So frustrated/can't decide

[PaxnChris]

I posted a couple of days ago with three used boats my husband and I were looking at. We are completely new to boating and just really want to make the right choice for our pocket book and family.

My husband looked at a Reinell that the seller are firm on price. Here's that ad:

**$16,00000 2005 Reinell 205 20ft
Roy, UT 84067 - Jul 26, 2010
2005 REINELL 205 20ft V8 260 HP 155 Hrs
Bimini Top
Stereo AM/FM CD player W/4 speaker
Batteries-Dual W/Switch
Fre Ext 75-100 CU
Fuel Injection
Swim Step
Extented Pylon
Wake board Racks
Wake board Tower
Wake board Speaker

Dual axel trailer. Very Clean Boat. Must See**

I went and looked with him today and I can't believe how small the interior felt. Imaging the five of us (we have 3 girls) in the boat made me feel cramped and it had very little storage. The bench seat was so close to the driver/passenger seats that my knees almost touched. Therefore I really think we need to rule that boat out. It did appear to be well maintained but does not come with a cover and that bothers me too.

We also looked at a 1999 Sea Ray. Here's that ad:

**$12,00000 firm
190 BR SeaRay Wake Tower Open Bow V8 5.0 EFI!! Sea Ray
bountiful, UT 84087 - Jul 29, 2010
Beautiful 1999 Sea Ray in excellent condition V8 5.0 merc 240hp!! Alpha 1 Fuel injected EFI engine Great Mileage with tons of power! Always stored indoors and the pictures prove the condition. No flaws in the interior. Go see all the poorly kept boats first and then stop and see mine last, you will not be disappointed. Brand new trailer tires and recent bearing service.

Looking to upgrade to a larger boat, has been flawless SeaRay is the best!! Well Maintained at the dealership Duce marine and Marine Max since new!**

This boat has been very well maintained with two owners and maintenace records. There are only two spots on the upholstry that are beginning to crack slightly and may eventually tear without some repair. It feels nice and roomy. So it's still in the running.

Lastly, we looked at a 2007 Bayliner. Here's the ad:

**$15,50000 2007 BAYLINER 195 BR SPECIAL EDITION - 5.0 V8 - TOWER
Centerville, UT 84014 - Jul 30, 2010
EXCELLENT CONDITION 2007 BAYLINER 195 RUNABOUT BOW RIDER SPECIAL EDITION MODEL, MERCRUISER 5.0 V8 ENGINE, TOWER, BIMINI SHADE TOP, BOW AND COCKPIT COVERS, STEREO WITH AUX. INPUT, EXTENDED SWIM PLATFORM, NEW 4 BLADE STAINLESS STEEL PROP, RUNS GREAT - 48 MPH AT WILLARD YESTERDAY, EVERYTHING GAURANTEED TO WORK.**

This boat has been very well kept with zero flaws to the interior. It is vefry roomy also with quite a lot of storage. After a long day of looking at boats, I came home and researched and am bummed to learn that Bayliner doesn't have a great reputation. Given that it is our first boat we may want to upgrade in a few years so I need to at least have resale value in the back of my brain.

The pros and cons for me are:
1. Bayliner is 8 years newer
2. SeaRay is fuel injected (Bayliner does have electric fuel pump)
3. Sea Ray is $3,500 less but again, it's 8 years older

Please, please give me any advice on this. Are there any points that you can share between the two that I may have missed?

Thank you so much!

 

[oops!]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

i am a big sea ray fan.

the newer bay liners are said to be better built than the older ones.

the ray will hold its value better.

so it comes down to personal choice at that point. and the features and feel of the two different boats.

a garage kept boat can be in better condition than a 3 year old boat thats not.

to further confuse you our guys on this site have tested the new bayliners and had great things to say about them.

perhaps post some more info on the two boats and we can better guide you

 

[Dave.Mishchenko]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

If you've been browsing the forum even lately you'll have seen that a debate on boat manufacturers can become a very emotional event. I own a 07 Bayliner and I'm very happy with it. But if I compare it with similar boats from other manufacturers the level of trim and manufacturing is noticeable and it equates to both a higher price (and higher resell value as stated in the last post). I don't have fiberglass floors so I need to pay attention to storage and keeping it dry when not in use. Likewise, I expect greater wear on the upholstery which you wouldn't get with other boat.

