prop decision

shrpshtr

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Apr 12, 2011
Messages
33
hey all,

i have been considering upgrading my 3-blade prop to a 4-blade and would like some opinions from you experts. the 3-blade i have on it now is pretty worn (all 3 blades are curled/bent pretty good) and is the original 14.25" x 21 pitch prop. the ratio is 1.62:1. i have a mercruiser 5.0l w/the Alpha 1 stern in my Sea Ray 205 Sport. i checked it this weekend at the lake and i was getting 46-47mph @ 4500RPM at WOT in relatively calm conditions under normal weight load.

i am looking to improve the overall performance of the boat. the top end speed doesn't matter quite as much as the hole shot to me (currently 6.75 seconds) but i don't want to lose several MPH. i would like to be able to stay on plane going < 20mph. i would like to improve gas mileage as much as possible. are these goals obtainable and what prop(s) would you all recommend? thanks in advance.

shrpshtr
 

1980Coronado

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Oct 8, 2010
Messages
699
Re: prop decision

Those numbers don't look bad to me. Running them through a prop calculator I get 15% slip which is good. The curl/bend you see in your prop may just be cupping....unless you're saying you hit something and the prop is damaged. A cupped prop has the tip of the blades "bent" slightly to improve performance. What is the engines recommended max WOT (wide open throttle) RPM? I'm guessing it's 4400-4800 rpm, which means you're running within the range at 4500.

1.) What is a "normal" load? Was the boat loaded (full tank of gas and several people) when you ran your test (4500 rpm 46-47mph)...or was the load light...just you and a half tank of gas?
-If the boat was loaded and you got those numbers I'd say the prop you have was a good match.
-If you were lightly loaded, then you may be able to gain a couple hundred rpm by reducing the pitch by 1" by reworking your current prop. This would give you a better hole shot, but may cost you a couple mph on the top.

2.) Is the prop actually damaged? If you're running a damaged prop and getting those numbers, then I'd get the prop fixed and test it again to see if you even need to change it. You may find that repairing the current prop gives you the performance that you want. I wouldn't get all caught up in the 3 blade vs 4 blade hole shot hype. It's not going to be a night and day difference, and you'll have to either reduce the pitch or diameter in a 4 blade to make up for the increased blade area or the WOT rpm will be reduced.

3.) A prop will not change the speed at which your boat planes. The speed at which your boat planes, is a function of hull design and you can't change it with a prop.

The bottom line I see here is that the prop you have is giving you decent performance. If you want to gain a couple hundred rpm for better hole shot when skiing, your top end will likely be less by a couple mph. What I would do is get a baseline with a light load....just you in the boat. Get up on plane, go WOT and trim-up a little to get the nose up. Use a tachometer you trust, and measure your speed with a gps. If your rpm is near the maximum for the engine with a light load you're propped correctly. Your rpm will be higher than 4500 with just you in the boat, if your test was done with multiple people on board. You don't want to be able to over-rev the engine with a light load. Then you know with a loaded boat you should still be able to get up on plane and you know the rpm will be less at WOT.
 

shrpshtr

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Apr 12, 2011
Messages
33
Re: prop decision

Coronado, thanks for the great reply. to answer your questions:

1- "normal" load was about 1/2 tank of gas and the wife and i with our normal gear. a few life jackets, floats, fold up chairs, miscellaneous items, etc. it's about how the boat is loaded on each outing except i top the tank off each time we go take the boat out.

2- the prop is definitely damaged. i bought the boat used in March and its clearly been dinged a couple of times. the bends i am seeing don't look consistent enough to indicate they were made like that on purpose. they more resemble if you were to take a pair of pliers and grap a spot on the blade and bend it away from the boat. the entire blade isn't bent, just in spots on each blade.

