To weld or not to weld...

David R · Nov 12, 2002

Hi, I'm a sad boater. This past Thanksgiving weekend (Canadian) my boat sank in a fall storm on Georgian Bay. Its very likely that if it had been raised the same day it sank there would have been no problem. Unfortunately it took four days to be raised during which time the high edge rubbed on the rocks. I'm looking for advice on whether the opening can be welded and on what the long-term implications are. The insurance company assessor is writing it off, but is under valuing the boat at the same time (IMO).

For those interested in more detail go to: http://home.eol.ca/~vacuum/boat_repair I have a mini-web that I built for a representative of a local boat building company to look, for those who would like more detailed images. A parallel thread is also in the OB motor forum covering the motor repairs. David

David R · Nov 12, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

mmm... I'm not sure why the pictures aren't coming up, but the links do work. David

93evinrude · Nov 12, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

Sorry to hear of your misfortune.Hope it all works out for you. Question:If they write the boat off and give you the cash,will they allow you to keep the boat?I had a similar problem years ago and was able to keep the boat.Never hurts to ask....Then you can decide whether or not to repair it.

JB · Nov 12, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

Hi, David. There is good welding of aluminium and there is awful welding of same. The latter makes the aluminium very brittle and almost guarantees future fracture. A riveted patch has the risk of working loose and leaking. Were it me I would focus on getting the appraisal up to market levels and get a new boat. Good luck.

CalicoKid · Nov 12, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

...On good welding: If you take the boat apart so that the welding and repairs can be done right, and have it done by a skilled welder or boatbuilder, you should get great results. This is no place to get shady with the repairs so it could cost alot, but that's why you pay your insurance premiums, right?

David R · Nov 12, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

93evinrude - The breakdown is 4000(cdn) + 600 for taxes - 800 for salvage - 500 for deductable 3300 to me if I keep the boat This where we're at right now take all the money and walk away, or some money and a minimum repair bill. JB - I have heard of stress issues, but you have a good point. The big argument is over the new windshield, console and convertible to added this past June. The Appaiser doesn't seem to care. David

Paleface · Nov 12, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

Do you get more boat if you spend $3300 on this one or a new one? Looks like a simple enough repair to me. A crafsman should be able to fix that up nicely.

93evinrude · Nov 12, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

I was hoping that they weren't interested in the salvage value. It might be a good idea to contact Crestliner themselves with your issues and see what they say;after all,they know the boat and its design better than anyone and may be able to recommend someone in your area that has expertise with their boats. Also,there is a company called REM Boat Repair in the Bradford area and I would highly recommend them as they did some work for me.I also know others that have had work done there and were just as impressed.I just don't know if they repair aluminum boats but may be worth checking out.

David R · Nov 12, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

CalicoKid - I'm waiting for some responses back from a couple of welding/boat building companies. One of the three that I've approached has turned it down. The results would have been unreliable and ugly (not their words), as well as to costly. Paleface - I couldn't obtain another used hull with walk-through windshield, dual consoles and stand-up convertible top. I'm in agreement, I don't think its should be all that difficult, but it may not be possible to do for the money. I've obtained some of the appraiser's report and 10 hrs was for re-enforcing the hull (no explaination), 20 hrs to repair exterior where bottom meets side, and 4 hrs to refinish, 13 hrs to re&re the floor. David

David R · Nov 12, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

93evinrude - Thanks for the tips. I may follow-up with you on REM. I've also received a recommendation for an aluminum welder near Edgar (just a little north of Barrie) that does race car frames, float planes, and other aircraft work. It never occured to me to contact Crestliner, I may still have a name of someone in engineering to. David

magster65 · Nov 13, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

It can be fixed... how easily depends on the aluminum quality. An experienced qualified welder can 'tig' up anything. This will not distort or cause any stress points. The 'race car' welder may be a good place to look, he has lots of repair experience. Take the insurance money and fix your boat. Sorry to see your mishap.

DJ · Nov 14, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

DavidR, One thing you are going to have to deal with, if you weld, is the foam in the the bottom of the hull. It may be in other places too. You, and the welder, should be wary of what is behind the weld areas.

cloumar · Nov 14, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

Hi David, About the motor any damage, still repairable or need a new on ? This is sad to see a nice boat getting down water !!! Mario

David R · Nov 14, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

magster65 - Thanks for the reassurances, the tough part is getting the boat looked at. Had one of the custom aluminum boat builders look at it via the web and they turned it down. Was going to be costly, unreliable, and not nice to look at. djohns19 - I've been wondering about that foam since the start of this. I'm thinking someone renovated the boat and removed the foam in the back-end. I was under the impression that the capacity of the boat was that it had to float a certain weight of motor, gear, and people. It certainly didn't do that. I've had an independant (small business) welder get back to me. Estimated 4-500 dollars (cdn) for the weld, and a couple of hours for the floor. I'm waiting to hear back from one other local boat building operation. These guys are making money hand over fist. Booked with custom boats through until late spring. Hasn't had a chance to go look at the boat. I've got names of three other welders that do this kind of work. I'd just a soon not tow the boat all over Ontario, to get estimates. David

Mikedg · Nov 14, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

David: Did you have Kropf Marine in Parry Sound look at it? They are one of the best custom aluminum boat builders with thier Stanley line. Mike

David R · Nov 14, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

Mikedg - I did ask Kropf to look at, they're the ones that turned it down. Stanley (Stanlie?) is a separate operation run by Conner Industries in Parry Sound. Its possible that they were related at one time. There do seem to be alot of aluminum welders up there with their own businesses. David

David R · Nov 14, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

smokyforce - Look for deep six that... motor? in the OB section. Going to do the starter, switches, and solenoids myself. Then wait to see what happens. David

magster65 · Nov 14, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

Wow!

That repair isn't rocket science. You should see what we fix around here (Victoria bc). The folks that told you the repair is costly, unreliable and ugly should get out of the business. The repair will look like knitted scar until you polish it out and if it's welded PROPERLY it'll have no weak spots. As for expense... the going rate would be around $6 or $7 an inch for the welding and $45 an hour for 'cosmetics'. A proper weld job will not be ugly and will only require a minor polish. The foam I'm not so sure about. I think the spray foam that you can pick up at the local hardware store (for sealing around your house windows) would work well to refill what's removed. Don't give up, you just haven't talked to the right folks yet. Good luck.

David R · Nov 15, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

magster65 - Thanks for the numbers. They're really helpful for me to figure who is over the top and who is in-line. I'll have to do some checking on foam. Poly-urethane breaksdown with exposure to the sun's UV rays, not a problem in this case. Don't know about constant moisture and water. Talked to Crestliner today. So long as its a quality weld it has very little impact on the hull (my sumation). David

David R · Nov 21, 2002

Re: To weld or not to weld...

I've received more information from one of the local boat builders. He went and looked at the hull to estimate costs, and reported the hull is deformed. Between the opening on the outside edge and the keel, the underside has become "bellied down". Between this same area and the transom has a formed a hook. Neither of the conditions can be easly removed apparently, if at all. He's suggesting that boat will list bow down on the starboard side, when in motion. Similar to two people sitting on the same side. Guess I'll have to go look at the boat again. My wife and I looked before for these things and couldn't see anything, there was even another boat of the same model trailered two spaces away to compare it with. Any opinions? David

To weld or not to weld...

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