quick question regarding epoxy and waterproofing

proshine43

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Sep 5, 2010
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Hello. Im about to lay the floor, first i want to waterproof the bottom of the deck. Im using epoxy. Do i need to add a layer of mat down or just coat it with epoxy. The top will get one layer of 1.5 csm and 2 layers of 6 oz eglass using epoxy. Thanks for your help.
 

Woodonglass

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Dec 29, 2009
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Re: quick question regarding epoxy and waterproofing

If you're using epoxy you NEVER use CSM. It is a waste of time and money. You only need cloth.
 

proshine43

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Sep 5, 2010
Messages
161
Re: quick question regarding epoxy and waterproofing

Ok, so no csm, thats good to know, thanks. So just a couple of coats of epoxy on bottom and edges and the 2 layers of eglass on top? Im using 1708 to tab into the hull. Thanks again.
 

ondarvr

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Re: quick question regarding epoxy and waterproofing

CSM and epoxy on a flat surface is just fine:
http://www.westsystem.com/ss/chopped-strand-mat-epoxy/

The recommendation to not use CSM with epoxy has nothing to do with whether it "can" be used in some situations with epoxy.

Mat has the least amount of strength when compared to other types of glass, it also absorbs the most resin, so you end up using more epoxy and creating a heavier more costly laminate that is weaker. Also epoxy has no need for CSM in the same way Polyester does, so using it is of little or no value.
 

Tahorover

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Re: quick question regarding epoxy and waterproofing

The recommendation to not use CSM with epoxy has nothing to do with whether it "can" be used in some situations with epoxy.

Mat has the least amount of strength when compared to other types of glass, it also absorbs the most resin, so you end up using more epoxy and creating a heavier more costly laminate that is weaker. Also epoxy has no need for CSM in the same way Polyester does, so using it is of little or no value.

So I guess West Systems is clueless when it come to epoxy?:rolleyes:
 

Woodonglass

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Re: quick question regarding epoxy and waterproofing

TR, Did you READ what YOUR Source SAID

Can WEST SYSTEM? epoxy be used to wet out chopped strand mat? The answer is yes. The fiberglass strand in mat wets out with epoxy, but the binder holding things together does not dissolve. (It does get put into suspension and is sealed in the cured epoxy.) This undissolved binder causes the wet-out mat to remain a bit stiff compared to wet out with a styrene-based resin. For gently curving or flat projects like cabin soles or plywood decks, mat and epoxy should work fine. The fabric does not wet out perfectly clear with epoxy. Wet-out clarity of mat with epoxy varies somewhat with different suppliers, but none of them wet out as clear as a good 4 oz or 6 oz fiberglass cloth.
The texture of the chopped strand mat is quite rough given its random fibers (many of which come loose when epoxy is applied). Mat requires a number of coats of epoxy to fill the profile at the surface. 879 Release Fabric can be applied over the freshly wet-out mat to compress the fibers and minimize the need for many of the buildup coats. Using release fabric in this way will result in a much smoother surface, and if you are going to allow the epoxy to cure before continuing, the surface is ready for buildup coats of epoxy or fairing putty after the release fabric is removed.
4 mil plastic sheeting can also be used over the still uncured epoxy and mat to compress the fibers. Trapped air bubbles can be removed by piercing or slitting the plastic over the bubble before the epoxy begins to cure. If the plastic was clean when it was applied, you can pull the plastic after the epoxy cures to a hard gel and apply epoxy fairing putty or buildup coats of epoxy later the same day. If you allow the epoxy to cure hard before pulling the plastic, be sure to sand the surface completely dull before applying more epoxy.
When choosing chopped strand mat to be used with epoxy, look for mat that is soft and pliable. Some forms are quite stiff and may cause problems wetting out with epoxy. Stiff mat is often older stock and the fibers may take more time to wet out with epoxy.

So WHERE's the benefit????:rolleyes:
 

ondarvr

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Apr 6, 2005
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Re: quick question regarding epoxy and waterproofing

So I guess West Systems is clueless when it come to epoxy?:rolleyes:

They would like epoxy to be used where ever and when ever possible to increase their sales, so saying epoxy can be used with mat works in their interest. As a supplier of polyester I would like you to add more mat to every layup too, it can increase resin usage dramatically.

There was nothing in the quote's from West Systems that said CSM was of any value, only that it could be used. There was nothing in my comments that said it couldn't be used, only that it was of no value.

West Systems does not make epoxy, they buy it from other companies, nor do they make the binders that are used in mat. The company I work for makes our resin in our plants, we also make the binders used on CSM.
 
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