3- i am not necessarily concerned about what speed the boat planes at more than i am about what speed it comes off plane if that makes sense. example - running down the lake and need to slow down to go through rivers, over passes or just general cruising and low speeds. no matter how i trim it out now the boat rides nose high when < 20 mph. when we're cruising longer runs with multiple boats, etc. it be great to be able to plane while riding. staying on plane is more where i am concerned about the fuel efficiency improving. i imagine the mpg has to be better on plane than when plowing the boat through the water nose up like that.

overall i really don't mind giving up a couple of mph for a better hole shot and slower plane speeds. that is, if i can truly accomplish those things with a 4 blade vs 3 blade. are you saying the performance difference in those ares would be minimal? thoughts?

thanks again for your help.

shrpshtr
 

SparkieBoat

Captain
Joined
Aug 17, 2009
Messages
3,643
Re: prop decision

trim tabs will help a lot with hole shot and staying on a plane at lower speeds, you still need the right prop though. 4blades are good for low-mid RPM range performance.
 

1980Coronado

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Oct 8, 2010
Messages
699
Re: prop decision

Well, with a damaged prop it's hard to get a baseline. I'm assuming you have an aluminum prop. You could use a hammer and block of wood to backup the blades and reshape the areas that are "bent". Then use a file to take any burrs off the edges. If you have areas on the leading edge that are missing chunks of material you can have the prop welded and reconditioned as long as it's not too far gone. They can even re-pitch the prop down or up from where it's at now with limitations. With the performance you're reporting, it seems as if the prop is repairable. If you feel any vibration you need to get it fixed or replaced....which is why you are asking these questions I presume.

What you are describing with regard to riding nose high at less than 20 mph is just indicative of an I/O. I'm afraid it's just the nature of the beast. You have all of the weight of the engine and outdrive in the rear, so when you take off or slow down the nose rares up until you are on or off plane. Trimming all the way down is the best you can do in this case. When the outdrive is down/in, the propeller is pushing downward past horizontal which tends to raise the stern. When you are up on plane trimming up a bit raises the nose up so that less of the hull is in contact with the water and that allows the rpm to come up and hence speed goes up correspondingly. Unfortunately there is no way to change the speed at which you come off plane or get on plane with a prop, it is purely a function of the hull design and weight distribution of the boat. The rpm at which you get on plane or come off plane is affected by the prop, but not the speed...it's basically a constant for your setup. Getting as much weight forward as possible is your only option.

Think of a prop as a gear. A boat is like a car, but with only one gear. That gear has to perform through the entire rpm range of the engine. If the gear is too big (ie: pitch too large) the motor will struggle to get the boat out of the hole, but will have more top end speed. If the gear is too small (ie: pitch too small), the boat will snap out of the hole but have less top end and you run the risk of over revving the motor. Diameter affects the performance in a similar fashion, because as the diameter is reduced or increased, the surface area in contact with the water decreases and increases.

A 4 blade prop will have more surface area in contact with the water, and hence more push to get you up on plane...hole shot. However, you still have to size it such that you don't over-rev at WOT under a "normal" load. I like to size mine such that with a light load (just me in the boat with a normal load of fuel), I'm close to or right at the maximum WOT recommended for the motor. This way I know that it is never possible to over-rev the engine, and I have basically maximized the overall performance.

One of the characteristics of a 4-blade will be that you can hold a set speed easier when towing a skier/boarder. With an I/O it's hard to hold that 12-15 mph speed because the boat is in that transition between plane and off plane, so you are constantly playing with the throttle to stay at a constant speed for a skier/boarder. A 4-blade may help in that situation.

I have a 454 big block inboard and just changed from a 14 x14 3-blade to a 13 x 16 4-blade. I did not notice any drastic difference in hole shot, it's probably a little quicker out of the hole. I like the fact that I can put 8-9 adults in it and still get up and go. I could probably get more speed out of it with a 14 x 16 but with that prop it would take a while to get up and go with 8-9 people. The I/O and Inboard are an apples oranges comparison, but the principles are the same.

You'll just have to try a couple different props to see what works with how you want to use the boat, keeping in mind that you want the WOT rpm to be in upper end of the 4400-4800 range with a light load.
 
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