Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

[bakerjw]

Earlier this year I picked up a used 1990 Stratos 1850 center console. It came with a 1990 Evinrude 150XP and an EZloader aluminum trailer. The previous owner had passed away and his estate donated it to a local girls and boys club. A local "dealer" listed it for them for $3,900. The price wasn't terribly out of line and all of the money was going to the boys and girls club. Had it been a private owner, I would have dickered on the price.

The gelcoat has some cracks and the floors are checked a bit but the hull and deck were solid. Whenever I have had to do anything under the deck, I've found the fiberglass of the hull to be in apparent great shape.

Tonight I was out on the lake trolling and when I checked the live well, the water in it was to the top. It was a good 3 or 4 inches higher than it should be. It was high enough that some was seeping into the bilge. Even with the bilge pumped clear, the boat seemed to be sitting awfully low in the back end. It got me wondering if it is perhaps water logged in some way. I checked the bottom of the deck surface around the access ports and the live well and found that it was swollen and flaking apart.

It sucks because I really like this boat. It is very stable in the water and is a very solid trolling platform. I can block off the live well and get by, but I'm almost ready to repower this thing with a new outboard, but I don't want to dump money into what might be a lost cause. I also would not consider trying to sell my problem to some other person. If it's a lost cause, I'll just have to deal with it one way or another.

So that's where I stand. My questions to you guys, the experts.

Is it possible to split the top half of the boat off of the bottom?

Could it be that the flotation might be holding water?

If I can split the top off of the hull, can the decking be removed and new material expoxied in place?

Like I said, the inner hull surface looks completely intact and solid. It is the top half that worries me.

Right now, my outlook on the entire situation is rather bleak. I have finally gotten a boat that I love and am facing the prospect that I might have thrown a lot of money away. I figure, that if it is a lost cause, what harm does it do to look under the top half to see how bad that it is? It might be that the hull is waterlogged as well and the entire thing needs to be scrapped. But if there is a chance that it can be worked back into running in it's full glory, then it's something that I'll have to do. You can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear, but I can't justify the expense of a new boat either.

Any thoughts? Any encouragement?
Thanks

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Post up some pix of the boat & interior

Shots below decks would help too.

Q1 probably can pull the cap off the hull

Q2 yep, likely foam holding water

Q3 probably use polyester resin & glass on new deck ply (& elsewhere) no problem.

Epoxy isn't necessary, takes longer to cure & polyester & gelcoat won't adhere to it.

Plenty of great people hanging around the dry dock & they'll help you get it torn down & put back safely & better then before.

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Thanks for the supportive post. This had me up all night fretting that I could have a total loss on my hands. I have a feeling that this boat has seen some outside storage, but I'd expect a sturdy center console to be designed to endure the elements fairly well.

I'll get some pictures posted later today. I did find a boat repair place not too far from here that deals with Stratos boats. I'm checking with then to get a rough estimate on what they would charge.

A boat truly is a hole in the water into which you throw money.
Thanks again for the support.

 

[Teamster]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Tagging along,................

 

[wolfsmurf]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

If you really love the boat go for it bud. As long as its still in one piece there is no total loss. You won't believe the piece of mind you will get from working on it. Look through the rebuild threads here. There's lots of knowledge to be found. You will need to do some checking to see how far you have to go but it's not that hard. You could do that yourself with a few tools and a little elbow grease.

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

One way or the other, if I do it myself or take it to someone, I'm going to have to strip it down. Tonight I'll get that started and go from there. The eventual goal is to get it repowered so if the outboard is already off of it, that'll at least save me some labor at the dealer.

I'll post some pics of the entire process.

Any ideas as to what a cap normally weighs? I'd suspect that the hull would carry the bulk of the weight.

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

The cap could weigh as much as 200 lbs. Just depends on how the MFG built it. Bass boats are built entirely different than ski boats and other types. Do some searching here on the forum for Stratos rebuilds and I'm sure you'll find some examples that will show you what you're in for.