At some point Bayliner picked up a reputation for bad quality and it's been hard to shake. Imagine if Pintos were still made today, they might be an excellent quality car, reliable, etc, but you would still have a bad feeling because of their history. In your case you're sort of comparing an older Cadillac with a newer Chevy. If you want a Cadillac level of car, you'll go older rather than getting a newer Chevy.

Looking at the pictures the SeaRay looks well maintained and I think that's more critical than the manufacturer of the boat. I would look over the maintenance records to see what has been done with both (for example has the impeller been changed every year or two, has the drive been pulled each year for motor alignment, have the bellows been replaced on the SeaRay).

The SeaRay does look like it has been stored indoors, but I would still look in the locker, in the engine bay to verify that it has been dry (I would say that for any boat).

What sort of vehicle will you be using for towing and does either trailer have brakes? I would find out what the bearing service was exactly.

If you know someone who boats and does their own maintenance it would be worthwhile to take them along for a look as they may spot potential maintenance items. If you're serious about either definitely take it out for a trial run. You don't just want to start it out on muffs and listen as that won't reveal many potential issues for either. Here's a good checklist to use for a trial run - http://waterski.about.com/od/boats/a/buyused_boat.htm.

Good luck with your choice, and regardless of which you get I hope you have many happy years with it.

 

[PaxnChris]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

Thank you. We will be towing with a Dodge 2500 and neither trailer has brakes. The Sea Ray trailer is in pretty good condition and it's a dual axil. The Bayliner trailer is single axel (kind of bonus that it doesn't need to be registered therefore) and it's in very nice condition with almost new tires.
I was hoping to have an epiphany this morning about which boat to buy and I'm still worried we may make the wrong choice.

Is there anything to be said for the 8 years age difference in regard to problems ahead if both have been well maintained? Another problem we have here is that quality used boats sell very fast so we have to make a decision but want to do so armed with as much knowledge as possible. Unfortunately we don't have any boat owner friends or aquaintances that could help us ensure us either boat is in good mechanical order.

We will mostly be using a boat for leisure rides, tubing, wakeboarding and skiing. We have three little girls who will probably be bringing friends along from time-to-time.

 

[jfadool]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

Assuming that both boats are in good shape you can't make a "bad" choice. If you don't have any boating friends pay a professional to have a look at the boat you like best.

If it was me I would pick the Sea Ray. Mostly biased on price and fuel injection. On both boats remember that in the first year you are going to spend a good amount of money on extras and such.

I would think about adding brakes for both trailers, legally may be a requirement in your state. Both of those boats would need brakes in FL. But your 3/4ton will have no issues so that is good.

 

[sltintexas]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

i have a 97 searay 175. We had 7 people in it yesterday (3 adults 4 kids) with out issue. I giggle a little bit when I hear others with bigger boats complain of not enough space.

I love my sea ray.

The price does seem a little high to me for a 99 searay. At least in my area.

 

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

You say your family is new to boating. My question is, how new? Have you been out on boats before? Have you taken your girls out or have they been on boats? If not, I would suggest check with marinas in your area for rentals. Rent a boat first to see how everyone likes it. My one daughter did not care for boats for several years. Thanks to her friends that liked boats, they encourged her to go.

Before you purchase, I would ask for a trial of the boat in the water first. Different boats do handle differently. You would not know this if you bought the boat without trying it out first.

Good Luck in your adventure. Children grow up and out of things fast. Check all your options on several styles of boats with that in mind.

 

[PaxnChris]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

Thanks all. We actually have all been out on boats and my husband and I as well as out 12-year-old have gone water skiing on numerous ocassions. Our two youngest girls are age 3 and 20-months and both seemed to enjoy being on a boat.

I agree that we may outgrow the boat in the next few years and that is one reason why this decision has been so difficult. We have been burned with what we thought was the "perfect" house and when we sold 2.5 years later we lost $20,000. I guess that's why I'm so leary of larger purchases knowing that we may want to upgrade in 3-4 years.

