Working on boats for a living

James Clarke · Dec 4, 2005

I've been around boat's all my life. So I became a mechanic went to school ect. I'm still young. Been working at one marina for 4 1/2 yrs now. Here's my question for all marine techs, is there a certain speed to fix boat's fast to make the shop money? If you haven't had the experience with all the motor's on this planet, is it normal to be slow at a job thats not familiar to you and fix it right the first time what ever the repair procedure is? I've been told i'm to slow.

Working on boat's can be a real pain at times. I beleive if you get more experience the faster you get at what ever repair. After a while it become's a repeated procedure like a assembley line.

cheboygan · Dec 4, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

What is the background of the individual(s) who tell you that "You are too slow"? If being judged by a knowledgeable peer, ask as to how he [or she] could do it faster, all the while maintaining the highest standards of good craftmanship, and thoroughness of problem solving. You might consider advising the complainant that with regard to parts replacement, there are times when it becomes adviseable - if not necessary - to determine proximate cause of failure of said component! Chebacco

rodbolt · Dec 4, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

depends on your level of dedication and education. its rare that I hit a motor that I cant ID the problem in the first hour. happens occasionally but usually by the time I get those its cause the other techs got baffeled and half the time I have to undo what they caused before testing. best advice I can give you is read, read constatly then reread it until your sure you understand how each subsystem on the machine works with the next one. second best advice is to take a course in electronics and become intimate with your test equipment and how to use it and interpet what its telling you. I work with techs daily that are terrified of the test equipment so they wont use it. most failures today are electrical. they are the hardest to diagnose correctly. however changing pumps,t-stats and other mechanical systems just comes with experience. I have done mechanical work for almost 33 years. most of its incredibly simple. there are only so many ways to make something work. all outboards are basically the same. trons are trons and it does not matter where on this planet they came from they all operate under the same physical laws. a quick story years ago when I started working as a production machinest I was worried about production quotas, I had an oldtimer pull me aside and explain it to me. he aid if you know how and why a tool cuts the way it does its all the same and if you learn it and worry more about making quality parts while learning how and why the steel cuts the speed will come later. six years later I was the lead man of the CNC dept and working with R&D on various projects as well as being in charge of CNC tooling and programming. it did require many hours of reading the manuals. by the way, what brand do you specialize in ?

James Clarke · Dec 4, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

We are a Evinrude/Johnson Mercury outboard and Mercruiser, volvo dealer.Very busy place in spring summer fall. It was my employer (owner) that told me I'm slow. He's pretty sharp at dianostic's. He pretty much does everything around the place. Outside(yard) behind the counter (parts) some sales everything. So when a job takes to long he won't charge for all the time because he know's he can do it faster. I told him to hire God to work for him lol. He love's my work in rigging because it goes quik at time's,with no problem's (wich I usually fix) so that's were I've been stuck for a while. There are two other guys that work there, one has long time experience and the other couldn't care less for. They are not the greatest either. I've argued with them even though they are twice my age, and turned out 9.9 times out of ten they are wrong about something. I see it as the young verse's the old and the owner.Kinda like a pinball machine I guess.

rodbolt · Dec 4, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

man it sucks when you have to work with incompetent techs on the line. but as far as speed only 2 things can help. one is a solid knowledge of the subsystems you deal with and the other is experience. time management will be a factor as well. say your gonna reseal a volvo DP. first thing ya do is pull the manual, give the procedure a quick refresher read, then lay out your tools needed for lower unit and prop removal and lay out your seal drivers. then start the job. once everything is apart,cleaned and inspected, if you laid the tooloing out, you can draw what parts you need from stock and proceed. or you can spend an hour walking back and forth. its taken me many years to develop a logical sequence of trouble shooting. but I am quick at it, it also helps that if I am wrong I bought the part not the customer. tends to make ya get it right the first time. a case tech down in venezuela I gave a CD-77 to last summer was testing a no fire codition on a 89 120 jonnyrude. he had 110 volts on the stator output and the book called for 175. trigger voltage was good. no spark on anycylinder. what was the cause? another clue, when the DVA output test was first started the analog meter needle would swing to about 120V then settle at a steady 100-110V. he was taking the stator off when I stopped him. takes about 60V to fire the coils. so the stator output,while low was more than sufficient to spark the system. the trigger inputs were adequate to trigger the system, the clue was watching the analog needle. by the fact it would swing up slightly then settle told me the condensers were charging just not discharging. turned out the crimp on the pack ground had failed. replaced the connector and spark returned. did not come from a book, came from understanding how the sytem works and how to let the equipment tell you what is wrong. about half the issues you will face are ign related, all ign systems use two functions, a coil supply and a control. be it points in a magneto or the new coil in cap setups. be it point operated battery CD to the HPDI TCI ign. you have a supply side and a control side and the electrons act the same. get yourself a copy of: Motor Auto Engines and electrical Syatems. read it,study it. pass all the review questions at the end of each chapter and you will find your skill improves, with an improvement in skill there will be an improvement in speed. the time management is up to you. if I am working on warrenty stuff its usually flat rate, I can beat flat rate almost everytime on new stuff. if its ten years old and saltwater used its strictly time and materiels. but do look at amazon and see if that book is still about. I think its been out of print for sometime. I got my copy when I was in high scool was the christmas of 76 I think. it still sits on the table today and is a good reference to how things work.

