No tail

[IVAZ]

Ok so I know many here hate this topic but here it goes.
My boat came equipped with a sting ray hydrofoil from the previous owner and at first I found it nifty that it came with an ?upgrade?. After researching to try to find a better foil I came across lots of negativity from the search function in this forum. The handling aspect raised a flag because someone suggested it can affect high speed and turning.
While holding a turn all of a sudden the rear of my boat would slide pretty violently towards the front. I assumed the boat was being pushed to far past its limit. I thought about removing the whale tail anyway to see if it would make a difference.
After removing it the sliding still occurs but at a much higher speed than before and less dramatically. To get on a plane doesn?t seem to take much longer but the big plus was an extra 100 rpm and 4 mph.
Put me in the foil hater?s side of this argument.

If I posted in the wrong section feel free to move it to stupid human tricks as I did attempt to launch with the transom straps on this day of testing.

 

[BWR1953]

Re: No tail

I bought a brand new Bass Tracker Tournament TX-17 in 1985 powered by a 50hp Mercury. With just me in the boat, no problems planing. When I added my ex and baby, still no problem, but it took longer.

However, when I added my LARGE cousin, just the two of us, we could NOT get the boat on plane! We'd plow through the water in displacement fashion at maybe 10 mph. That problem disappeared when I added a Hydrofoil Stabilizer. Never had any problems turning with the boat while using the device.

In a marginally powered craft, it might make all the difference. So, I am in favor of keeping it under such circumstances.

-BWR

 

[ziggy]

Re: No tail

good thing ya took it off before ya hit something and it broke yer ventalation plate off. that's what my hydrofoil on my last boat did for me...

 

[QC]

Re: No tail

There is no question that they can improve time to plane, but there is also no question that hydrofoils can add some less than desirable handling characteristics as well. Your experience seems consistent with lots of reports we have seen here. I would also say that very small planing hulls do seem to benefit the most and suffer the fewest negatives.

For me any v-hull over 18 ft. can benefit from trim tabs. Helm adjustable if you are a tinkerer and the budget isn't an issue. SmartTabs if the opposite is true.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: No tail

I'm always amazed at the number "fin haters", not because I think they're great, just because they probably have no idea on what it actually does, or how to set it up for good results. If you experience handling problems, then your set up is wrong, even set up correctly it may do no good, but it won't do any harm either. Tabs are a better solution for most of the issues people want fixed though.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: No tail

the use of tabs puts the stress of lifting the stern where it belongs, one the bottom of the transom. foils put the stress on the top of the transom, via the motor mounting bolts. the foil lifts the motor, that lifts the stern of the boat.

 

[marquette]

Re: No tail

here in minnesota the fins that you see for sale and use are the standard delta wing shape. some with trolling plates and most not. and like every where esle the reaction is mixed to how well they work. but when i was in texas i noticed most of the fins were a rectangular shape. usually made of fairly heavy aluminum. i would have said most were about 1-2 in wider than the cavitation plate and stuck out about 12 in past the back of the motor. the outer edges were bent at a 90 degree angle down. the first one i saw i just thought it was home made. but after seeing several boats with them i decided that they must be commercially for sale. they were on flats and bay boats so i assume that their purpose was to provide lift to the motor for shallower running. i've never seen one for sale up here. does anybody know the advantage or disadvantage of the delta shape of fin vs the rectangular fin?

 

[NSBCraig]

Re: No tail

Was it a Bob's Machine Shop tail?

 

[marquette]

Re: No tail

some what like a Bob's machine tail. wider at the front. almost no taper front to back and the edges had a much more pronounced 90 degree bend. a couple also had braces that went between the back of the fin and higher up on the motor.

 

[IVAZ]

Re: No tail

I'm always amazed at the number "fin haters", not because I think they're great, just because they probably have no idea on what it actually does, or how to set it up for good results. If you experience handling problems, then your set up is wrong, even set up correctly it may do no good, but it won't do any harm either. Tabs are a better solution for most of the issues people want fixed though.

How can I "set up" something that is a fixed object.
I mean this respectfully.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: No tail

What people think they do and how people think they work, and what they can actually do, are two different things. What they can do is help eliminate ventilation during hard acceleration and at other times, this allows you to raise the motor higher, improving hole shot, top speed, RPM and possibly handling. This isn't needed on every boat, for some they have no value, it depends on the motor, hull, prop, and other things. If you don't do all the set up work, then you end up in the "fin haters club".
There's no way to do much set up on an I/O, so its more difficult to counteract the negative affects of the fin dragging in the water, possibly slowing the boat and causing handling issues. This is what happens to the bolt it on and go O/B guys.

If you just bolt one on with no changes in set up and realize any improvements and no problems you?re very lucky.

They are not designed to be in the water forcing the stern up by putting a lifting force on the motor. At low speeds some of this may take place, but on plane it should be out of the water. While some of the benefits may overlap what tabs can do, they are really two totally different tools designed for different jobs.

I can see how it would possibly make it easier to break off part of the AV plate with one installed, but I see broken AV plates and skegs frequently with no sign of a fin ever having been mounted. So just because the AV plate broke doesn't mean it was because of the fin.

 

[IVAZ]

Re: No tail

ondarvr,
What you are saying makes sense but does not apply to me since I do have an i/o configuration. On my set up the foil stays underwater all the time and at all speeds would lift the boat by using the sterndrive.
Thanks for clearing up the "set up" question.