Working on fuel tank project

[Mark42]

So far I have a Moeller 14 gallon plastic tank, fill, vent and fuel lines, stainless hose clamps, primer bulb (w/double ball valves for 5/16" fuel line) and Johnson/Evinrude fuel connector. <br /><br />What I am missing is the fill and vent, a 3 way valve, matching fuel guage, a few barbs and tie down straps.<br /><br />The plan is to mount the tank under the deck, primer bulb in reach of the Skipper from behind the wheel, then run the 5/16" hose (I went with hose, not copper) to the aft and connect to a 3 way valve near the splashwell. The valve will have a 5/16" barb on first inlet port, a Johnson brass male fuel connector on the second inlet port and a 5/16" barb on the outlet port with hose running to the motor terminating with the J/E female fuel connector. The 3 way allows me to run from the fuel tank or switch to an optional portable tank (under splashwell) that connects to the J/E male fitting. I'll have enough fuel to make it to the Bahamas on a nice day. <br /><br />The thing that is holding me up from ordering the last of the parts is the darn fuel fill. From other posts, I said the white Perko fill/vent combo is what I wanted because of asthetics, but you folks have me thinking that water is going to get in. The other option is the stainless fuel fill (can't use that chome plated zinc stuff in salt). <br /><br />Guess I'll go with the stainless fill and vent and be done with it.

 

[SuzukiChopper]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

I wonder if there is maybe a way to seal up the filler cap you want to get. Depending on the pressure the cap pushes down with you might be able to use an o-ring or something? I would agree the white one would look the best, your boat is REALLY easy to look at and I think the stainless one would detract from it. Where were you going to mount it?<br /><br /><br />edit: just for comparison sake, for the bike I built, I made the gas tank/filler cap, it isn't sealed, sits outside ALL the time (including rain) and I have yet to have a problem with water in the gas. Lucky? yeah maybe, but, something to think about

 

[Mark42]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

SuzukiChopper,<br /><br />The Moeller tank is basically a tall rectangle with the fill center mounted at one end. Basically I am limited to mounting the fill directly over the tank inlet neck. That means I have the option of mounting the fill in the center line of the boat either in front of the Mooring Bit (white T shapped thing in center of deck) or between it and the windshield. <br /><br />I have just ordered the balance of stuff I need (from iboats.com - what a suck up I am). This is the fill and vent I ended up with. I figure if I don't like the stainless steel, I can paint it. <br /> <br />

<br /><br />

 

[fishingdan]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

<br />The plan is to mount the tank under the deck, primer bulb in reach of the Skipper from behind the wheel, then run the 5/16" hose (I went with hose, not copper) to the aft and connect to a 3 way valve near the splashwell.[/QB]

I had the bulb in a similar location at first, I then moved it to the back near the outboard. The issue was that the bulb was pointing the wrong way and not holding a prime. The direction arrow was oriented correctly (to allow fuel from tank to engine), but I wasn't aware that the arrow must physically point up to hold a prime. The outlet of my tank was about 15" above the floor. I originally had the fuel line with bulb running straight from the tank outlet to the top of the chase tube under my console. This spring, I pulled a new fuel line and move the bulb closer to the engine between the exit point of the chase tube and the engine. Now the arrow points to the engine for flow and the arrow points up to hold the prime. <br /><br />FWIW, I like the Attwood "P-trap" vent. It has a built in valve to prevent water from getting to the tank. I also like the Attwood device that prevents fuel from surging up the vent line.

 

[Mark42]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

Fishingdan,<br /><br />I have the same situation with the primer bulb on the portable tanks, it has to be vertical to pump. This latest primer has double check valves that are spring loaded, so I'm hoping it will work even if not vertical. It would be great to view the fuel level, pump the primer, set high idle and choke, and turn the ignition all from one location.<br /><br />I have enough vent line to make a loop or high point to prevent water from entering the tank. In reality, I doubt if I will ever be in a situation where any great amount of water comes over the bow.<br /><br />What do you think of those 'sediment bowls' that are glass so you can see if water is being pulled from the tank? I'm thinking of adding one directly to the tank fitting, then run the hose from there. <br /><br />

 

[Richard Petersen]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

All my rubber bulbs pump in any position and some are old.---------------Make a valley in the lines to the bulb. That will keep the bulb full of fuel

 

[fishingdan]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

Maybe there are different bulbs that behave differently. I used 2 Tempo bulbs and had the same problem with both.<br /><br />Mark42, I agree that it would be great to do it all from the same position. I haven't seen or used one of those, but I am in favor of any device that provides more information to the operator. Love the work you have done on the boat. I restored an old Sears 15' runabout that had lines similar to your boat. That boat served us well for years. <br /><br />Good luck,<br />Dan

 

[tengals123]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

Mark, That filler and vent is exactly the two I have purchased for my boat. They look fantastic. The finish on them is brilliant.<br /><br />cheers

 

[AMD Rules]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

I thought the issue with the original white fill/vent combo was that it could possibly gulb water if mounted on a horizintal plane. The stainless vent you show has large holes that would seem even more susceptible to gulping water. What makes the separate stainles vent less susceptible to water ingestion? Curious.

