Democrates in violation of Logan Act

[Plainsman]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

to uphold the laws and the constitution of the United States of America. If these citizens have committed treason then does the president not have a duty to see them brought to justice?

That's not The Presidents job, it's The FBI's, or The Attorney General.

and the FBI reports to whom?

Homeland Security

 

[jtexas]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

How would I know?... probably someone in the Judiciary Branch. What's your point?

nope, FBI reports to the Director of National Intelligence who reports to the president of the United States. It's a bit naive to think that if the president wanted the FBI to take action they would fail to act.

In fact, its incredibly naive to think that a member of congress would meet with the president of Syria without full knowlege of all the legal ramifications, and without notifying the White House in advance, and that the White House would fail to inform them that such a visit would be viewed as treason.

My point is that the Logan Act was not violated by the actions you cited. But if it was, then the White House is negligent in failing to take action.

 

[crunch]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

Updated: 1:11 p.m. PT Dec 14, 2006
WASHINGTON - The White House said Thursday that Democratic Sen. Bill Nelson's trip to Syria was not only inappropriate, but that it gave undue legitimacy to a government that is thwarting democratic reform in the Middle East.

Doesn't sound like they had the White Houses backing to me.... and we may not have heard the Fat Lady sing on this yet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16208612/

 

[crunch]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

Haven’t paid much attention lately, I have him on my ignore list, the only time that I can see any of his post is when I get on dock side with out logging on .any other time he comes up as an ignored user.

What a concept!!!! If someone disagrees with your point of view, just ignore them. Why, you can go through life thinking you are always right and everyone agrees with you..... must give a person a real warm fuzzy.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

to uphold the laws and the constitution of the United States of America. If these citizens have committed treason then does the president not have a duty to see them brought to justice?

That's not The Presidents job, it's The FBI's, or The Attorney General.

and the FBI reports to whom?

Homeland Security

and Homeland Security reports to whom?

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

I wonder how this would have gone if Kerry had tried to open a dialogue with the President. Just not enough dialogue going on here. :}

 

[jtexas]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

quoted here to give a voice to the ignored...

Haven’t paid much attention lately, I have him on my ignore list, the only time that I can see any of his post is when I get on dock side with out logging on .any other time he comes up as an ignored user.

What a concept!!!! If someone disagrees with your point of view, just ignore them. Why, you can go through life thinking you are always right and everyone agrees with you..... must give a person a real warm fuzzy.

 

[crunch]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

edit

 

[rottenray6402]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

Treedancer, we finally agree on something, our rights are being erroded away at a rapid pace. I think if you look back over the past 50 years there are a lot more infringements by libs than consevatives.
I am very afraid that libs really believe we can have dialoge and negotiate with these terrorists. You can only negotiate when both sides have something to gain and something to lose. These morons want us to kill them so they can get their 72 virgins. They are anxious to die and take as many of us as they can with them.

 

[treedancer]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

<<<HABEAS CORPUS=
[Latin, You have the body.] A writ (court order) that commands an individual or a government official who has restrained another to produce the prisoner at a designated time and place so that the court can determine the legality of custody and decide whether to order the prisoner's release.>>>


I’m assuming (below) is the lame excuse that the Bush administration is using to subvert the writ. Which was accomplished by means of a last minute amendment to the Military Authorization Bill, brought up on the floor of the Senate without committee deliberations and virtually no advance warning to the American people that it was happening.

<<,, As a result, the Constitution of the United States provides that “The Privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it” (Article 1, Section 9).>>>

By no means am I soft on terrorism, but with these rights stripped away we will have a problem getting the Genie back into the bottle at a later date.

Ever so slowly are our rights being stripped away, not even a blip on the national radar, that seems to be preoccupied by reporting on Donald Trumps feud with Rosie. Don’t know about the last fifty years but I’ve noticed it the last six, maybe Im just getting more paranoid.:%

 

[Plainsman]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

<<<HABEAS CORPUS=
[Latin, You have the body.] A writ (court order) that commands an individual or a government official who has restrained another to produce the prisoner at a designated time and place so that the court can determine the legality of custody and decide whether to order the prisoner's release.>>>


I’m assuming (below) is the lame excuse that the Bush administration is using to subvert the writ. Which was accomplished by means of a last minute amendment to the Military Authorization Bill, brought up on the floor of the Senate without committee deliberations and virtually no advance warning to the American people that it was happening.

<<,, As a result, the Constitution of the United States provides that “The Privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it” (Article 1, Section 9).>>>

By no means am I soft on terrorism, but with these rights stripped away we will have a problem getting the Genie back into the bottle at a later date.