The Searay may now be off the table because the seller raised the price to $13,200 after listing it for $12,000 firm.

Wondering if we should let the Bayliner do or not?

 

[jfadool]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

The Searay may now be off the table because the seller raised the price to $13,200 after listing it for $12,000 firm.

I would bet they take 12k cash. If not just walk away. There are other boats on the pond.

As for resale, its a boat they are not really known for holding value. You do have do to maintenance and upkeep. Its not really a cheap free time activity.

 

[Dave.Mishchenko]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

Thanks all. We actually have all been out on boats and my husband and I as well as out 12-year-old have gone water skiing on numerous ocassions. Our two youngest girls are age 3 and 20-months and both seemed to enjoy being on a boat.

I agree that we may outgrow the boat in the next few years and that is one reason why this decision has been so difficult. We have been burned with what we thought was the "perfect" house and when we sold 2.5 years later we lost $20,000. I guess that's why I'm so leary of larger purchases knowing that we may want to upgrade in 3-4 years.

The Searay may now be off the table because the seller raised the price to $13,200 after listing it for $12,000 firm.

Wondering if we should let the Bayliner do or not?

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=218&ad=11781294&cat=147&lpid=&search= - the price seems to be up to $132,000 . Did the seller give an indication as to the change of price? Oddly as I write this the original ad seems to be gone and there is this one - http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=218&ad=11703674&cat=&lpid=1&search=searay.

In what way do you think you'll outgrow the boat? If you plan to be serious about wakeboarding for example, it would be best to get a good boat for that now. If you want larger, better to get it now.

As mentioned you have to be prepared for the extra costs over the next few years. If you plan to have 3 people in your family wakeboard, then you'll likely need 2 - 3 wakeboards (they're size dependent), you'll then want a rack for the tower, etc.

If either doesn't allow a trial run I would walk away. The swim platform is a nice feature to have especially with the kids. When I bought I went new because I wanted the peace of mind that comes with that. After 3 years I would be far more comfortable getting something used as I now have the experience of maintaining and fixing things. You seems to like both, so it would come down to the $3K or so for something that is newer. If the older boat has been well maintained then it's not a huge risk. If you get them both out on the water you may find that clears up your decision.

 

[glengold]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

You must do a test drive, if I were purchasing a boat for wakeboarding I'd want to get behind it and test out the wake Bring along some friends so you can load that thing up and see how it handles. Brand names only matter to some, I own a wellcraft and took the decals off bc they were faded. I don't care if everyone i drive by knows what it is, the VIN will tell the next owner the brand anyways.

 

[drtracr]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

Definately get them on the water before you make a decision! Make darn sure the boat is geared for our altitude here in utah! It should be on plane from a dead stop in just a few seconds... Pick the one that you think will fit your need as far as seating and storage is concerned (as long as it is in good shape and appears to be well maintained). If you're not sure take it down to Beckstrands, they are by far the most helpful and knowledgable in our area (in my opinion).
Good luck and be prepared for some twofootitis in the next couple years!

 

[PaxnChris]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

Funny : "Twofootitis"! The Bayliner seller insists on taking us out prior to handing him a purchase check. He wants us to bring the girls along also. I'm not sure what is going on with the the SeaRay seller and the change of price. I assumed he meant $13,200, not $132,000.00. I did notice there have been a ton of page views on the ad so maybe he decided he went in too low to begin with. I searced the NADA as well as average prices around the country for the same boat and I actually was having a bit of a difficult time with even paying $12,000.

Right now we are leaning toward the Bayliner due to the condition, newer age, priced right and the seller is extremely knowledgeable and wanting to take us out to show us the ropes and ensure we are happy with the boat.

I think for at least a few years a 19ft boat will be perfect for us. I/we really need to get the hang of a boat before we get into the 21ft plus and more HP. We may need a boat to fit as many as 9-10 people if each of our girls want to bring friends along and such.

I love all of your advice and shared perspective. Please keep it coming if you happen to read this thread. Opinions really mean a lot to us.

Thanks!