whywhyzed · Dec 4, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

JC, a decent worker, not lighting the world on fire, but concienscious, will generate approx. $100 to $150/hour for a marina in parts profits, fuel sales, recreational merchandise and services, word of mouth advertising, boat sales... etc etc... A speedy tech that leaves fasteners loose and fluids low can really damage a business, ruin it in fact. I recently heard the stats for the number of registered apprentices working in the marine industry in Ontario. It's brutal. Don't burn out, we need you. Skin of an armadillo and shoulders of a guppy.

dafox99 · Dec 4, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

Hey JC. I was a mechanic at a marina for seven years ('75 - '82). I started with a very solid understanding of how engines worked as dad and I were always rebuilding something, but I was still very young and inexperienced when I started. As you may imagine, I was not the most efficient mechanic in the shop at first. The environment was great, however, in that our stalls were open, and the "old guys" were always willing to offer help and advise. I'm with Rodbolt in that the two most important elements in being a good, and efficient (different than fast) mechanic is truly understanding how something works (read the books and study the mechanisms/electronics/etc. when you pull them apart) and experience. I was lucky and learned more from the older, more experienced mechanics than I ever did from books, but you may not have that environment. Rodbolt brings up another good point. When I first started, I would just start on the tear-down or disassembly, going back and forth to my tool box, and putting the parts a bit randomly on my workbench. Over time, I found it more efficient to get the tools I knew I needed at the beginning, and have some system for where I put parts (especially if you have to order parts and wait a few days to re-start). Over time, and experience, everything from diagnosis to repair became easier and more efficient. Having said that, I still marvel at the career mechanics that will always diagnose and fix something much quicker than I .. they've learned a thousand tricks and shortcuts over time. Good luck .. in my book it's a wonderful and rewarding profession.

Silvertip · Dec 5, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

Efficiency comes with knowledge and experience, but in the end, two people with equal knowledge and experience may never operate at the same efficiency level. This is a simple fact of life. Both people may correctly diagnose a problem but one takes longer to accomplish the task. The same holds true for the actual repair. Some people have magical hands and organizational skills that seem to fly through procedures. Speed does not have to mean inaccuracy. Its a measure of one persons ability against another. Again, both can do the job correctly. You should not feel lacking if it takes you longer to do a job than your co-workers. You increase your abilities by practice, study and persistance. Stop attempting to learn and you will be left in the dust. Get the upper hand by researching new technology and staying on top of changes in your industry.

WillyBWright · Dec 5, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

You can only have ONE of the following: We can do it Fast. We can do it Cheap. We can do it Right. Tell your employer ... Quality can't be Rushed and Rushed can't be Quality. Your choice. If you want me to work fast, expect lower quality.

