Pick a Problem

[Evinrude Trouble]

I have an older model (early 60's?) 5hp evinrude. When i got it it has obviously been used in salt water because the entire cooling system was coroded. Took off head and water jacket cleaned put on new gasket, retorqued, put all new seals and gaskets in carb,new low speed needle, new fuel pump, new lower unit seals and impeller, not water in lower unit oil, changed spark plug. when i have it on the water it will only start and run with the engine cover off. Any suggestions as to what i'm doin wrong. At low RPM it runs rough, and when i cut out the throtle the motor has what i can only describe as a brief epileptic seizure before dying. It usuall starts first pull once its warm and the covers off. At WOT i dont think the motor is putting out the rpm's it should and it sounds like there is an intermittent miss

I also have a few question about the motor, it only has the low speed adjustment needele, is there supposed to be a high speed one? There is no hole in the housing for an additional adjustment needle to stick out. Are the points supposed to look like coins stacked directly on top of each other or is there an off set? could there be somthing wrong with the fuel tank? when i'm out there i have pumped the primer bulb and nothing really happens

I really wana get this motor runnin tip top and it sound like i got a ways to go before i get there, but i consider myself moderately mechanically inclined and dont mind a little blood and sweat in to get it goin

Any input from pro's out there that have had similar problems would be greatly appreciated

 

[Xcusme]

Re: Pick a Problem

Welcome to iboats.

It sounds like you've got most things covered, carb, fuel pump, water pump etc.
Rough running with the cover on points to an exhaust leak into the cowling that chokes the motor with fumes. Usually replacing the powerhead exhaust gasket and/or shift rod rubber seal fixes the problem.
Loss of WOT power can point to a couple of things. Check that you're getting spark to both cylinders and the coils aren't cracked. You'll have to pull the flywheel for this. Check the point gaps, they should be set at .020. Easy way to set points, rotate crankshaft until keyway on crankshaft is aligned with the point set rub block (part that contacts point cam) , then make .020 setting. Rotate crankshaft 180 degrees to the other set of points and do the same adjustment. The contact surfaces of the points should align and those surfaces should not be pitted. You can burnish the contacts with 400-800 grit emery and then adjust as needed. Replacement points are available too.
If the coils have cracks , replace them, they're cheap. It couldn't hurt to get some compression figures too. At least have them handy as a baseline for future servicing.

Your motor may have only a low speed idle adjustment needle, and a fixed high speed jet. No adjustment for the high speed mixture is possible.

The tank hose primer is just that , a primer, pump it until firm. This primes the carb with fuel, the fuel pump draws fuel for the tank through vacuum.

 

[Evinrude Trouble]

Re: Pick a Problem

Where is the powerhead exhaust gasket and/or shift rod rubber seal fixes the problem, this motor has no reverse. Are the points supposed to look like two tiny nickels stacked directly on top pf eack other i am not very good with electrical systems i know it has a magnet on the fly wheel? How do i tell if i have a bad coil, the condensers ( things that liik like batteries?) appeared to look ok, I had to use a helicoil to put a new spark plug seat in do you think that would have anything to do with it? Do any of these problems sound like float problems? Any suggestions as how to find an exhause leak? I looked at my points and they do not aline with each other could this be my problem?

 

[Evinrude Trouble]

Re: Pick a Problem

Where is the powerhead exhaust gasket and/or shift rod rubber seal , this motor has no reverse. Are the points supposed to look like two tiny nickels stacked directly on top of eack other and if they arent could this be my problem? i am not very good with electrical systems i know it has a magnet on the fly wheel? How do i tell if i have a bad coil, the condensers ( things that liik like batteries?) appeared to look ok, I had to use a helicoil to put a new spark plug seat in do you think that would have anything to do with it? Do any of these problems sound like float problems? Any suggestions as how to find an exhause leak?

 

[Xcusme]

Re: Pick a Problem

OK, before we get too involved in the details, post the model number of your motor so we know what we're talking about here. A service manual is a very good investment if you plan on wrenching your own motor. All service procedures are outlined and most of your questions will be answered within. Factory manuals are the best and can be found on Eb*y

That said, the coils sometimes show cracks, replace them if cracked. Condensers are seldom a problem, and usually a bad condenser will kill the spark to a cylinder. Helicoil has no effect except in the rare event it's not sealing the threads etc. Float problems can show up as fuel delivery issues where the carb either floods (float needle stays open) or sticks closed ( starving the carb for fuel).

