Not 4 Wheel drive.

[Scott Danforth]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

unless your pulling a house, no reason to put the T-case into low - diesel or gas. next time, just put it in 4 hi, and all that has to happen is the front diff actuator just has to engage vs both the diff actuator and the T-case gear selector.

 

[snowman48047]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

No reason for 4-LO. unless your boat is HUGE and HEAVY. 4-HI is what I use to pull my fully loaded duck hunting rig up the ramp after other boats have been pulled and the ramp is icy....in November. I also carry a little rock salt for icy ramps or sand if it is snotty with weeds/algea.

 

[gpfishingdude]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

I will have to play around with the 4-HI and see how that works for me. Now that I know that the 4x4 light comes on even if it isn't in 4 wheel drive. Sounds like it should lock in to 4-HI easier. Now all I have to do is to figure out how I can tell ,for sure, when it shifts in to 4-HI.

 

[Fl_Richard]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

Its easy to tell - the steering tightens up and the tires grind on the pavement when you turn the wheel. It will generally start to "feel" allot more like a truck.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

I usually put mine in "auto" 4wd... so it will engage the front wheels, only if needed. I always thought if ever get into trouble and need to stab the throttle to pull out the boat... i wouldnt have time to select 4wd and wait for it to engage. I have never needed to gas it... and have never felt her engage. There was one time when the water was WAY down and i had to back really far in. There was slight wheel spin in the 1+ foot of sand. I use the ramp on the other side of the lake that has a steeper angle.

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

Ok, to engage LO range in almost every transfer case I have ever been around (GM products, admittedly) you have to put the transmission in Neutral. You found that out. It's weird that the front hubs didn't engage anyway, especially since the light lit up. But that's a Ford for ya!

 

[gpfishingdude]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

Ok, to engage LO range in almost every transfer case I have ever been around (GM products, admittedly) you have to put the transmission in Neutral. You found that out. It's weird that the front hubs didn't engage anyway, especially since the light lit up. But that's a Ford for ya!

Hey! My old Ford resents that remark. I finally read the owners manual and found out that I wasn't doing it right. I am lucky that I own a Ford that can take the kind of abuse that it gets from me. Yes you are right I am supposed to come to a full stop with my foot on the brake and the trans in neutral and then when I switch it into 4 LOW it takes a couple of seconds to engage. Just kidding about the resenting and appreciate all of the advice.

 

[oldjeep]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

Ok, to engage LO range in almost every transfer case I have ever been around (GM products, admittedly) you have to put the transmission in Neutral. You found that out. It's weird that the front hubs didn't engage anyway, especially since the light lit up. But that's a Ford for ya!

It is not always hubs that have to enguage. Now days you are more likely to have a front axle disconnect which sometimes requires you to drive while turning before the collar will line up connecting the 2 halfs of the long side shaft.

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

old jeep I know that, I am a GM man, they have had the engagement in the differential for years. "Hubs" was just a general term. But considering I still see Fords on the road with manual locking hubs, I think it was a good point.

I know I know, all you Ford guys love your manual locking hubs. And you might be right about them too. No front axle acuator to go bad like in the GMs.

 

[flightdoc]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

Everyone is saying 4 lo isn't required. And while I will agree it may not be required it is definitly nice to be able to take your foot off the brake and the engine starts to pull without any gas. Plus you get more effective torque to the ground without the chance of spinning. Same reason a lot of people use it when they are on the trails climbing steep dirt hills. More traction with less gas.

 

[jkust]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

Everyone is saying 4 lo isn't required. And while I will agree it may not be required it is definitly nice to be able to take your foot off the brake and the engine starts to pull without any gas. Plus you get more effective torque to the ground without the chance of spinning. Same reason a lot of people use it when they are on the trails climbing steep dirt hills. More traction with less gas.

Lots of people are down on 4wd it seems in general or have it and amazingly haven't located terrain where it was 4x4 or you don't go. I always want it even if I never use it. Luck favors the prepared. The mindset and the need is regional. I can think of many times where 4lo was a must have over the years.

 

[RogersJetboat454]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

FYI,
On your typical T-case, when you switch into 4 wheel low, the sets of gears for 4 low need a little bit of coddling to be engaged. As an example, think about shifting something with a manual transmission such as a motorcycle, a car, or even a dog clutch OB/OD through gears while the engine is off. The gears may not line up exactly if their associated shafts are not moving. Same goes for if the shafts are spinning too quick for the gears to mesh.

What I usually do to set a vehicle into 4 low is at a stop set the trans in neutral, select 4 wheel low, place it into gear with my foot on the brake. Slowly let off the brake, and it will usually go in once it starts rolling. Either that or, get the vehicle rolling at a very slow roll, place it into neutral, and select 4 low. As long as you are rolling slow enough, the gear-sets should change.

Pulling something in 4 low when you have limited traction can bite you in the @$$. Very easy to overwhelm the tires on a slick surface with the extra torque they have in 4 low.

 

[rbh]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

My .02c
4x4 are on the fly engaged in 4 high because the front and rear diffs are in sync (turning at the same rate) as the high gear in the tranfer case.
As soon as you want 4 low you need to sync the low gear with the speed of the transmisions output shaft, so you put it in neautral
(no speed/RPMs)

4 Low is all about control, slow backing is were it shines.

 

[BlueLightSpecial]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

Pulling something in 4 low when you have limited traction can bite you in the @$$. Very easy to overwhelm the tires on a slick surface with the extra torque they have in 4 low.

