Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

[mysticowner]

I have owned and run my Glastron Carlson CV 23 since 1977. That tells you how old I am. Well my wife and I would like a little more comfort than the cuddy offers for over night stays. We'll use the CV for the day trips and use the cabin boat for the others.

1. There are only two of us so I don't need a 49 footer. What size would you recommend for three day cruises tops, without being cramped?

2. I don't want to leave the boat in the water. I heard you shouldn't unload big boats from a trailer. What would be the definition of to big to trailer?
Is there any truth to this?

3. What brand would you recommend? I'm looking for an older boat in the 85 to 90 range. Junk will probably be rotted by now I suppose so that should help weed them out I hope.

4. Most seem to have a 5.7 chevy engine that I've seen. Is that enough engine? I've always run big blocks (Ford) so I would like to stick with them if possible.

5. I found a 26' sea ray sundancer with a 460 engine bravo drive. What do you think? Which drive is tougher and easiest to rebuild? I'm an industrial electrician & mechanic, I like to do all my own work other than machining if possible..

6 should I stay away from the OMC drive since they are out of business?

I'm leaning toward 26' as a maximum length so what do you think in that footage and the 85 to 90 years?

Thank you for your help!

Dave
Huntingdon Pa.

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

Would probably stay away from the OMC stuff as you said, the parts are more expensive and getting harder to come by. The 460 "King Cobra" wasn't a bad design/engine, but things like exhaust components are getting more scarce from what I have read.

A 26-27 foot boat will be just fine for your purpose, and aside from small differences here and there (like layout), most manufacturers of boats in that time period/size are pretty much equal. Wellcraft, SeaRay, etc all made decent boats. All of the normal stuff applies though, check for floor rot/transom rot. You'll see a lot of 7.4L engines mixed in there, too. Twin engines were an option for some, but you won't see too many of them, and they are usually twin 4.3L, or 5.0's.

Suggestions would be SeaRay 268/270 Sundancer, Wellcraft Antigua, Carver Montego, Regal Commodore are some off the top of my head. All will have plenty of room around the cockpit, sleep 4-6 if needed, have full head/galley. Probably won't find generators on much of anything in this class, but it's always a plus if they do. A/C is somewhat common, but without the genny, it means you have to be on shore power.

 

[mysticowner]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

Fresh water use only. Lake Raystown Huntingdon Pa

No need for a second engine.

 

[Don S]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

5. I found a 26' sea ray sundancer with a 460 engine bravo drive

The Bravo outdrive is a Mercruiser drive, and Mercruiser NEVER used the 460. That was OMC. Not even close to being interchangable. So I would guess that that boat was put together with some custom parts, and should be avoided it at all costs.

 

[mysticowner]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

Crap! You're right it's a 454....

It was a bayliner that had the 460 in it. Did they ever put a 460 in the sea ray boats?

What's the low down on the drives? Alpha, Bravo etc? Which is best for a big block? Which is marginal?

I really appreciate your help. I've been working with jet boats for the last....
36 years. Now if you need help or info on one of them!

What about the trailering a big boat filling the engine with water when you back in??

Thank you very much again!

 

[CaptainSkip]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

I was looking for the same thing... ended up getting a 26' Marinette, they have a rock solid aluminum hull that wont rot. It was re-powered with a 318 Chrysler in 84. It's light and I tow it with a half ton pickup. Basic layout has bathroom, stove, sink, frig, v-birth bed and dinette turns to a bed. Basically the same layout as an older Chris Craft cruiser which was another choice, also I liked the Carver. Found a lot of good boats without trailers but ended up getting a package deal. Good luck and keep us posted if you find anything.

 

[mysticowner]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

I'll do that. I appreciate the input. Have you ever heard that you shouldn't unload a long boat from a trailer?

My 23 footer has never been a problem. The article I saw that in was of a boat survey. The boat was a 26 footer, I have never heard of anything
like that anywhere else.

Anyone?

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

I've never heard of any issues putting ANY boat in the water from a trailer. I'm sure if you left the boat strapped to the trailer at the rear and back out into a steep ramp, you could have issues, but the boat will float the minute it hits the water.

I haven't ever seen the 460 in the SeaRay's. I have seen a lot of the 454/Alpha I combo which is just fine. The 454 is a good engine, but I would look for a Bravo outdrive if you can. Basically, Alphas were the first design (leaving out the MR drives, etc) Mercruiser had and have been used in pretty much all boats with 300HP or less. Mercruiser developed the Bravo outdrives to handle more power (mainly higher torque) of the big block engines. Either one will suit a 26-27 cruiser just fine, the Bravo is just a bit beefier.

I like the layout/look of the Wellcrafts and Regals of the period, but they all get the job done. Most of them keep the same general design until the early 90's when many of the boat builders started getting a little more streamlined with the boats' looks.

 

[mike343]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

Fresh water, small lake. Lots of well maintained Bayliners out there. Try to find one. Lighter towing than Sea Rays.

 

[mysticowner]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

There's a 24 foot bayliner sierra sundeck close by. He's asking $9500 for it with a trailer.

It's in really nice shape for a 1989. What do you think of the price?

It's the highest $ I've seen for an equilivant boat but is a nicer boat than most other bayliners I've seen pictures of.

The sundeck upholstery was redone. No hot n cold water just a pump, no firdge just an ice box, no shower.

What should I expect price wise?

That's about what I've seen some of 87-89 26' sea ray sundowners going for with trailer.

There are a pile of them for sale now in the 24 to 26' range. I imagine the price will come down even more if gas hits $4.00 a gallon this year.

I'm looking for a camper on the water so I would need to modify that boat for the hot N cold water with a demand pump, fridge, put a shower on the rear of the boat I guess.

