Power Pack failures

racerone

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Dec 28, 2013
Messages
38,454
Unfortunately wires and voltage / amps / ohms are hard to understand at times.
 

Fed

Commander
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Apr 1, 2010
Messages
2,457
It's the other way around ondarvr, when the wires come apart it won't stop.

1996 pulling the lanyard physically turns the key switch to OFF, there is no separate kill switch. (I think)
 

dingbat

Supreme Mariner
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Nov 20, 2001
Messages
16,320


It makes contact when it's in place, pulled out it opens the circuit, when no lanyard switch is in place the wires need to be connected. He doesn't have a lanyard switch to leave the lanyard in, neither did I.
Then its different from mine where the clip fits under the key. Start motor with clip, pull clip, motor stops.

Restarts without the clip. A safety feature according to the manual.
JOHNSON%20EVINRUDE%20SWITCH%20176408.jpg
 

ondarvr

Supreme Mariner
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Apr 6, 2005
Messages
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Mine was a 98', I found out about the wires because they fell out from under the console and had only been twisted together, stuck them together and it started.
 

Fed

Commander
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Apr 1, 2010
Messages
2,457
Could have been the neutral safety switch wires or some other wires ondarvr.
 

ondarvr

Supreme Mariner
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Apr 6, 2005
Messages
11,527
Could have been, but it had been converted from a lanyard key switch to a non lanyard key switch . If it was the neutral safety switch then reverse everything I said.
 

Marc Peternell

Petty Officer 3rd Class
Joined
Dec 21, 2013
Messages
97
Even if his ignition switch did have a lanyard, wouldn't it have made it irrelevant when he disconnected the black/yellow wire at the Power Pack? Or disconnected the black/yellow wire at the switch?
 

heypawpaw

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
111
Had same problem on 1996 Evenrude 88spl, no fire to any cylinder. After checking and cleaning all connections (those in your picture) and connections & grounds on coils still no fire. Removed power pack cleaned ground where powerpack mounts to engine and that was the problem. NOTE: While checking connections where powerpack wires plug to coils I noticed two wires had cracked insulation and copper strands had greenish corrosion, though all plugs fired OK I replaced the powerpack.
 

Cptkid570

Ensign
Joined
Oct 18, 2005
Messages
967
Well. I tried a new ignition switch and a new power pack. Still the same issue. So, at least I've eliminated those 2 as the problem
 

gm280

Supreme Mariner
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Jun 26, 2011
Messages
14,605
You need to understand that the stator doesn't fire up the spark. The stator is simply there to charge the battery via a rectifier and nothing else. You have another system that controls the spark.

On your engine there is a Timer Base and Sensor Assembly (P/N 0583379) and a separate Stator Assembly (P/N 0583536 or P/N 0511829 depending on your model number), a Power Pack (P/N 0584028), a Rectifier Assembly (P/N 0585195) and separate Spark Coils (P/N 0582508). So there are a lots of things to test before buying parts and swapping things out to trouble-shoot.

You can rule out the stator assembly first thing. It doesn't have anything to do with the spark. The flywheel spinning fires up the timer base and sensor assembly to fire the power pack and then the spark coils.And I would basically forget the spark coils as well because what are the odds of all the spark coils (all four of them) going bad at the exact same time? I know, you can't say never, but I wouldn't suspect them at this time.

So that leaves the timer/sensor base and power pack. If there is a test for the power pack, maybe someone an explain that because I have no idea what to look for from the timer/sensor base going to the power pack to run a test. To get to the timer/sensor base will require you to remove the flywheel. JMHO
 

Fed

Commander
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Apr 1, 2010
Messages
2,457
Just so we're all on the same page here.

OMC refer to the windings that create power for the battery as Stator Windings. Let's say 14-15 Volts.
OMC refer to the windings that create power for the ignition as Charge Coils. Let's say a few hundred Volts.

Here's my take for what it's worth.

The magnets zipping around create an alternating magnetic field in the stator iron core which energize the Stator Windings & the Charge Coil.

Here's the rub, if you checked & understood the CDI website you would have seen the say to disconnect the rectifier as part of the testing for loss of spark.

Why would they say that if the Stator Windings & the Charge coil are electrically isolated?
Because they both use the same magnetism, a short circuit in the rectifier will 'quench' the magnetic field in the stator iron core and not leave enough magnetism to operate the Charge Coil. A short circuit or ground fault in the stator windings will have the same effect as a shorted rectifier.
Note: Being a V4 with only 1 powerpack I believe you only have 1 Charge Coil, V6s have 2.

