Super shallow ramp

[reelfishin]

I took my 12' boat down to one lake today to do some early fishing, the state just redid the whole area last year and it was my first trip there since.
I took the smallest boat I have since it's only a 3 or 4 acre pond.
What I found was the most useless ramp I've ever seen. They put in a concrete ramp, and it's so shallow that I was not able to back in far enough to get my 12' boat to float off the trailer. The boat is on a super light and low 8" wheeled bunk trailer, it don't get no lower than this one, I was backed in to the point where I was concerned that I would back off the ramp, my back tires were up to the rims edge, the front tires were just into the water. The boat was nowhere's near getting wet. The lake was at the high water mark as well. I finally just pulled over next to the ramp, in the grass where there's a pretty sharp drop off into the water, backed the trailer wheels to the edge and pushed the little boat off.
I have no idea what they were thinking by putting a ramp in with that little amount of slope into the water. 20' past the water's edge its only about 5" deep, maybe 18" at the end of the ramp. The water's edge was about a foot from the start of the ramp.
If I had pushed the boat in on the ramp, I'd have dropped the boat onto the concrete and had to walk in near freezing water to get in the boat. The ramp is darn near level. Maybe a 2" drop in about 20' or so, maybe less.
I'd like to know who the engineering genius is that designed that ramp.

 

[mthieme]

Re: Super shallow ramp

Just goes to show...nothing is so broke that the government can't make it worse.

 

[NYBo]

Re: Super shallow ramp

Clearly designed by someone who has never launched a boat from a trailer.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Super shallow ramp

The government in action to be sure. They had the money in the budget and unless it was spent they would not get that much next year. So they put in a ramp that nobody can possible use and they pat themselves on the back for being so sensitive to the needs of the citizens that pay their wages. Just wait until next year -- they will ask for twice as much money to tear out the new ramp, dig out the ramp area to make it deeper and then put in a new ramp and then pat themselves on the back telling you once more how sensitive they were to your complaints.

 

[Splat]

Re: Super shallow ramp

Any chance this was at Hinckley Lake here in Ohio?

They did the same crap here. It was so nice they put in a ramp, too bad no one and I mean no one can launch from it.

BIll

 

[Titanium48]

Re: Super shallow ramp

Even if they had built it properly there had to be something better to spend money on than a concrete boat launch on a pond that's barely big enough for a canoe. At 4 acres, the longest dimension can't be much more than 200 m.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Super shallow ramp

Even if they had built it properly there had to be something better to spend money on than a concrete boat launch on a pond that's barely big enough for a canoe. At 4 acres, the longest dimension can't be much more than 200 m.

The lake or pond is about 12 acres, but a road splits part of it off separate, meaning that if you want to boat on the other side, you have to carry the boat over the guard rail and toss it in the other side. Generally that side sees canoes only. Most of the lakes here are not much bigger. The lake I mentioned isn't much bigger than a couple of football fields, and not much wider. You can cast across it width wise but it's pretty long the other way with sort of a dog leg heading upstream. It's decent fishing if you can get to the far middle and rear area of the lake which can't be reached from shore since it's surrounded by private property.

I think the only way that ramp will ever get fixed is if someone goes out there at 3AM and drags that concrete mess out of there. It won't last either way, the ramp begins nearly at the water's edge, so it's only a matter of time before the top edge gets undermined by rain water and natural erosion.

The way it is now it's just an obstacle, it ruined what was a good place to launch. When you call and complain they recite a bunch of bs about ramp building specs and safety standards. If I let the air out of my 8" tires and removed my springs the boat still wouldn't float off the trailer.
The whole big deal about the project there and the million or so dollars they spent, was so that that lake would meet state park regulations for a fishing lake and to allow access for larger, fiberglass bass boats. The lake used to be about 5 to 6 foot deep at the deepest part, they dredged it out just past the ramp to 8', put in a useless ramp, and cleared away all the brush and undergrowth on the ramp side of the lake. The dredging mostly removed rotted stumps, forest debris and algae. They worked there for nearly a whole season, it's just finally starting to recover fishing wise.
If nothing else, it was a lake that was close that I used for testing small boats, but now they made it more trouble than it's worth to launch there.
The best part was their "Improved parking area", you can park maybe 6 vehicles there and I heard something about a 7 angler limit at a time on the lake as a voluntary limit to control parking issues. They solved the parking problem by building a ramp that excluded most boats. Pretty much if you can't toss it in without a ramp, forget it.