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Here is a pic of my boat before the tear down. It doesn't look too bad. Unfortunately it sits way low in the stern. This bugged the snot out of me ALL day long. I hate dealing with unknowns.

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

As soon as I got home I dove into the task at hand. The bumper strip came off quite easily.

Once I pulled all of the cabling back out of the center console, I was able to pull up the center hatch. It was very very heavy. I know that marine plywood can be heavy, but I found this to weigh about 50 pounds. I'll weight it to be exact. The bottom 1/3 is under the console and has no plywood.

One of my concerns in another thread today was that they may have attached the liner/cap to the hull. In the corner storage areas, they used a single layer of fiberglass to bind the liner/cap to the hull. This is very easy to remove. If this is all that there is, then it will be a cake walk.

The deck at the front of the boat is not attached to the hull. I can reach in the access way and run a straight edge along the bottom where it meets the regular floor. This is also good news.

Once the center hatch was out of the way, I was able to get to the gas tank. It is a 41 gallon tank! I know that for sure now. There it is in its full glory! The wood that is used as spacers is not treated or covered in fiberglass. The bad news? it appears that they did use an adhesive compound between the liner/cap and the hull.

I am also not quite sure what to think about their fiberglass work. The weave is very coarse and doesn't seem to have been applied all that well. I am sure that there are multiple layers involved, but I'd like to be sure.

So, now I'm dealing with the liner/cap glued to the hull. I've no idea how far back that it goes, but I suspect that it goes to where the liner/cap turns up along the side. I am going to call a local fiberglass repair place tomorrow and ask their advice. But I might just take a sawzall and cut through U shapes through the stringer along the gas tank. This would give me unfettered access to the adhesive between the liner/cap and the other stringers. It would also be a good indicator of how well the current stringers are protected by the fiberglass and the epoxy.

In an absolute worst case, I would still grind out all of the stringers myself and redo them with new polyester resin. It's a very simple layout and shouldn't take too long. The key is getting the liner/cap off of the boat. If I get that done, I might just take it to the local shop and let them redo the floors and put a new gel coat on while I finish out the hull.

I'm probably going to check with the mods and see about creating a new thread so that other Stratos owners have an idea of what is under the floor of their boats.

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

So I took my boat to a local repair place. Initially the owner looked over the boat and said that it wasn't worth repairing. We chatted a bit and looked at other options and he was impressed at how sturdy that it is. He couldn't find any evidence of water damage to the stringers and he jumped around the deck and felt that it was as solid as would be expected.

He helped me come up with a game plan. Tomorrow I'm going to pull the fuel tank and drill some holes through the stringers to the chambers that should hold the flotation. If the flotation is wet, then the cap comes off. If it is dry as a bone, then I know I don't have water soaked flotation. The owner is a nice young guy who told me to come back and he'd five me fiberglass and resin to patch up the holes if it is all dry in there. He might not get any business out of me, but he was eager to help and wanted me to let him know what I found.

We'll see what tomorrow brings.

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

It rained bad here last night but lucky for me I was able to get a BBE up around the boat.

The other night, the local repair place quoted $300.00 to cut off the cap for me. I inquired about it again yesterday because as I mull around options, I finally figured that it is worth it to me to just get it done. They ended up putting in a call in to Stratos to see if they thought that it would even be possible and if so to get their advice doing it.

If they can't do it, then I'll be doing the bore hole routine into the compartments between all of the bulkheads. Worst case, I find water in the flotation and rotted stringers. Then I'll have to cut through the stringers to reach the tops of the bulkheads to pop the cap anyway.

I'm not sure what material that Stratos used under the decks. In the back, it feels almost like a Masonite material. It is covered with some foam but not fiberglass. It's all in real good shape except for right around the live well. I don't remember the acronym for this but I believe that it is the material that is more expensive than marine plywood. Will epoxy adhere to it?

I am thinking that there may be enough room in the bilge area to drop the live well and rotate it out of the way to cut out this rotted material and replace with new. There are just a lot of unknowns until I get some good answers and those seem to rely on getting the cap off of this thing.