Pay special attention to the terms Stator Windings & Charge Coil.

Help us to help you.
How did you test for spark?
Test your Stator Windings (Yellow wires) for resistance & ground faults. Depending on Model the resistance should be around 1 Ohm with NO ground faults.
Test your Charge Coil, (Should plug into powerpack) for resistance & ground faults. Check with CDI for values.
 

Cptkid570

Ensign
Joined
Oct 18, 2005
Messages
967
Thank you everyone. I'm learning a lot from this discussion (along with books and youtube).. I used one of those inline ignition spark tester things (spark plug wires with the glass in the middle) to test for spark. I tried a new power pack and it wasn't the power pack. If the stator doesn't provide spark for the power pack, t hen I'd assume that I need to test the timer base?
 

Fed

Commander
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Apr 1, 2010
Messages
2,457
Can't help with the timer base, to me OIS comes under magic.
 

cfauvel

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Aug 16, 2005
Messages
645
Just so we're all on the same page here.

OMC refer to the windings that create power for the battery as Stator Windings. Let's say 14-15 Volts.
OMC refer to the windings that create power for the ignition as Charge Coils. Let's say a few hundred Volts.

Here's my take for what it's worth.

The magnets zipping around create an alternating magnetic field in the stator iron core which energize the Stator Windings & the Charge Coil.

Here's the rub, if you checked & understood the CDI website you would have seen the say to disconnect the rectifier as part of the testing for loss of spark.

Why would they say that if the Stator Windings & the Charge coil are electrically isolated?
Because they both use the same magnetism, a short circuit in the rectifier will 'quench' the magnetic field in the stator iron core and not leave enough magnetism to operate the Charge Coil. A short circuit or ground fault in the stator windings will have the same effect as a shorted rectifier.
Note: Being a V4 with only 1 powerpack I believe you only have 1 Charge Coil, V6s have 2.

Pay special attention to the terms Stator Windings & Charge Coil.

Help us to help you.
How did you test for spark?
Test your Stator Windings (Yellow wires) for resistance & ground faults. Depending on Model the resistance should be around 1 Ohm with NO ground faults.
Test your Charge Coil, (Should plug into powerpack) for resistance & ground faults. Check with CDI for values.



^^^^^ is the correct answer ^^^^^^^

timer base DOES NOT create the voltage to charge up the capacitors to throw at the COIL to throw at the plugs.
stator produces 150-400v, the capacitors holds the voltage, the timer base (producing something like 4 volts) tells the power pack which plug needs to receive volts...powerpack dumps the 150v+ volts to the coil, the coil is a step up transformer and produces something like 20,000 volts that goes to the plug.


to properly test the stator, you will need a multimeter, a DVA Adapter (from CDI electronics) that fits in your meter and a set of at least 5 jumper wires (also from CDI)..

a test for Stator Windings (yellow wires)...disconnect both wires from the terminal block...with a multimeter set for continuity , one lead on one yellow wire and other lead to ground..There should be NO continuity....the ohm test would be between yellow and yellow wire (these two tests don't need the DVA adapter or jumpers)

You'll be testing OHMs for both the Stator Windings and Charge Coils, and voltage using the DVA adapter
AC for testing the Charge Coil and DC for the Stator windings (the yellow wires to regulator).

if you can see the underside of the flywheel....check to see if the magnets are not boogered up or loose....they HAVE to be evenly spaced...
also check for melted goo (epoxy potting material from the windings) dripping down onto the block's top.
 

Cptkid570

Ensign
Joined
Oct 18, 2005
Messages
967
It was the stator. I don't like throwing parts at something.. especially electrical stuff.. but, after I knew it wasn't the ignition switch, power pack, or coils.. I took the flywheel off and checked out the stator. Did some ohm tests on it and it failed.. still uncertain of my skills (lol), i grabbed a used one off of ebay and threw it on there. Motor started right up. So, it is working again. Thank you everyone for your help! I've always been an I/O guy, so I am learning more and more about outboards now.. This little venture taught me so much about the electrical parts on this motor and where they are and what their function is. Thank you again.
 

Fed

Commander
Joined
Apr 1, 2010
Messages
2,457
Good stuff Cpt, was it the stator windings (yellow wires) or the charge coil and what readings did you get to call it faulty?
 

Cptkid570

Ensign
Joined
Oct 18, 2005
Messages
967
The two wires that go to the power pack had no continuity. Read no Ohms at all. Now.. I don't know if that was right or not.. and there was some goo/melted stuff coming out of my stator too. So, I figured I'd throw a used part at it and see if it was that..
 
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