Switch or??

[jvaccarino]

93 Evinrude 70hp here.. <br /><br />This past Memorial Day, took the boat out (tried to anyway) First thing I had to jump start the battery.. then while on the lake, the boat died, thought it was the battery *which it was, but also something else* Charged the batteries.. I've got 12v going to the solenoid, the starter, and back to the switch. but the engine doesn't even turn/ click or do anything. Is this a spark plug issue, or a bad ignition switch?? When I turn the key, the tach sometimes will go backwards (0, 7, 6, 5 .. etc)<br /><br />Fishing tournament today... hopefully a quick fix I want to win!

 

[jtexas]

Re: Switch or??

12V at the starter but the starter don't spin...bad starter.<br /><br />To get you back on the water today...dissasemble the starter, blow out the carbon dust, put it back together, that worked for me - 3 years later it still works. I used an old toothbrush to clean the internals - be gentle with 'em, don't use any solvents.<br /><br />The seloc manual explains it pretty well. There's a few tests you can do for the commutator & armature, but I can't really explain 'em and you're in a hurry anyway.<br /><br />Put a reference mark on the housing & cap assembly so you can get 'em back together right. Be careful when you pull the housing off - the brushes are spring-loaded and might take off on ya.<br /><br />To get 'em back in, tie 'em into the holders with a twist-tie or tiny piece of wire then remove it after they're in.<br /><br />Clamp it down good for your bench test - it has a ton of torque!<br /><br />For a schematic go to http://epc.brp.com/default.aspx?brands=ej&lang=E and follow the links to your year/model.<br /><br />Good luck!<br /><br />[edit - when you say it died on the lake...you mean just quit running while you were cruising? That wouldn't be related to the battery or the starter. Did you start the day with a fully charged battery? If so you could have a charging system problem. If you get it started, check the battery voltage while it's running, you should get upwards of 13 volts.]

 

[jvaccarino]

Re: Switch or??

I don't know if I started the day off with a fully charged battery.. I had to jump the battery with my truck early in the morning, because before I took it out,I wanted to start it to make sure it was going to run...but, the boat ran after I jumped it, had no problem starting right back up... mid day, went to leave, and the key wouldn't turn.. thats when I took the batteries back and charged them both... <br /><br />SO.. now both batteries read 12.5/ 12.4.. and like I said, have power running all the way thru.. just does not turn or even click

 

[jvaccarino]

Re: Switch or??

When I turn the key, the voltage at the switch goes down to 8/9 volts.. is this normal???

 

[jtexas]

Re: Switch or??

With the key turned to "start"...voltage drop across the starter solenoid...sounds ok to me...anybody else feel free to jump in.<br /><br />Solenoid should "click" when you turn the key...but if it's not working then you couldn't get 12v to the starter. Starter should be spinning. It's definately not working. (you say you have 12v at the starter...that's measuring from the starter pos terminal to the engine block, right?)<br /><br />Had it been a while since you ran it...long enough for the battery to self-discharge (couple months probably)? Seems like it should have charged up during your first run. Maybe not. But get the engine started first then check out the charging system.<br /><br />Unless...could a solenoid stick closed? That'd drain the battery. But then why would turning the key have any effect on the voltage at the switch? If the solenoid is stuck closed I guess you should have continuity (and/or voltage?) between the two small terminals. I never heard of this happening though. Seems like it would heat up.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Switch or??

Your thought process on this taking you in circles. Always start with the obvious -- #1 make sure you have a fully charged battery that is capable of HOLDING a charge. Charging a bad battery or jumping it proves nothing. Get it load tested. #2 Make sure the charging system is functioning. Measure battery voltage with engine off. Then start it and measure again at about 2000 RPM. If its still 12.6 volts or lower it isn't charging. #3 remove, clean, inspect both ends of both battery cables. Any corrosion means resistance to current flow. Check the cable ends where the cables enter. If there are signs of corrosion, remove and install new terminals or replace the cables. Now if the problem isn't resolved, using a jumper cable, jump from BAT POSITIVE to the large terminal on the starter. If it spins up freely its not the starter. If it doesn't it is the problem.

 

[jvaccarino]

Re: Switch or??

Upinsmoke.. went from Batt pos to starter and starter spun freely.. I still however, am not able to jump the solenoid to get the key to turn on the ignition.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Switch or??

You've proven the starter and battery is good. But I have no idea what you mean when you say "unable to jump the solenoid to get the key to turn on the ignition". The key switch either works and the solenoid energizes the starter or it doesn't. The key has nothing to do with turning on the ignition other than removing the ground the kills the engine when the switch is placed in the OFF position. If you mean the key switch does not energize the solenoid, you need to troubleshoot the ignition switch or the wiring to the solenoid. Did you actually make the cable checks I mentioned. If not, using the jumper proved only that the starter and battery are good. That did not prove the battery cables and connections are ok. Use a short piece of wire to jump from the large post on the solenoid that has the POS battery cable on it, and the small terminal on the solenoid that has the wire on it that comes from the key switch. If the starter spins, the solenoid is ok and the wiring back to the key switch or the switch itself is bad. If not, you are back to the battery cables or solenoid. As a quick check, disconnect the main engine harness plug and check the terminals. Plug and unplug it several times and retry starting with the key.

 

[--GQ--]

Re: Switch or??

Originally posted by 93nightmare:<br /> I don't know if I started the day off with a fully charged battery.. I had to jump the battery with my truck early in the morning, because before I took it out,I wanted to start it to make sure it was going to run...but, the boat ran after I jumped it, had no problem starting right back up... mid day, went to leave, and the key wouldn't turn.. thats when I took the batteries back and charged them both... <br /><br />SO.. now both batteries read 12.5/ 12.4.. and like I said, have power running all the way thru.. just does not turn or even click

Starter components, whether in a boat, a car or a bus, operate on the same basic principle. If the battery reads fine and the switch is checked out and the wires leading to the starter is hot then problem is within the starter components. When you turn the key, you should hear a click at the starter. the click is the movement of the solenoid closing a set of contact which engage the starter motor. <br /><br />The solenoid in your starter is similar to that in your door bell. the cylinder moves up and down or back and forth when the coil around it receives current thus creating a magnetic field which propel the solenoid. the clicking is due to the contacts mating. <br /><br />You said you have voltage across the solenoid. Are you sure not across the motor because the wire across the motor is hot all the time. The switch to activates the motor is within the housing. <br /><br />Solenoid coils seldom fault. Make sure the connections on the solenoid are good and there absolutely no click.<br /><br />Most of the time, problem relating to starters are due to the motors armatures. Overtime the soft metal stripes riding on the armature wear out thus no electrical contacts.<br /><br />Just my thoughts relating to Electricity.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Switch or??

Originally posted by 93nightmare:<br /> I've got 12v going to the solenoid, the starter, and back to the switch.

How did you determine that you've got "12v going to the solenoid, the starter, and back to the switch"?