 

[Mark42]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

AMD,<br /><br />The difference is that the combo unit has the vent connected to the fill pipe. So the fill itself is not sealed. I don't think it is that big a problem because the whole unit has to be seriously submerged to leak. With the separate fill and vent the fill is 100% sealed. The vent can be place in a more out-of-waters way, and I would then have the space to put a loop in the vent line to prevent any water that came in from getting to the tank.<br /><br />One thing that did bother me about the location I'm rather stuck with is that the anchor line runs from the Mooring Bit over the location for the fuel fill and through the front chock. The Perko fill will stick up a little and the rope will rub on it. The stainless fill is more flush and not an issue with the rope.<br /><br />I'll decide after I get the parts which/what to use.<br /><br />Besides, if Tengals says it looks good, who am I to argue? LOL!

 

[Realgun]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

Mark you made me do all that measusing for nothing? I protest and want a picture when your done.

 

[AMD Rules]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

My old Munro with a similar hull profile to yours had taken partial waves over the bow a few times....running back and around the windshield.(gulp....gulp). I'll be interested to see where you mount the vent. Perhaps at the top of a 6ft pole? lol.... just kidding, your choice looks fantastic. Thanks for the tips.

 

[tengals123]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

That is correct. The holes on the ss filler are for mounting only. <br />cheers

 

[tengals123]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

BTW Mark im interested in your vent location too. I need to find a spot for mine. Any idea's??

 

[Mark42]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

I'm thinking far left or right about 3 inches in front of the windshield with the vent holes facing aft. The vent threaded shank allows it to be mounted raised a half or 3/4 inch. Might help with keeping water run-off out of the vent from washing. <br /><br />I had another idea to keep water out of the tank; putting a T fitting in the vent line then connect a small gas safe container to the bottom of the T to trap any water coming down the vent hose. Could use a gas tank from a weed wacker or some other gas safe bottle/can that can be easily dumped or viewed for contents.<br /><br /> Ya know, you guys have got me way too paranoid about this water in gas situation!!!! That Perko fill is probably just fine. Ask Realgun. But its too late for me, the damage is done, maybe my wretched experiences on this forum will serve as a lesson to others who follow... <br /><br />I am going to stop at the local tractor shop and see if they have any second hand sediment bowls I can adapt. Seems that a lot of the old farm beasts used them. Its a nice piece of hardware because they also integrate a fuel shutoff valve. <br /><br />I was looking inside the gas tank and the pickup tube goes right to the bottom with what looks like a screen filter on it. So this tank is set up to suck almost every drop out of the tank. And any water that may get in there too. Thats why I like the sediment bowl rather than a water absorbing filter, you can see what is in the fuel.

 

[fishingdan]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

Have you thought (I am sure that you have given your thoroughness) about running the vent hose under the gunwales and putting the vent near the transom?

 

[tengals123]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

I want mine as rear as possible and preferebly out of sight. The problem with mounting it at the rear and maybe under the gunwales is the risk of fumes and I have mu battery in that location.<br /><br />cheers

 

[Mark42]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

I thought of it, and it would be a good location, especially from a 'vent tube draining water' point of view and gasoline odors. <br />Another 12 or 14 ft of vent hose would get it back to the rear of the gunnel. It's a bit more work. Might be the best design overall if it pokes out the very rear of the gunnel over the transom. <br /><br />BTW I found that the yellow nylon plumbers pipe hangers (circular with two feet) work great for hanging hose and cables in the boat. I did the steering cable using them by epoxying blocks of p/t wood (1.5"x2") to the underside of the gunnel every 18" then the 1/2" nylon pipe hanger goes around the cable and can be screwed to the wood blocks. Holds everything very secure, won't rust.<br /><br />Tengals, the regs say the vent has to be mounted so that fuel will run off the boat without leaking into the boat. So they basically have to poke through the hull to the outside somewhere. Then fumes aren't a problem.

 

[Mark42]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

Got some parts UPS today. One item is the stainless fill plate. I am surprised at the size! I expected something much larger than the 3 inch diameter it has. It will hardly be noticable. Another thing, the description does not mention that it comes with a deck key. If it had, I would not have ordered another. The fault is not with iboats.com, because they print the description provided by Seachoice. Seachoice chose not to even mention the deck key on the package. But it is a nice piece of stainless steel, well machined and polished. Well worth the price, if anyone is interested.<br /><br />Regarding the vent issue, I have been told by another boater that as the fuel is used, the vent draws air in, and not out, so smelling fumes is not really a problem after starting the motor. Makes sense to me, but I wonder how much draw a 2 cylinder motor makes? Actually, all the sloshing around of the gas probably causes it to vaporize and emit vapors at a much greater rate than the motor is using it up.

 

[tengals123]

Re: Working on fuel tank project

good info there mark. I had to laugh. I did the same thing with the filler vent. Now I too have a spare filler 'key'. Just think of it as a spare. The description over here stated 'key not included' so I bought a key too. When I got home I noticed a key packed in the pipe already. It's always good to have a spare anyway. <br />Vent issue- good info there. Im going to mount mine ontop of the gunnel at the rear. I have a channel that runs both sides ontop of the gunnels so it wouldn't run into the boat.<br /><br />I told you those fillers were nice. Real smart finish.<br /><br /><br />cheers