It just seems with the original cost and modifications cost I'd be better off to keep looking for a bit bigger boat.

The boat just went two rounds on ebay starting at $9000 with no opening bids.

What size do you like? I liked the idea of the mid table and shower.

 

[chuck in WA]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

I've never been a huge fan of the express cruser style boat (for example Searay Sundancer or Bayliner Sierra) for the simple fact that it seems to me to be a fair weather only boat. Yes, there is plenty of room "below decks" to get comfortable, but if you actually want to drive somewhere in inclament weather you have to sit "outside" in the elements. IMO, canvas is a poor choice for rain/wind protection compared to a cabin. The aforementioned style of boat is probably fine in warm climates, but here in WA state (and if you're in PA), I consider a "real" cabin with helm to be a better choice for all weather and extended season boating. (and no clausterphobia factor to boot - man some of those portholes are tiny!).

 

[mysticowner]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

You make valid points. Truth is though if it's cold and rainy, my boat's in the garage. We only go out on nice days the the worst case for us is a storm comes up and we ride that out.

It's not like we have an ocean to cross or anything here. It's a 28 mile long lake that snakes through the mountains of central pa.

We'd be good with sundancer or sundeck.

Thank you

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

If it was me, I'd like a 24-26' cruiser with an aft cabin. Single 350 I/O. Twins are just twice the headache and I wouldn't be looking to haul ***** with a boat like this anyway. I'd love to have a cruiser for Raystown

 

[mysticowner]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

I agree, the aft cabin boats seem to offer the extra room we may or may not need. I don't want any part of a twin engine set up. Twice the trouble.

Will a 350 push one of these boats near 40 MPH? I will probably go with the big block engine if nothing else for the torque. I know I could build a 454 to put out 425 HP very easily.

What HP ranges do the different drives support?

Alpha
Bravo
mercruiser
volvo

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

The alpha and Bravo are both MADE by Mercruiser. If you have a big block, go with the Bravo. Also, even though you can build a street-rod 425HP 454, you can't do it on a boat, search the word "reversion" to find out why. The only way you'd be able to do it is if you changed over to water-jacketed headers and thru-hull exhaust.

I love the express cruisers for the very fact that you do sit outside when steering. 99% of the people with express cruisers aren't going to by driving around in rain or freezing temps, so being out of the weather isn't much of a concern. The fully enclosed camper tops serve their purpose for the rare trips in colder weather or rain. Most cruisers like that won't reach 40mph, but they'll get close usually low-mid 30's at cruise. There also isn't much difference in top speeds between the small/big block choices, usually 1-3mph at most, it just how hard the engine has to work to get on plane that the big blocks seem to excel a bit more in.

I would definitely try to find a cruiser with a fridge, full shower/head, and full canvas enclosure included. Most of the other stuff is optional. Twins are not necessarily that much more work, and can be close to the same in fuel. However, when stuff goes wrong with both engines, it gets expensive in a hurry. The upside to twin engines is the boat tracks much better, and also makes maneuvering in tight corridors (i.e. docking/trailering) a bit easier if you know what you're doing.

PS - you won't hardly find anything Volvo on boats of that size/vintage.

 

[mysticowner]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

Thank you for the education, I do feel like I'm going to school on this. I know it will be culture shock going back to the screw drive from my jet.

Does anyone know about what I would pay for a marine survey on something like a 268 sundancer? Would you get a boat surveyed if you were buying one?

I'm not up on the dirves but the rest of the boat I do know what I'm looking for.

I do feel it would be wise to have the opinion of an expert!

So what price range should I expect?

You guys are great, Thank you!

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

http://www.boattrader.com/listing/1989-SEA-RAY-268-Sundancer-89886427

Here's agreat example of a decent shape SD 268 (I didn't search long). Located in Crowley, TX probably means it's been mainly on freshwater lakes (near Dallas). Interior/Exterior upholstery looks well-taken care of. It has the twin V6 engines (cheap to maintain). A/C/Heat Shower, etc. They are asking $19K, but it could probably be had for closer to $15K.

I'm not advocating this or any other boat, just providing some info. A marine surveyor is a good idea to avoid making long trips just to find out the owner was lying about the boat's condition. Some people have trailers included, some don't. It's a crapshoot with this size and up on the cruisers.

 

[mysticowner]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

That's exactly what I'm looking for barring the twin engine set up.
It's not the trip I would like to make... I'm in central Pa.

Quality wise how do the bayliner and sea ray compare? Interior components etc? Bayliner size I think I would be looking at the 25 foot sundeck line.

I'd like to stay within about 200 miles of 16652 when I buy one. I'd be worried to death about hauling a boat that size on an unknown trailer that far.

I'm also looking for fresh water boats.

Seems the nice one's are allways cross country.....

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

You can always have a company haul it for you. In my opinion, with items like boat of this size, and specialty autos; it's perfectly acceptable to drive halfway across the country to get the best deal. It may be harder to find a freshwater boat of this size in/around PA, I don't know for sure. I prefer just about any other brand of boat to a Bayliner, but that's just personal preference. The bayliners use more plastic on them, where Sea Ray and Wellcraft, etc use teak wood and stainless steel instead. They just last longer, and the owners tend to take better care of a boat that costs more.

 

[BTMCB]

Re: Want to buy a cabin boat and need advise

.........and the owners tend to take better care of a boat that costs more.

I respectfully disagree..........any smart owner takes good care of his boat, regardless of its cost. I would guess there are as many owners of "boats that cost more" that don't take proper care as there are owners of lesser value boats that take great care of their boat. IMHO. The brand / value of a boat has no impact on how a dilligent owner cares for his boat.