They did the same thing at another ramp not too far away, that one is on a river, a very popular spot to launch, I tried the new ramp there last fall, my 18' boat which sits only 18' off the ground wouldn't float off the trailer even as the trailer wheels were at the end of the ramp and the trucks front wheels were in the water and the water nearing the rear axle differential level. I still had to jerk the boat off the trailer into the water and then load it shallow with the winch. I thought the bow eye was going to fly off just trying to get the boat to climb the rollers. If it were a bunk trailer, it would have never gotten afloat.

 

[dlngr]

Re: Super shallow ramp

I bought a 10' aluminum jon boat to use in a few spots like that near here.-but it's only a one man boat,can't imagine using the 10' with my 200 lb son along.

 

[rolmops]

Re: Super shallow ramp

I take exception at cursing government.First of all because it is politically tainted which is a no no on this site,but most of all because you do not know whether this was a government planned ramp or the result of the actions of a laborer working for a sub contractor who did not care as long as he got paid.

 

[woosterken]

Re: Super shallow ramp

thats what tilt trailers were made for.
pull the pin and it will tilt up and put your boat in a drop of water

woosterken

 

[mthieme]

Re: Super shallow ramp

I take exception at cursing government.First of all because it is politically tainted which is a no no on this site,but most of all because you do not know whether this was a government planned ramp or the result of the actions of a laborer working for a sub contractor who did not care as long as he got paid.

RF stated that the State did it.
Having done project management for both federal and local governments, the contractor would not have gotten paid if it did not meet specifications. If they don;t follow through, they lose their bond and are off the list of future bidders at the very least.
Either some numbskull within the State drew up improper specs or they accepted the the final product when they shouldn't have.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Super shallow ramp

thats what tilt trailers were made for.
pull the pin and it will tilt up and put your boat in a drop of water

woosterken

My trailer is a tilt type, but if I dumped my boat in 4" of water it would slam the concrete ramp on the way in. While it really wouldn't hurt the boat, it is a super clean boat and there's no reason to bang up the keel like that. There's not enough water on the ramp anywhere near the edge, what I did end up doing was just sliding the boat off the bank next to the ramp and then manually lifting the bow up onto the trailer and winching it back on. Before, all I used to have to do was back in a few feet, the boat would float off and I'd park the truck and trailer.
I used to tie the bow line to a tree, float the boat and pull out. Now that they removed all the brush and trees from the ramp area, I had to tie my paddle to the bow line and toss it ashore while I got my truck so the wind didn't blow the boat back out. I don't carry an anchor since it's just a row boat.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Super shallow ramp

RF stated that the State did it.
Having done project management for both federal and local governments, the contractor would not have gotten paid if it did not meet specifications. If they don;t follow through, they lose their bond and are off the list of future bidders at the very least.
Either some numbskull within the State drew up improper specs or they accepted the the final product when they shouldn't have.

It was actually a joint effort between the state and Army Corps of Engineers I believe. They got done with it last spring sometime, the other day was the first time I went over there to try it out. They did a great job of clearing out the debris and all the overgrown vegetation but ruined the launch area.

I'd have no complaint if they hadn't put in such a shallow ramp. I thought the reason they were doing the whole job was so that they could get larger tournament type bass boats in there. If I couldn't float a 12' tinny, there's no way anyone would launch a full sized bass boat there. There's also not enough room next to the ramp to back in that way, it's sort of a dug out drop off into the water, fine for a light aluminum boat but if you backed the trailer off it, your no doubt going to be stuck. I had to back in on an angle half on the ramp, half on the dirt to get my little boat in the water.

No matter how you look at it, it's a bad design, whether its for some safety reasons, or just complete oversight or lack of better sense, the ramp is useless. Unless your boat will float in 4" of water and you like getting wet, the ramp don't work.
This seems to be a trend in all the newer ramps, I've run into this at a few other new ramps, but none are as bad as this one. The bad part is that I think once you get past the ramp, it drops off to about 4' of depth or so, so backing past that ramp would be real problem. They dug out the area all around the ramp, supposedly to get it to a depth of 8'. Before the milfoil weeds in there were so thick it would stop your boat and trolling motor dead, you used to have to paddle or pole out about 100 foot or so before using the trolling motor. Several lakes here get overrun with both algae and milfoil, they dug this one out to try and clear the ramp area. That they seem to have done, or at least made that area deep enough that won't inhibit boat use, but now you can't get a boat in there with that ramp like that. I don't think many others have tried yet, I'm sure they're bound to get complaints.