Ever so slowly are our rights being stripped away, not even a blip on the national radar, that seems to be preoccupied by reporting on Donald Trumps feud with Rosie. Don’t know about the last fifty years but I’ve noticed it the last six, maybe Im just getting more paranoid.:%

So what American citizen has been affected by this? What American citizan does this apply to:

" [Latin, You have the body.] A writ (court order) that commands an individual or a government official who has restrained another to produce the prisoner at a designated time and place so that the court can determine the legality of custody and decide whether to order the prisoner's release.>>>"


I am sure if there has been any one the NY Times and katie would have been all over it just to bash the Administration.

 

[crunch]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

It's the "HABEAS CORPUS" of the terrorists.... uhhh, freedom fighters he's worried about.

 

[treedancer]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

Quote Plainsman
So what American citizen has been affected by this? What American citizan does this apply to:

Eric reread this part of my post especially the part about putting the Genie back in the bottle. Envision putting smoke back in a bottle that would be about as easy as getting our rights back at a future date.

<<By no means am I soft on terrorism, but with these rights stripped away we will have a problem getting the[ Genie back into the bottle at a later date.]>>

 

[Plainsman]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

Quote Plainsman
So what American citizen has been affected by this? What American citizan does this apply to:

Eric reread this part of my post especially the part about putting the Genie back in the bottle. Envision putting smoke back in a bottle that would be about as easy as getting our rights back at a future date.

<<By no means am I soft on terrorism, but with these rights stripped away we will have a problem getting the[ Genie back into the bottle at a later date.]>>

So your saying that you are worried about the future of something that may happen?

 

[treedancer]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

Quote plainsman

So your saying that you are worried about the future of something that may happen?

Thats right, looks like I’m keeping pretty good company doesn’t it?

<<"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." ...Ben Franklin>>

<<"There never was a good war, or a bad peace."... Franklin letter to Josiah Quincy 1773>>

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

Habeas Corpus has been suspended on several occasions (usually during war, you know like what we are currently involved in), and this time, after five years, you still can't point to any American who is being adversely affected you might want to rethink your position. In this case, with TERRORISTS, many scholars agree that this does not apply. But if you take your worst case scenario put together with wacko left wing lunatics warped view of rights, you might have something to lose sleep over. But nobody would do that. Come on man, this was before the supreme court and they provided guidance on how to make this legal. It is legal, until someone changes the law. Genie in the bottle? Piece of cake, change the law. BTW, This was done in front of the MSM and all over the TV. Snuck in? Who didn't know this was going on, finalists on survivor? Come on TD, you are a smart guy, don't get hooked into todays flavor of the day conspiracy theory.

But again what does this have to do with Kerry and friends violating at least the spirit if not the rule of the Logan act? Where are the condemnations for damaging Foreign Policy?

 

[crunch]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

I notice things got turned away from the Democrat follies.... typical.

 

[treedancer]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

It’s never been enforced, seems like if anyone wanted to enforce a law that has been on the books for two hundred years they would put some teeth in it wouldn’t they?

A few snips.
<<<Congress established the Logan Act in 1799, less than one year after passage of the Alien and Sedition Acts, which authorized the arrest and deportation of aliens and prohibited written communication defamatory to the U.S. government.

<<The Logan Act has remained almost unchanged and unused since its passage.>>

<<The only Logan Act indictment occurred in 1803. It involved a Kentucky newspaper article that argued for the formation in the western United States of a separate nation allied to France. No prosecution followed. >>>

Plus a link.
http://www.answers.com/topic/logan-act

Here’s a quote that I run across that I thought was rather interesting; see what you make of it. Don’t know what he was referencing.

<<To those who scare peace-loving people with phantoms of lost liberty; my message is this: Your tactics only aid terrorists - for they erode our national unity and diminish our resolve. They give ammunition to America's enemies, and pause to America's friends. They encourage people of good will to remain silent in the face of evil.”>>

- Attorney General John Ashcroft, 12/6/2001, Senate Judiciary Committee.

Fear not John we won,t remain silent here on dockside .

 

[Plainsman]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

Your tactics only aid terrorists - for they erode our national unity and diminish our resolve. They give ammunition to America's enemies, and pause to America's friends. They encourage people of good will to remain silent in the face of evil

Is this directed to Bill Nelson and Kerry? If not, sure looks like the shoe fits.

 

[crunch]

Re: Democrates in violation of Logan Act

<<To those who scare peace-loving people with phantoms of lost liberty; my message is this: Your tactics only aid terrorists - for they erode our national unity and diminish our resolve. They give ammunition to America's enemies, and pause to America's friends. They encourage people of good will to remain silent in the face of evil.”>>

Wow, sounds like that is aimed right at those who bring up Habeas Corpus violations in relation to terrorists.... uhhhh, freedom fighters.