I agree, yet I disagree. It is possible to overcome the tire traction, however, the steeper the ratio, the less wheel speed. The less wheel speed, the less spin. Example. I had a 99 Trans Am, that I drag raced. It originally had 3.23 gears. I could spin, well past the 60 ft mark at the drag strip, spinning in to and through 2nd gear. I switched out the gears, for 4.10's, and I drastically REDUCED my spinning, and decreased my e/t. Nothing else changed on the car. same tires, same drag shocks, same auburn pro differential. This is real life example.

 

[RogersJetboat454]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

I Example. I had a 99 Trans Am, that I drag raced. It originally had 3.23 gears. I could spin, well past the 60 ft mark at the drag strip, spinning in to and through 2nd gear. I switched out the gears, for 4.10's, and I drastically REDUCED my spinning, and decreased my e/t. Nothing else changed on the car. same tires, same drag shocks, same auburn pro differential. This is real life example.

OK... But I'm sure you would agree there is a difference between a flat sticky drag strip with a street car, VS an inclined ramp with slime on it, and 4000 lbs or better holding the vehicle back.

Basic mechanical advantage. You are giving up distance per revolution for more torque, or leverage against the surface the tires are on.

 

[BlueLightSpecial]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

OK... But I'm sure you would agree there is a difference between a flat sticky drag strip with a street car, VS an inclined ramp with slime on it, and 4000 lbs or better holding the vehicle back.

Basic mechanical advantage. You are giving up distance per revolution for more torque, or leverage against the surface the tires are on.

Ok, well on the boat ramp this evening, I conducted a little test, with video to follow. The ramp I used is so slick with algae, that I fell on my @$$ getting out of my truck. In 4lo, I spun about a half revolution with my tires. Switched to 4hi. Using the same quick stab of the gas, I severely spun my wheels. I am not saying that you can't lose traction in 4lo, however, losing traction will be amplified by increased wheel speed in 4hi. My boat, with trailer weighs aapprox 3800#. My truck is a ram 1500, 5.7l, 3.92 gears.

 

[RogersJetboat454]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

Using the same quick stab of the gas, I severely spun my wheels

And this is the problem with your test. Snapping the throttle on a slick ramp is going to make the wheels spin no matter how the gearing is set up. In 4 Low the wheels didn't spin as fast, but I assure you, had more torque to break them free.

It has always been my understanding that careful application of power is what helps you on slick surfaces, whether it be slime on the ramp, or ice and snow on the road. Gently feathering the gas as to not overwhelm the limited traction the tires have. This is why some people also have better luck on slick surfaces after applying the parking brake a few clicks, or resting their foot on the service brake. It limits the amount of wheel spin potential. It's just about the same thing that traction control does for you. It monitors the ABS channels, and applies the brakes accordingly to the wheels that are slipping, while also limiting the throttle angle.

 

[BlueLightSpecial]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

What's wrong with my test? You said, as above " it is easy to overwhelm the tires in 4lo when towing" did you not? I tried to "overwhelm" the tire with a stab to the go pedal. Lack of wheel speed prevailed. 4lo did not lose traction as much as 4hi. Now, if we where in the mud, know doubt 4lo can put you in a bind. You need the wheel speed of 4hi to keep the tire tread cleaned out. But my test proved what I wanted to prove. Of course throttle control is the first thing you do to maintain traction. And you are right, the extra torque does require less pedal effort for the tires to slip, but the "window" of slippage I greatly reduced, compared to 4hi.

 

[RogersJetboat454]

Re: Not 4 Wheel drive.

What's wrong with my test? You said, as above " it is easy to overwhelm the tires in 4lo when towing" did you not? I tried to "overwhelm" the tire with a stab to the go pedal. Lack of wheel speed prevailed. 4lo did not lose traction as much as 4hi. Now, if we where in the mud, know doubt 4lo can put you in a bind. You need the wheel speed of 4hi to keep the tire tread cleaned out. But my test proved what I wanted to prove. Of course throttle control is the first thing you do to maintain traction. And you are right, the extra torque does require less pedal effort for the tires to slip, but the "window" of slippage I greatly reduced, compared to 4hi.

The whole point is to NOT allow the tires to break free. Four wheel high has LESS leverage against the tires then four wheel low, therefore it is LESS likely to break the tires free. You aren't pulling this boat down a drag strip. We're on a slick ramp, or even worse, sand and gravel, where ZERO tire slip is desired. It's allot harder to make zero tire slip happen when you have more leverage, and the vehicle is more sensitive to the amount of throttle applied.

About 10 years or better ago, allot of uppity car manufacturers offered a "winter mode" in their automatic transmission cars before traction control became the norm. What did this do? It placed the vehicles transmission in second or third gear from a stop, to prevent the vehicle from applying too much torque to the wheels, preventing them from spinning on ice and snow. Why? Cuz spinning tires, whether they are spinning fast or slow, make little-to no traction.

But hey...
You can pull your boat out in what ever gear you like. We can agree to disagree, yes?

Round my area, any form of tire spin only digs ditches into the lake stones until you eventually high center the truck. The truck that pulls those trucks out are usually placed in four low.... while sitting on dry, clean pavement.