Tilt motor fill port

[Matthew A.]

Okay...this is gonna sound a bit stupid but where's the fill port on my tilt motor. Seloc manual doesn't even mention my specific tilt assembly nor specify if there's a location common to most tilt fill ports. The tilt is off an 1988 85 hp. Two wire, single shock, single trim ram single tilt ram/shock.
There is a small knurled cap threaded onto the side of the tilt motor about midway between it's top and bottom.
Also, Seloc doesn't specify how to rebuild the non-ram shock. It mentions the tilt ram/shock only.

Also, the rubber bushing located at the top of tilt ram where the ram attaches to the swivel bracket bolt is no longer usable. Is there a replacement for it that anyone might know of. My local parts dealer lists the piston rod assembly and rubber bushing as one unit. The only "bushing" listed is the metal insert sleeve/bearing used to "bearing" the the tilt ram via bolt to the swivel bracket

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

The knurled knob (wow, that's alliteration!) is the fill and the tilt/trim should be fully retracted to check and fill fluid. Clymers Manual
Why do you need to rebuild the shock? has it failed completely and moves by hand with little or no resistance? If you can move it by hand with a fair amount of resistance, it is ok. To rebuild it you need a wrench like a deck key-- I believe they are called spanners. Take off the rubber cap and use the spanner to unscrew the shock top cap--not easy, they are on very tight. Then the cap, piston and rod come out as a unit. The piston has one O ring on it. If you need to replace the top cap seal, you need to unscrew the piston--very difficult to do. And I don't know if the seal is available-- I forget if it is an O ring or something else. I haven't taken one apart for a couple of years. If you really need a shock, email me. I have plenty. I'll give you one--just pay shipping. That's a hell of a lot easier than rebuilding.
Someone else on this forum posted a way to turn bushings from aluminum--they never wear out.

 

[Matthew A.]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

Hiya Frank!
Thanks for the info regarding the fill port.

I figured as long as I've got the entire O.B. disassembled, I might as well rebuild the trim/tilt unit. The shock works fine except the last 1/2 inch to 3/4 inches of travel there is no dampening when the shock is fully extended. Although, that is something I can live with. The issue that concerns me is the piston scrapping along the inside of the shock tube. It's not bad as it seems to only occur when the piston has a little sideways pressure applied to it while moving it up and down as well as when rotating the piston shaft.
I think the "reel" reason I really wish to rebuild the shock and trim unit is probably more curiosity then neccessity.
Just to be certain we are on the same track regarding the shock bushings...the person replaced the shocks rubber bushings with one's they turned from aluminum?
If so I guess that would work wouldn't it. However, I managed to recall the fact that I happened have some left over rubber bushings from when I replaced my trucks stock shocks with Bilsteins. A bit of turning and/or drilling and they should work...

 

[RRitt]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

seaman,

it is normal for the shock to have no dampening in the last 1/2" or so of travel. You can't make it go away. As the shock is depressed the piston shaft displaces fluid. Oil is not compressable so there must be some air in the assembly that can compress as the shaft is lowered. That last 1/2" is required. A shock with no air in it will not compress.

it is normal for them to scrape slightly towards the top of the stroke if the piston shaft is pullled to one side or another. Once the shaft is about halfway down it should take a pretty good effort to make it scrape. There is no o-ring seal or centering device on the piston. It is just a metal slug. If you think the scraping is excessive then put the piston on a bolt and put that into a drill press. While the piston is spinning you can make minor grinds and polishes with losing roundness. use a fine file to knock off any knicks and polish with 600 wet/dry.

the inner top seals were never sold by mercury. if you use heat to break the cover loose then you need to replace them. The lower one is a regular o-ring. The top one should be urethane rod wiper or EPDM square-ring. Buna will break down too quickly if exposed to weather.

The best top bushing replacement I have found is nylon sleeve with self-lubricating brass bearing insert. You will buy them as two seperate parts. The OD of the brass needs to be equal to the ID of the nylon. The brass should have 9/16 ID and be "oilite" type with embedded lubrication. Both are commonly available from places like grainger. If you can't find the exact size then get brass of smaller ID and turn the inner ID. Mercury's $28ea for rubber with AL sleeve is ridiculous. It's like paying 5x for an inferior product. Yours is probably messed up because it got galvanically fused to shaft. Happens all the time. Aluminum + stainless = battery. grinding off some paint and slapping a slab of zinc to bottom of trim housing will help in the future. Less invasive and equally effective is getting rid of the stainless. Kunifer is better tubing and aluminum makes a fine shaft if it is of sufficient diameter to resist shearing. KuNi is the tubing of choice in commercial and naval but I guess when only charging $15,000 for an engine they just can't afford to spring the extra $1 per foot for recreational boats.

 

[Matthew A.]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

I'll tell you what so far has been the biggest pain in the rear as far taking this motor completely apart. And that would be removing the swivel brackets top thru bolt at the brackets tilt pivot point. Not being stainless it had fused itself into the aluminum of the swivel bracket. It took me four days of drilling, heating, soaking with oil and finally 6 hours of pounding with a 3 1/2 pound sledge to get the bolt to come loose. All I can say is...what a beating. I don't understand why Force would go ahead and use a stainless steel bolt for the shock mounts and not for the swivel bracket's top bolt where the bracket pivots while tilting. Especially since it is underwater whenever the boat is at rest. I do have to admit that I'm the one most at fault for not replacing the pressed in zerk fittings Force chose to use at the pivot point with threaded zerks. Had I done so earlier, I am certain I would not have had an issue with fused components had I kept them greased properly. Most defineately a live and learn situation. Especially so in a saltwater enviroment. Therefore, I am going to take your advice on installing an additional annode to heart. Cause I never want to go thru that nightmare again if it can at all be prevented.