 

[Evinrude Trouble]

Re: Pick a Problem

I have the manual and striped down the engine last night but forgot to get the model/serial# I inspected the coils and could not find any cracks. I have stripped the engine down to just the block and its internal components. When i removed the plate that has the coils on underneath the fly wheel there was a little bit of oil around the crank shaft. To my knowledge i have been the only one to actually work on this motor so i dont think the crank shaft seal has ever been replaced. How do you tell if one is bad? You were right about the exhaust leak. the gasket in between the block and the lower unit will need to be replaced. How important is exhaust pressure? With this leak in the exhaust system could this be part of my performance problem? When i pulled the block off the lower unit in the exhaust area i notice alot of carbon and oil build up is this a sign of a bigger problem?

 

[Evinrude Trouble]

Re: Pick a Problem

I did some research and found out that the model# and year is 5802E 1968, i hope this helps.

 

[Xcusme]

Re: Pick a Problem

Any leaking of the upper crankshaft seal can deposit oil residue , which, if bad enough, can spray oil onto the point sets, causing misfires to the cylinders. You have determined that the exhaust gasket is bad, and is easy enough to replace. That should take care of the issue of rough running with the cover attached. The motor's exhaust tube , and the exhaust pressure are integral to the proper running of the motor and the development of full power. This is why it's best to make final carb mixture adjustments with the motor on the boat and in the lake. It's not a good idea to try to make final carb adjustments if you run the motor on muffs, as there's no back pressure on the exhaust tube. Never run a motor on muffs much more than idle speed.
Clean out as much carbon deposits as you can from the exhaust ports to insure proper exhaust flow. Severely blocked exhaust ports can cause major performance issues as the motor can't aspirate properly. Occasional decarbing of the motor can help reduce the formation of carbon deposits. The oil deposits at the exhaust tube are from unburned fuel and are expected. This excess oil can drip from the lower tube after the motor has been run at trolling speeds for extended times. Often running the motor at WOT for a bit helps blow this excess oil from the exhaust system. A missing cylinder or overly oil mixed fuel can produce more of this excess oil in the exhaust.

You sort of jumped into the exhaust gasket repair thing before you addressed the low speed idle mixture issue, but no matter, it needed to be repaired anyway. After you replace the gasket, it shouldn't be a problem to adjust the mixture screw accurately.
As long as your compression figures are OK, you have good spark to both cylinders and the carb is clean, if should run fine at full power. Take it one problem at a time.

 

[Evinrude Trouble]

Re: Pick a Problem

I know a little bit about carbs, but have never had exhaust problems before and never considerd it to be my problem. I wish i had a compression tester so i could confirm good compression. I'll ask around and maybe a buddy will have one. How many PSI should the compression be? I know from reading posts that a big difference between the two cylinders is bad news. I am totally tearing down the engine for a complete rebuild replacing all seals and gaskets, any advice as to what i might want to pay special attention to? Is there such a thing as an engine running too cool? It shows that there is a thermostat in the book but there is not one on the motor. Is this piece really important for warm weather operation?

Thanks for all the help Xcusme

 

[Xcusme]

Re: Pick a Problem

Well, getting compression numbers should have been one of the first things to be done, before you get this far, but you're already there. As you have read, the numbers aren't so important, unless they're really low, but should be within 10% of each other. Due to the differences between compression gauges, the numbers can vary. Removal of the exhaust port cover can help you to determine if the rings are stuck etc. The service manual should be a big help with the rebuild. It's the little things that can make the difference too. Mark the rod cap pairs with alignment marks so that you're sure they go back on the same rod/piston. Be mindful that you install the pistons with the crowns facing the right way etc. Clean everything. Use only an anerobic type case sealer , Loctite 518 or equal and so on. As for the thermostat, replace it and don't run the motor without one. The thermostat will keep the motor running at it's design temperature, regardless of the weather.

 

[F_R]

Re: Pick a Problem

Because they were a competative cheapo motor, the 5hp came from the factory without a thermostat. The thermostat was an optional accessory to make it run better in cold water.