Just more things to fret about.

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

An option that the guy at the repair place mentioned was to cut the current floor out of the boat and replace it all with marine grade plywood. I've been mulling that around. If I cut about 3" from all sides, then I should be able to lift the cap and I can then cut out the rest of the floor in pieces and separate it easily from the bulkheads where it has been glued down. This will give me access to everything under the main part of the boat and allow me to pull the cap off as well.

At this point, I will figure that I may as well replace all of the foam unless it comes out intact. I'll then have to drill some inspection holes into the stringers to see if they are in good shape. If they are still good, I will have access to both sides of the stringers to sand them down and glass over the holes. If they are shot, then I'm none the worse off.

If the stringers and bulkheads are all ok and the foam is back in place, I can then cut the marine plywood to rest on the old floor. I can then figure out how much buildup will be required on the tops of the stringers and bulkheads so that the new floor meets the hull. When it goes back together, it will be glued.

Once the new floor has been glued to the cap, I can pull the cap and glass the bottom to the sides of the cap. I think that I have a pretty good game plan now.

Any comments?
Does anyone read these rambling posts?

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

I've been following along and waiting to see what the repair guy said. Boats with what I call a "Tub" construction can be problematic. You never know exactly how they've been attached. I've seen some where the bottom of the deck was glued to the top of the flotation foam and it was nearly impossible to separate the two. Boston Whalers come to mind. IMHO you will just have to decide your method of attack and give it a go. Leaving a 3" lip around the perimeter of the Deck seems like a viable option to me, but I've never done a boat like this so don't take my word for it! All I can say it Hope for the best but plan for the worst!!!!

Good Luck!!!

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Thanks WOG. I wasn't sure who might be following along. Before I get too carried away, I'll get a long flat feeler and see if there is foam up to the lower surface of the deck. I suspect that they used "gunk" as one person called it to attach the deck to the bulkheads. Foam I can deal with to some degree.

This is an intimidating undertaking to be sure. I've not heard back from the repair guy yet. I know that they're probably pretty busy since they're the only repair shop in a 60 mile radius. I told him that I'd pick up my materials from them if they sell to the general public. It might be more that I can get via mail order, but it generates good will since I'll be picking his brain.

The worst case imaginable to me is rotted stringers. If they're shot, then the scope of my project grows considerably. But, if I have to go that far, then it'll likely be lighter and stronger than before. If they're good to go, then I think that I'll be able to handle any major hurdles that come my way.

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Today begins the deck cut out. I've inspected under the deck more thoroughly than before and there is no way to get it off intact without cutting through stringers and bulkheads to get to the adhesive compound that they used to glue it down. I've got my PPE ready to go and will post pics later today.

Sourcing deck material might be a bit of a pain though. I'll hit some local lumber yards to see if they can special order some sheets of the good stuff for me.
http://forums.iboats.com/boat-resto...ir/best-deck-material-617722.html#post4302585

 

[GT1000000]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Hi and welcome, bakerjw...
Been following along, also and would like to come aboard and see what develops...that is a nice looking boat and should serve you well as a serious fishing machine when its all done...
I don't have anything to add at this time, because like WoG, I am not sure what type of construction is used in this particular boat.
The one thing I could throw in here is good thoughts and best of luck in your upcoming endeavor...
Have Fun!
GT1M

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Well, the cap is mostly broken loose. I did cut out the are of the floor that has the lid for the live well, the access cover for the fuel tank and a raised are that secures the center console. It took more effort than I expected.

How does Stratos build a center console?
They start with a hull and have 2 main stringers 2 1/2 to 3 feet apart. These run from the transom to the bow. About 1 foot out are 2 more stringers that also run from the transom to the bow. Between the stringers are bulkheads. It is a fairly normal layout and will be easy to replicate. The stringers and bulkheads are all covered in glass.

Once the stingers and bulkheads have been put into place, they staple 1/2 5 ply plywood to everything and the cover it all with a layer of glass. Holes are drilled into the plywood and foam is injected into the cavities. Again, a fairly common practice. At this point, the bulk of the structural integrity is in the hull. One odd thing is that the plywood was 6" squares like parquet tiles.