James Clarke · Dec 5, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

Hey all, thank's for all of the advice. Knowledge and experience play a big part together, and when you are badly rushed to get thing's out faster, (especiallly on a long weekend on a friday at 5:00pm,) problably will come back. But yeah I'm the kind that like's to do it right first time. If there is a second time you learn from it. I think we've all been there. It really eat's me to know If I missed something, or whatever the case. I alway's ask my employer "how'd did it run, or if he herd anything wrong" about a few day's later, if I remember. I will alway's remember this one time we were working late in the shop. It was about 9:00 at night on a friday and this elderly guy come's up to me and ask's "Is my boat fixed yet" Had no clue who he was.lol

Perfidiajoe · Dec 5, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

Hey Kid, don't get discouraged, I've been swinging wrenches since I'm 9, that's about 45 years for me. I still learn new things all the time, & so will you, in this trade you have too just to stay in the game. But in life it's always the same, first you have to master the basics, before you can learn the tricks, & the tricks will come. As stated before, you should work in a systematic way, no matter if it's diagnosing, disassembly, or reassembly. Work in a clean open well lit spot, with access to all you need, take a moment to look things over, look for anything out of place, listen for noises that don't belong. You'll find that working the smart way will eliminate wasted time, without you really working faster. Remember "If you don't have the time to do it right the first time, where will you find the time to do it over". If you like the trade, & have the head for it stick with it you can be good, if you love the trade & have the heart for it you can be one of the best. Good Luck, Joe

orca · Dec 5, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

JC The guys above have all given you sound advice, the Marine game can be brutal, however I would'nt do anything else, I love boats and motors. You are always learning and sometimes it can take time. Recently I had a 2 Cyl 50HP Evinrude in that was lacking power, it took hours to diagnois, everything appeared to be fine. Turned out that the trigger magnets in the flywheel had come loose causing the timing to fluctuate. Needless to say when another one came in about a month later we had the problem sorted in no time. Dont let the job get you down, I had many a sleepless night years ago worrying if I had done the job right. most times there was nothing to worry about.

andy6374 · Dec 12, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

Great Topic

steam_mill · Dec 12, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

JC: Please don't get frustrated! There are those of us who truly appreciate good wrenches. Sorry to say I'm not in Muskoka but in the Kawarthas or I'd bring you my boats because you have a great attitude! Although I am lucky to have a decent marina that I take my boats to (Upper Canada), I do get frustrated by the lack of wrenches out there that truly care about their work. I refer to not boating by 'recreational' cars. There are those of us who would like to be good at fixing boats and cars but just don't have the time or place to do it. Quick story: Been looking for german eighties sports car. My dream car. First off, hard to find. Second, even harder to find a committed repair location. Guess what, I'm no longer buying my dream car. Going for a domestic instead. I'm glad that the gents at the marina I frequent are attentive, have lots of parts for what I can do on my own and are great at repairs and reasonable too! Keep at it. With your attitude you'll have your own place soon enough. Joe

seahorse5 · Dec 13, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

Originally posted by WillyBWright: We can do it Fast. We can do it Cheap. We can do it Right.

Years back I saw a sign in a shop that said that, and below it said, "YOU CAN CHOOSE ANY TWO OF THE THREE"

seahorse5 · Dec 13, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

Originally posted by rodbolt: get yourself a copy of: Motor Auto Engines and electrical Syatems. read it,study it. but do look at amazon and see if that book is still about.

There are several used copies on Amazon.com and also on Ebay.com today. Just be sure you spell SYSTEMS correctly when you search for it.

James Clarke · Dec 14, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

Hey all or should say y'all! I like boat's. I'm not gonna give it up. I've read alot of book's in the my mid teen's on outboard's and basic ignition and electrical. Still am reading. Forgot to mention I did get my license. My employer doe's not want to lose me. Learning Evinrude e-tec stuff now. It's quite the power plant. They use pulse width modulation to control the fuel pump voltage at a fixed frequency.There is so much to learn. Seem's like other manufacture's now have differnt way's of fuel injection. Like those optimax's. I Never had anything to do with them but that's an example. But at the end they all go "bang" in the combustion chamber.

Jan Z · Dec 25, 2005

Re: Working on boats for a living

There are three things that are required in a business and a three legged stool to make them work well. Quality, Productivity and Safety. If one is emphasized more than the other there will be problems in the business just as all three legs of the stool need to be of equal length quality, productivity and safety need to be equaly as important

Working on boats for a living

Cadet

Recruit

Supreme Mariner

Cadet

Supreme Mariner

Banned

Petty Officer 1st Class

Supreme Mariner

Fleet Admiral

Cadet

Petty Officer 1st Class

Chief Petty Officer

Lieutenant Commander

Chief Petty Officer

Rear Admiral

Rear Admiral

Cadet

Seaman Apprentice