4 shows 1 charging coil & 1 trigger coil only for the V4 I found. Try to look at a schematic first. Might save some needless wheel pulling. My best guess.

Rich

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

When I put on the f/w I first put in the timer base and then the charging coil? I am going to go ahead and pull off the f/w to check the key just for peice of mind and to cross another off the list of possible causes.

 

[cyclops2]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

Fish

I reread your SWAPPING stuff from a SEIZED POWERHEAD. Overheated engine ? If yes. does EACH cylinder have the power pack modules right near the cylinder it fires ? If yes. The top cylinder & power pack got the most heat. Is ther a second moulded module for each cylinder ?

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

#3 rod bearing disintegrated causing the seizure. When i bought the motor it was sitting for a while and I freed up the motor but in hindsight I should have taken the time to open it up. Well any way , I have a coil beside each cylinder with the CDI where the green circle is below.

 

[cyclops2]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

I can warn you about retightening the nut holding the flywheel in place.

I had a OLD white monster Johnson 35 hp. Wanted to check the stuff underneath. OK. Pulled the wheel. Looked & gapped OK. Put in a NEW KEY. Tightened it up & went out. 3 minutes later the engine stopped.

As I was buying my 3rd key in 3 days, the guy asked me how tight I was tightening the TINY nut on top.

Well..................It should have been almost 2 X tighter than what I was doing. He gave & instructed me how to use a torque wrench& how to do it right............I was POSITIVE the threaded shaft would snap anytime at 70% of the correct torque.

Find out the correct torque.

Rich

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

Well the key was sheared , gues i installed it wrong or nudged it in when putting on the flywheel. I torqued to 140 Nm also. Anyway have ordered replacement keys and will have a go in a few days at redoing it correctly. There seemed to be no damge to either taper luckly but I'll run some very fine sandpaper over them to clean them up anyway.
hopefully this i'll solve my problem.

 

[Haffiman]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

Remember that the key is not what is holding the flywheel, but the friction between the crank taper and flywheel. Surface must be 100% clean and dry before putting the flywheel on, the key is only for alignment. I often used to 'dry' the flywheel taper after cleaning with a hair-dryer. The extra heat made it almost 'shrink' onto the crank shaft ensuring proper contact. Not much heat needed, only some 50C++.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: no spark on top cylinder .. and I have swopped coil out.

Remember that the key is not what is holding the flywheel, but the friction between the crank taper and flywheel. Surface must be 100% clean and dry before putting the flywheel on, the key is only for alignment. I often used to 'dry' the flywheel taper after cleaning with a hair-dryer. The extra heat made it almost 'shrink' onto the crank shaft ensuring proper contact. Not much heat needed, only some 50C++.

Nice tip there. thanks haffiman