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

Matt: I've often wondered about that bolt myself. The only thing I can think of is that they wanted the strength of steel versus stainless. Also, it is a carriage bolt and extra long. They may not have been able to get them in stainless or didn't want to pay the price. I suspect the latte: 1,2,or 3 bucks extra for 100,000 units adds up to some serious change.

 

[RRitt]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

hey frank - if you have a bunch of shocks (or other parts too) lying about then I'd be more than happy to buy some from you. am always looking for parts to cannibalize.

you know ... i've never had such a problem with the top bolt as with the stainless shaft that runs through the trim housing. I suspect that you might be talking about a different bolt. The pivot bolt that I am thinking of goes right behind the steering tube. If your steering tube is underwater at rest then you've got some serious problems. galvanically speaking - saltwater+SS is much rougher on aluminum than saltwater+steel. When stainless 3xx gets a S/W film on it the galvanic potential rises by a full three notches. SS-3xx plus aluminum is very nearly a worst case scenario in saltwater. All things being equal with a modest amount of rust prevention the SS shafts should seize before the steel ones. none of my industrial supply wholesalers can get that size carriage bolt in stainless. fastenall carries a lot of wierd nuts and bolts, maybe they could get it in SS.

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

Oh! That *&%$#@ thing! I've had them corroded in so badly that I had to take the engine off the transom, remove the whole assembly and press it out in a 50 ton press.
as far as shocks, if you just want to disassemble and not use, I have some bad ones and some tilt tubes too badly corroded to use that you can play with. You can have them if you want. let me know.
BTW--sorry about misleading you about the O ring on the piston. Its been a long time since I disassembled one and I thought I remembered seeing an O ring. Maybe I was thinking about something else.

 

[Matthew A.]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

No problem...and yes...that *&%$#@ thing! LOL

Say Frank...might you happen to have an extra cylinder block layin around. While my friend and I were minding our own business and happily cruising along down the freeway on our way to the machine shop, we couldn't help notice the truck directly in front of us had decided to let loose it's entire load of cement blocks! What a really nice man...Anyhow... After hitting a few of those blocks and now finding us more then slightly airborn at some 70 mph, I couldn't help but notice a blurry shape of something shooting by us...bouncing and tumbling...tumbling and bouncing... into the air...end over end.
To my surprise.....and eventually; shock and horror... I couldn't help but notice that the object looked exactly like the same kind of cylinder block I put in the back of his pickup truck.

"Well what do ya know"... I asked my friend..."that looks just like the block I put in the back of your truck"....

"Well hey....that IS... the block I put in the back of your P.U. truck.."

All I can say is thank God for my friend since he put it all into perspective for me when he just looked at me blank faced and simply said......"was"...

"sigh"

Well...at least it happened on the way to the shop instead of after.

 

[RRitt]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

glad that you are okay Seaman.

If it is THAT *&%$#@ thing! ... then the magic word during really desperate times is sawzall. You can safely shave 1/16" off each end of the trim housing on your way down to the shaft.

frank, email or call me at 239-542-6257. Maybe we can arrange a good for bad trade or something. Generally speaking two broken but rebuildable trims are worth one reman. I'm always looking for more parts.

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

Talk about bad luck with an engine! Fate is trying to tell you something! At least you're still around to buy another block. Actually, Force is such a good engine that the block should still be usable LOL Hope your friend got the number of that truck. His (The truck) insurance should pay you the 800 bucks for a replacement block. Let me check in my garage--I know I have two blocks but they are old style 3.312 bore. But yours is an 89 with a 3.312 bore also, isn't it? I'll get back to you by email with photos in a few days.

And RRitt please repost your email address. I'll send you a couple of photos of what I have and you can decide if they are worth anything in trade. thanks.

 

[RRitt]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

Frank, I edited profile to allow email. You should now be able to see it by clicking on username.

 

[Matthew A.]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

LOL....I think fate, if it's trying to tell me anything at all, is that boat owners are not allowed to spend their money elsewhere...
Unfortuneately, my friends auto insurance did not include comprehensive. Although, most homeowners insurance would cover my loss, since neither my friend nor myself have homeowners insurance I'm kinda outa luck. As far as the driver at fault goes, we're still waiting to hear from the police if they have been able to track the person down since the truck never even slowed down. They just kept on goin as if it never happened. The only problem being is that no one was able to get the license plate number of the driver responsible.

Concerning getting that dumb bolt out, I used a cutoff wheel attached to a drill. Worked like a charm. Only problem being that although one part of the bolt slid out easily enough. It was the other half that gave me so much trouble. Eventually I used a number 32 drill bit to drill down along both the bolt and the bracket. Thus creating away for the wd40 to get at the corrosion. Since I didn't drill all the way down the length of the bolt it should give grease better access down that half of the bolt.

Frank, my motor is/was an 1988 B model. Which I am pretty sure uses the 3.312 stock bore.
I find it odd that the 75 hp Forces use a bore of 3.375" and the 85 hp a smaller one. I wonder what changes, if any, where made to increase the hp rating by 10.

 

[RRitt]

Re: Tilt motor fill port

you have to do both sides of the shaft. The dead carcass of shaft stays fused into trim housing until you can safely use heavier machinery.,