 

[jonesg]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

The value of a boat is more often the stuff that cannot be seen,
beneath the deck are the stringers and transom condition can be the difference of thousand$ if its gotten internal rot started.

Upholstery and seats can be quickly swapped out, to me that stuff is nothing but fluff. It has no bearing on seaworthiness.

But having to pull the deck and re-do stringers is a "project" and unless you do it yourself it can cost thousands.

Point is, you're looking at the fluff trying to determine value.
For the amount you're contemplating dishing out, $400 for a professional survey will reveal all the problems and those firm prices suddenly become negotiable if you still want it. Google marine surveyor.
Also the seller has no right to the survey unless they buy it from you and you can negotiate to split that cost, or subtract it from the price if you find the boat is good one.

Buying a boat is nothing like buying cars, for sure.

 

[Chaparralboater]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

I had a dream and our family was on the bayliner ! Lol..I say buy the byliner and have a blast on it. I thank myndad everyday for getting me into boating at a young age..have fun and be safe.

 

[spikeitaudi]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

I got a new Bayliner this year and it was our first boat as well. I wanted peice of mind about the warranty. I had it up and Lake George this past week and put a good amount of hours on it over 6 days. It was a blast and the family absolutely loved it. I love Searays as well but they are so much more expensive brand new then Bayliners. And my 2010 Bayliner, yes is a "No Frills" brand boat, but you know what it still has a Mercrusier 3.0L with an Alpha 1 Stern Drive. Most boats in that size you the same power plant. As for the boat it suites my 5 person family just fine and I had 8 ppl on it this past week many times. 5 adults 3 kids. Planed just fine. As everybody said if it's a well maintained boat just go for it. As far as resale value, a smile on my kids face is all the value I need. As I can get them out on the water relatively cheap, safe, and with more money for other stuff in my pockets.

 

[PaxnChris]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

Thank you, thank you for sharing your family experience with a Bayliner. We have decided to purchase the 2007 195 and I'm so relieved because I've been driving myself mad with research. I think in black and white and I've learned that purchasing a boat (especially for the first time) is all gray! I was really focusing on the depreciation of numerous brands of boats and there just really doesn't doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it from year to year. I've learned from this websight to not worry about that and just continue to take excellent care of any boat we purchase.

I was trying to think of where I go it in my head that Bayliner is a company to stay away from and for the life of me I cannot recall. Our extended families do not own boats and we don't have a lot of friends that do either. I guess that's the battle Bayliner has been fighting for quite some time now.

 

[Dave.Mishchenko]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

Congratulations on your decision.

One thing I would consider with the Bayliner would be to swap the prop to aluminum. The 4 blade stainless steel prop will have been an upgrade and it's done to enhance performance. But a SS is not forgiving should a rock or stump "attack" the boat while an aluminum prop is far more malleable (and expendable).

It may be that the owner still has the stock prop and it's not a bad idea to carry a spare. Otherwise you can get one from iboats.com and they are fairly easy to swap. Once you're familiar with the boat and where you're boating you can always switch back.

 

[wingmastr23]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

Thank you, thank you for sharing your family experience with a Bayliner. We have decided to purchase the 2007 195 and I'm so relieved because I've been driving myself mad with research. I think in black and white and I've learned that purchasing a boat (especially for the first time) is all gray! I was really focusing on the depreciation of numerous brands of boats and there just really doesn't doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it from year to year. I've learned from this websight to not worry about that and just continue to take excellent care of any boat we purchase.

I was trying to think of where I go it in my head that Bayliner is a company to stay away from and for the life of me I cannot recall. Our extended families do not own boats and we don't have a lot of friends that do either. I guess that's the battle Bayliner has been fighting for quite some time now.

Sounds like you made the right call......the owner wanted to be sure you liked his boat before you bought it....sounds like a responsible individual....Make sure you maintain it properly, and you will have a TON of fun on it....and you won't have any trouble selling it when the time comes......Happy Boating!!!

Oh.....and I agree with Dave.....consider switching to an Aluminum Prop.....atleast till you guys are comfortable with the boat.

 

[Shrike]

Re: So frustrated/can't decide

Please be safe on the way to the lake: Put brakes on the trailer!