 

[mthieme]

Re: Super shallow ramp

I know the Army Corps of Engineers has to approve any plans involving the water around here. Past that stage, they aren't really involved.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Super shallow ramp

All I remember about it is that the newpaper read that the Army Corps of Eng. are hard at work dredging the launch ramp area in preparation for the new ramp. The state had just recently taken over ownership of that lake, it had been private and then semi private for many years. Its a man made lake formed by damming up a swampy creek. The state has forced public access on all sides of the lake by enforcing easements that were already in place by what I assume state law enforcing water access and use.

The paper said that the repairs were required inorder to allow full boat access which is required for it to become a state stocked lake, in which they stocked bass and several other species. So far all that's been seen there is huge pickerel and big eels since all the work and the last stocking in the fall. Chances are all the 4 and 5 pound pickerel made short work of any bass they tossed in, the same for any panfish or trout. I'd have to really check to see what they put in so far, the lake used to have a good natural population of crappie and largemouth bass, but they've dwindled over the years as the pickerel took over. The milfoil they removed was one of the hot spots for large bass, so everyone will have to relearn the lake again anyhow, once they figure out how to get their boat in the water there.
The ramp will keep the bigger boats out and probably deter many from fishing there at all, which may be a good thing for us with small aluminum boats.

 

[airframer]

Re: Super shallow ramp

it was probably designed for canoes other small personal watercrafts. you see them on military and other government installations all the time. they try to deter larger boat because they cause an unsafe enviroment for the kids out there rowing around.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Super shallow ramp

it was probably designed for canoes other small personal watercrafts. you see them on military and other government installations all the time. they try to deter larger boat because they cause an unsafe enviroment for the kids out there rowing around.

I wouldn't want to gouge up the bottom of a canoe in only 4" of water on that ramp. If it was for canoes, then they didn't need a ramp. You can toss a canoe in by hand anywhere. Personal watercraft are not allowed in non tidal water here so that wasn't a concern, and even one of those wouldn't be able to float off the trailer in such shallow water. I'm not even sure if the boat would float off the trailer if I took the wheels off, hubs too for that matter.

 

[Titanium48]

Re: Super shallow ramp

If deterring larger boats was the goal, why install a concrete ramp at all? I'd rather hand launch my rowboat or canoe from a dock or from a sandy or grassy shore. Boat bottoms and concrete don't really get along.

 

[6MISFITZ]

Re: Super shallow ramp

These type of things also happen in Canada.

Things as simple as a new concrete sidewalk that called for a very slight 2% - 3% grade on paper ended up with more than a 7% grade in reality. This of course required a backfill of stone to make the uneven step DOWN to people?s driveways manageable in their own vehicles.

The city engineer backed his pick up truck (with generous ground clearance and better break over angle) over the peak of sidewalk and stone on a couple of driveways and deemed it fine ?? but when an actual owner arrived to open their cottage that weekend, his vehicle (less generous ground clearance and much more shallow break over angle) high centered itself on the peak.

Through his frustration, this gentleman calmly called the police and had a report filled out (as this had never happened in the previous generations his family had lived at their cottage) and presented his damage estimate and towing bill to the town supervisor on Monday.

10 to 12 feet wide of concrete sidewalk - more than 700 feet long was all dug up Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday and Friday, re-graded to the proper % elevation by the end of the 2nd week, and then NEW, NEW, concrete was poured again the following week. Add a new transmission and a towing bill and you could tangibly see our tax dollars at work.


Lets hope both of our governments get the ?eco? right the first time.

Mike.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Super shallow ramp

I would foresee a slightly different process here for such a situation. It would be more like, you get your car fixed at your expense, you can't use your driveway for two years and you then have to bring suit against the local town government and contractor, when of if you win, your lawyer takes 1/3.

I agree with Titanium48 above, I hate putting in on concrete with any small boat, sand or grass don't eat the hull like concrete does.