Trying to get more... ended up with less

[90stingray]

I have my 01 GX 185 4.3v6. Ran her with the 23p alum 3 blade and was 4800rpm at 52 mph. Boat felt great... good holeshot and speed. I could trim until the prop blew out. Thought i could do better. Swapped for a solas 4 blade ss 23p. Today we went 4000 rpm and 48mph. Holeshot felt sluggish and of course the lost mph sucks. I trimmed to the limit and never blew out the prop. I was trying to get a little more holeshot and if i ended up with more mph, then ok. But i ended up with neither! Go figure.

I guess my prop education needs some help. I had swapped quite a few props on my old stingray... once i found that 17p was the sweet spot, that hull didn't care whether it was 3, 4, or 5 blades on the prop... it always went to 4800rpm. So i guess i applied that theory to my glastron... 23p worked to get 4800 and i thought a ss and 4 blades would get me what i wanted.

So, i guess i am looking for some thoughts... just sell the solas ss and stay with the 3 blade alum since it works so well? Or try something different? What are your thoughts?

 

[steelespike]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

I had a great long answer and lost it so here goes short and simple.
You have an al prop that is working great.Especially when you have "good holeshot and 52 mph top speed.
When going to a 4 blade it is usually suggested to drop one inch in pitch. When going from al to ss results can be unpredictable.
I am surprised it didn't improve your hole shot and not surprised you lost speed and rpm.
There probably are props that might help you but there is a saying "the faster you go the harder it is to go faster".
Fine tuning a 50 mph boat is a little beyond my scope.There are some guys here that can help.
If I have the right gear ratio, 1.81, your at a respectable 9% slip.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Yes I have 1.81 ratio. I know it was great with the alum prop... just found a great deal on the stainless and from my experience on my stingray, I thought it would work for me. I did run a slip calculator on the stainless and was getting 0% slip.

 

[Philster]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Your gear ratio is interesting. Let's you spin a bigger prop than expected.

You were already at the wall with speed. Turning that 23p, 3-blader.... that was it. That's the max she could deliver. You added resistance with an extra blade.

My take is this: SS props have more design to them. They almost always have more cupping. The SS can handle it. Cupping can knock of a little RPM, but the big hit is the extra blade.

Here is the deal: If you dropped to a 21p, 4B, SS Solas, you were expected to lose 2 MPH, maybe 3 MPH anway. You didn't drop in pitch, so the hit would be even more severe.

Your original prop is probably not going to be beat on the top end, unless you get a modern, SS, 3-blade prop and have it labbed to an exact specification and get 1-2 MPH in return.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Philster, so what do you think is a good 3 blade prop? Mercury venegance, laser II, mirage? I should stick with the 23p correct? But will i still make 4800? Or will it be lower?

Like i said earlier, all my previous experience is worthless on this hull. Keep the thoughts coming this way. Thanks.

 

[Philster]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Tempest Plus comes to mind. That's a step ahead in quality and design over the Laser or Vengeance. I say you will still make 4800 RPM w/ 23P and get a little less slip.

Mirage? I say no to this. Mirage is more for a bigger/deeper V boat.

The Vengeance is probably vanilla in design like your alum prop was.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Everything is saying the tempest plus is a bass boat prop. I dunno. At $400+ that's a pretty large gamble. I am looking on ebay for a lightly used one. I really don't know what to think. I guess that's why i am here asking. I tried mercurys prop selector... came up with a few. Like enertia, vensura, revolution 4. Yeah, the venegance sounds like a generic prop. I think i am leaning toward a 3 blade ss. I would think i could get more mph out of a good 3 blade ss prop and still keep my original hole shot. What kind of improvements or downsides would i expect with a 23p 3 blade ss prop?

 

[Philster]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

The Tempest is on my rig, a V-bottom boat w/ 22 degrees of deadrise and 24' in length. It is simply one of the best 3B props on hulls like yours and mine.

There are some flatter Checkmate hulls running the Tempest, too. Occassionally, you'll hear someone outgunned one, but in various tests, Checkmate kept finding the Tempest the fastest.

The marketing lead-in for the Tempest is directed to Bass Boaters, but the guidelines for the prop are 'maximum lift'.

I gave a 'play it safe' option: Venegeance.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Well, I will keep an eye out for a tempest and in the mean time I will try to get my solas 4 blader sold. Thanks for the info and direction.

 

[Jlawsen]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Going from 3 to 4 blades. Drop and inch in diameter and and inch in pitch and you find what you're looking for. You might loose 1-2mph on the top end but the rest should be what you're looking for.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Should I only look at the newer props with the tunable holes? Found a killer deal on an older one with no holes... so let me know what you all think. I have never had one with vent holes before.

 

[Philster]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Tough question. Generally, it's nice to have the option to pull the plugs on the vent holes if you feel you need better snap out of the hole. If you are at all worried about that, then get a prop with vent holes.

It's tough because it's subjective and what works for one owner might now work for another. You might not rest until you have the ultimate low-end response, if that is what you are looking for. That what the vent holes allow you to tune: low-end response.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Well this craigslist prop ended up being a quicksiver prop. Called torrant? and has square vent holes. I think I'll pass on that one. Actually found a guy on the checkmate website who has a like new one for about the same money. I'm trying not to spend every dime I have... since I don't really need a prop

 

[Philster]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Well... you really don't!

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Well... you really don't!

I know, I know... but I am probably leaving some speed and holeshot on the table with the aluminum. Wife is trying to tell me to just be happy too.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Well, i just got me a Tempest Plus 23p. It does have the vent holes. Right now the large hole ones are installed. Found a guy that had a Checkmate that needed more pitch... so, $225 later, and i have a prop. Looks nice. I haven't had a chance to run her yet... since the wind is blowing about 35-40mph! And i am in the middle of a exhaust manifold conversion. But, i am excited to give her a go... and see what happens.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Well... ran the tempest plus last night. Holeshot felt different with the vent holes, had the most open holes installed. Kinda felt like it was slipping during takeoff. But after a few holeshots i kinda liked it... almost like driving a drag car with a stall converter. Anyways went 50mph at 4300. I am not satisfied with that. Do you think i would get any more mph going to a 21p tempest plus. I know in theory it should be slower... but it would get it better in rpm range and possibly be faster?

 

[Philster]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

See, this is the issue with advanced SS props. They have so much more design and cupping that it knocks even more RPM off. That's why your deal from the get-go was tough: you were running pretty strong as it was. How do you top that? 52 @ 4800 RPM? That's all she had.

I think you're stuck in the middle. I think a 21p might return 52 MPH, which is what you had before. 21p props don't run much faster than that. I mean, at some point, the math gods come in and the engine's power, the gear ratio and low slip put a 21p at around 52-53 MPH. But the hole shot is better, so the SS wins. ::shrug::


If you get too much slip on the low end, you can run less vents or smaller ones.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Philster, you are probably right about the 21p. I found a slip calculator and punched in 4800 (if it would even turn 4800) and all the other numbers and got just over 50 mph. It is pretty amazing that my off the shelf bass pro 3 blade alum really cant be beat. It was worth a try anyways... that way i am not wondering. I KNOW to leave it alone. Imagine that the wife was right.

 

[90stingray]

Re: Trying to get more... ended up with less

Well after i resold the tempest plus 23p... i must have felt like that money was burning a hole in my pocket... i pulled the trigger on a new 21p 3 blade ss solas prop. I have a little buyers remorse but i will give it a go... that way i wont keep thinking i can do better. I am curious to see how holeshot does as well as top mph. I will report back once i get the prop and give her a test run.