Steering binding

[Sgtbass]

I have a 99 Javelin Renegade 18 with a 150 Johnson for starters. I had it equiped with a jack plate to start off with and the steering has always been stiff from day one but nothing like it is now. It has always been rough a low speeds but only took one had to move the wheel and loosend up fairly well once opened up a bit and drove easily.

It all started this last spring when I noticed a little extra play in the steering but I didn't have the time to mess with it since I had to head overseas for a bit in Mid May so the boat sat all summer long under cover until this October. I ran all around the boat cleaning a greasing everything in sight and headed down to the local lake for a spin and fishing time I'd misssed out on. I immediatly noticed a drastic change in the steering as soon as I untrailered it. It takes two hads to turn the wheel in either direction. I don't just mean its a little tight, it really takes a good bit of presure whether moving or sitting still. It moves to the right with one had for about a third revolution but if you want to go past that or move to the left it takes two hands and some strength to make it turn.

Yes, I greased the fitting on the lower unit where the motor pivots untill the grease came out. I also took the steering cables loose from the motor one at a time and cleaned of the old grease and regreased as much as possible but none of this has helped me out. I've been out several times since and played around with the system with no real results. I also have more play in the wheel than ever before. At high speeds I have 2-3 inches of play and seems to be getting worse the more I drive. I also have a slight poping sound when moving the wheel when torqued to the left back to the right at near top dead center. What next and do I need a book? I have a dual steering and I think its a Teleflex system. Any thoughs or ideas would be appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Steering binding

are you the original owner of this boat? some times people add Jack plates, and do not consider the additional length of the steering cables, disconnect the steering at the engine, does the engine turn easily, is the steering still stiff. if so you either have a bad cable, helm, or kink in the cable.

 

[OBJ]

Re: Steering binding

Welcome aboard Sgt.

Military person? If so, let me first offer my thanks for all you do for your country. Many Vets. here on the forums. We all appreciate the work the military does.

Now to the problem. First, when you had the jack plate installed, did it cause the steering cables (taking for granted you have a dual cable system) to take an "S" bend at the engine?

Second, being likely you have a rack and pinion system (that's the steering helm under the dash) it sounds like you may be popping some gear teeth on the rack or pinion. This causes the play in the steering wheel. This can be caused by cables binding from corroded cable core or corrosion in the steering tubes at the engine.

In any event, I would not run the rig until you have the problem corrected....LARGE safety factor here.

I would at least pull the cables from the engine (which may entail lifting the engine from the boat) and see if the cables free up and if the play is still there which it likely will be. Drop the helm out and inspect the gears on the racks and pinion for lost teeth. If any of the above are present, replace the cables/helm. Kits are available and are reasonable. I would go with Tele-flex no feed back system dual cable system at the least.

And so make sure you clean out the steering tubes at the engine.

If the cables make that "S" bend to the engine, I would look at ways to straighten out that bend so the cables makes a smooth transition curve into the steering tubes. One way is to drill two holes in the rear gunrail and bring the cables out through them. The holes can be covered with large chrome clam shells. I usually use a good marine sealer to plug the holes.....keeps the water out.

Keep us informed of what you find.

Thanks!

 

[OBJ]

Re: Steering binding

You beat me daddy......but I typed more........dd

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Steering binding

OBJ, you explained it far better than i did. i also thanked him for serving out country, when i first replyed, went to post it, and the cat had knocked router of the desk so nothing posted. i'm vietnam incountry disabled corpsman

 

[Sgtbass]

Re: Steering binding

are you the original owner of this boat? some times people add Jack plates, and do not consider the additional length of the steering cables, disconnect the steering at the engine, does the engine turn easily, is the steering still stiff. if so you either have a bad cable, helm, or kink in the cable.

Yep! I had the jack plate put on during the dealer prep and I am the original owner. I do remember them stating the cables just barely made it. I have not tried disconnecting both cables and moving the engine back and forth by hand but will as tomorrow when all the rain stops. Since the boat set under cover for so long this summer I'm fairly sure it might be a corrosion issue inside the cable and I may have damaged it further running around with the tight steering.

Thanks for your info.

 

[Sgtbass]

Re: Steering binding

Welcome aboard Sgt.

Military person? If so, let me first offer my thanks for all you do for your country. Many Vets. here on the forums. We all appreciate the work the military does.

Now to the problem. First, when you had the jack plate installed, did it cause the steering cables (taking for granted you have a dual cable system) to take an "S" bend at the engine?

Second, being likely you have a rack and pinion system (that's the steering helm under the dash) it sounds like you may be popping some gear teeth on the rack or pinion. This causes the play in the steering wheel. This can be caused by cables binding from corroded cable core or corrosion in the steering tubes at the engine.

In any event, I would not run the rig until you have the problem corrected....LARGE safety factor here.

I would at least pull the cables from the engine (which may entail lifting the engine from the boat) and see if the cables free up and if the play is still there which it likely will be. Drop the helm out and inspect the gears on the racks and pinion for lost teeth. If any of the above are present, replace the cables/helm. Kits are available and are reasonable. I would go with Tele-flex no feed back system dual cable system at the least.