For the cap/liner, they make it the standard way in a mold. Plywood is laminated to the underside of the cap and glassed.

When the cap and hull are brought together, they pour a thick gray mixture, probably a peanut butter like mixture, onto the deck surface of the hull and bring the pieces together. So for the deck surface, you end up with 1/2 of plywood, glass, the peanut butter mixture, more plywood, and then glass with the gelcoat. There is no easy way to split apart one of these hulls.

So what did I find when I assaulted the Stratos today? I found out how they made these boats. I also found that EVERY piece of plywood was totally water saturated. The flotation had water in it to some degree, but nothing like the plywood. I also found the dreaded rot in a number of the stringers and bulkheads. I cut into glass at the top of one stringer and it was clearly wet. It was not something that I wanted to see for sure. Even if some were in good shape, I would replace all of the stringers and bulkheads.

So right now I'm looking at needing to do a couple of things before even moving forward.
1 - Finish some cleanup of foam and assorted junk in the hull.
2 - Pull the outboard.
3 - Lift off the cap.
4 - put some bracing on the trailer to hold the hull to it's shape.
5 - cut out the old stringers and bulkheads.
6 - Make some estimates on materials and time

At this point, I lose nothing if I take it to a bare hull. I have to decide whether or not I want to put forth the effort. If I do, I'm going to raise the stringers and bulkheads to bring the deck up to there the original deck was. I'll then have to work out a good way to fasten the cap to the new deck though.

Anyone know if you can buy a bare center console hull with nothing on it?

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Pics of today's efforts. I'd expected to have gotten a lot more accomplished, but I was a soaking mess by 2:00 in the afternoon. I took the day off for bad news.

Here is the start of the day. The deck is intact and you can see the lines around the old deck parts that I wish to keep intact.

When I finally got through the deck and the other deck, I peeled out some of the PB layer and found a foam access hole. You can see water pushing oput of the foam when I poked into it. The wood was also soaked.

Here you can see the square parquet like wood squares that they used in the deck. Odd. You can see the PB adhesive under the actual deck. Below the gray stuff is another layer of wood that was stampled to the stringers and bulkheads.

I finally got the center part to free up and removed it from the boat. I still have to pull the fuel tank.

The bilge and livewell area. The main stringers are clearly visible.

 

[GT1000000]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Anyone know if you can buy a bare center console hull with nothing on it?

Not sure about buying one already made, but after you get the hang of all this glassing, it will be pretty easy for you to make a custom console using some plywood and resin/glass...for a lot less money than buying one, plus you can configure it any way you want...

 

[bakerjw]

Re: Stratos 1850 possible rebuild?

Here is some of the gray adhesive that they used. You can see some on the closest stringer.

The rot in a bulkhead. When they cut in a path for the feed through conduit, they didn't seal off the cuts.

One of the bulkhead cavities after the foam had been cleaned out. Some of the surrounding wood seemed to be solid. It is solid still, just damp at best and wet at worst.

Tomorrow will be more demolition and cleanup work. I also have to make an outboard stand to get the outboard removed. Once removed, I have to split the cap from the transom. I'm thinking that I can use a putty knife as a chisel to separate the cap fiberglass from the transom wood.


So now the questions begin as I approach procuring materials.
It might cost more, but I am going with epoxy. I've worked with it in the past and I understand it. I figure 3 gallons to start.
I've also followed Friscoboater's Sea Ray rebuild thread and am sold on 1708 for a lot of the work. But is it good for decking or is regular fiberglass cloth better? I'm not even at the deck stage yet, I'm just asking ahead of time.

What about stringer wood? It looks like the stringers are 1" plywood of some type. They are also about 16' long. What is the best method for coming up with wood that long? Use 1/2" and epoxy them together?

There will always be more questions and much gnashing of teeth and aggravation, but I'm going to at least get the cap off and the hull down to bare bones. I'll then take it from there.