And so make sure you clean out the steering tubes at the engine.

If the cables make that "S" bend to the engine, I would look at ways to straighten out that bend so the cables makes a smooth transition curve into the steering tubes. One way is to drill two holes in the rear gunrail and bring the cables out through them. The holes can be covered with large chrome clam shells. I usually use a good marine sealer to plug the holes.....keeps the water out.

Keep us informed of what you find.

Thanks!

USAF since 1987 and plans on retiring in the comming year and many thanks on your support and vote of confidence.

Your right, it is a dual steering system and I don't think there is an "S" or any kinks I can see causing the problem. I will verify when the rain stops tomorrow though just to make certain. Jack plate was part of the dealer prep as I had several friends who had Javelin boats and told me it was a must.

Correct again, rack and pinion steering system. I don't have the capability at home to pull the engine but I think disconnecting both cables from the engine might do the trick to check for free play on the engine and steering seperatly. If the engine moves properly I plan on removing the helm and will inspect as suggested.

Now for a few more questions for the experts! Do either you or Tash.... no where I might find/download a pictoral index or IPB (illistraited parts break down) of the system? At best a how too guide for idiots who have never messed with this before? I've gone through all my paperwork and of course it always comes down to see dealer for steering problems and no IPB. Can you pull the cables from the what I would call the outer jacket to properly inspect and lubricate? If so what lub would you suggest? If the cables appear to be good can you replace the gearbox by itself or do you have to puchase the whole kit? I've looked but only found the gearbox alone for the rotary unit. Is their a adjustment screw to help with the play if I don't find any bad teeth? Last one, how hard is this to get all lined back up once disassembled or if I have to put in a new system?

I do have a little mechanical ability but hate to tear into the unknow without system working knowledge for fear of screwing it up worse. You would think a guy working on jet engines for 19 year would know more but sometimes boats and cars throw me for a loop.....LOL. I need what we in the AF call technical data!

Thanks for all your help.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Steering binding

this is the best i know on line:
http://www.teleflexmarine.com/cgi-bin/library.cgi?site=steering&type=us&library=1018

 

[OBJ]

Re: Steering binding

I'm an AF person also Sgt. Spent 18 months incountry Nam working gun fire control on gunships. Got out in Dec. 71'.

 

[Sgtbass]

Re: Steering binding

Tried everything I know yesterday and found nothing wrong. I guess I should say that there was not a smoking gun to put my finger on for my problems and say that's it for sure. First I removed the rod ends from the motor and it swayed back and forth like a dream. Next I tried messing with the cables and the steering wheel was still tight but at least could be moved with one hand but still tighter than it should be without the weight of the engine. When moving the wheel back and forth the forward rod would move almost instantly with wheel movement but the aft rod would remain still until finally engaging and moving with the other rod. I would say this was about a 1/4 of movment at the box which is much greater with the steering wheel back on for both rods to catch up and move together. I did this several times before I noticed the aft rod would spin or rotate while moving back and forth. I would say from full left to right the rod would rotate 1 1/2 turns which does seem unusual to me but not sure. I would think this would cause a binding problem but don't know how or why it would start after nearly 7 years. The part of the cables I could see were well lubed and corrosion free. I next tackled the gearbox under the helm and pulled it down and apart. No missing gear teeth and well lubed. I seperated the gearbox from the rack as well but don't see anyway to pull the cables from either direction so I guess my mission was a failed sucess. I found some funny stuff but nothing to say that's it for certain. The gearbox had a very small amount of play but only equates to about a 1/4 inch play or less in the wheel. I'm down to just replaceing but can't pull the engine at home. I read through most of the web sites which show how to measure but do either of you know how they measure with the system out of the boat? That is to say would you measure tip to tip or are the rack or rod ends not included in measuring the legnth of the cable. I can get the new stuff for just short of $400 but a little nervous on guestimating length.

Thanks for all your help guy's.

 

[Bass Ackwards]

Re: Steering binding

SgtBass,

I would also like to thank you for your service. I retired a little over a year ago from the USN, 2 wars was more than enough for me!

As for good manuals, SELOC has one that is pretty good, but it's a little pricey, however, if you are Ebay friendly, I got the exact SELOC manual from a guy, but it's on CD, so you'll have to make allowances for that. However, since it only cost me $5 = shipping, I can make them...here's the link

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1997...m14&_trkparms=72:727|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318


Good luck with your motor, and brother I feel your pain, I've got the same motor on a 19.5' Charger Bass Boat, and I've been messing with it for a couple of weeks now. I have the steering issue, along with a motor that dies out when I go full throttle. I've already rebuilt the carbs, changed the fuel filter, added an in-line fuel filter, changed the plugs, and am still in the thick of it. Mine sat for 2 yrs......so now it's timing check/compression check, and I'm gonna change out the fuel line with the squeeze bulb.....and we'll see!!

Anywho good luck, I'll check back later!

B A