1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

Got the cradle finished before the rain came.. The boat does not move at all now. I also found some sticky levels normally used for leveling campers that I bought for something a while ago and never used, so I made sure the cradle was still level and stuck them on so I can tell if something is amiss and check each time before starting on the boat.

If the rain stops, I'm going to get the shop vac out and vac up the last of the debris, taking lots of measurements and then start removing the vinyl.

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

Also, what's the thoughts on this trailer? The trailing arm on the right side is bent a bit, and I'm sure that makes the trailer dog track over a bump. I noticed it a little bit in the 4 miles pulling it home but I thought the boat was just loose on the trailer ( Strapped in 100% but it did move around ).. The rear section is also tied up with only 1 of 2 bolts holding it on.. Every roller is bad, and I'm actually considering it may be cheaper or better to replace with a brand new trailer than rebuild the old thing. A New Tidewater Bunk trailer to fit is only about $800, $1,400 could get a really nice trailer

I was thinking of ratchet strapping a 2x4 to the bent trailing arm to see if it will straighten. The trailer frame itself is in good condition for it's age ( 1973 ) and I put new tires on it to bring it home, so it may be possible to have it rolling for a few hundred or so.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

Just like vintage glass hulls, you have to decide if the work & $ to rehab is worth the difference in price of a new trailer.

Vintage boats look great w/ vintage trailers & motors, but it is also a lot of work.

Have you priced decent rollers that would fit your brackets?

W/ a glass rehab, you certainly have the time to dismantle, repair/replace as necessary a little at a time. That'd be the only reason I'd rehab 1. If you can afford new, most think it worth it:

Paint prep materials & paint
Coupler, winch, winch post, trailer jack
Rollers (+ brackets & shafts)
Lights & wiring
Bearings
Lumber & carpet
Lots of misc hardware nuts & bolts

And then the time & effort.

It'd be nice to keep the boat on its trailer since they're both family. That may be the tipping factor.

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

Iboats have the keel and center rollers for between $4-10 each. The actual 'bunk' rollers I have not been able to find replacements for, but I think the 10" rollers with the narrow middle can fit... I'll probably rebuild the trailer if I can get that trailing arm straight or find a replacement if they still exist. The winch just needs new rope, and I have a coupler rebuild kit

With that, I just made a 4" hole in the hull. I knew it had to be pretty thin there so I was being very careful with the oscilating saw.. Evidently Custom Crafts are VERY different from regular boats, and some of the hull DOES NOT have plywood under all of the decking. The outsides are just the hull bottom.. Needless to say, this is going to make it a cheaper resto, but I have a 4" hole in the hull I'll have to fix tonight. I'm just going to use Bondo resin and CSM as the deck will get ground after while doing the flooring, so I don't have to get out the US Composits $$$ resin yet... I'm almost afraid to try to cut a hole in the center altho I'm nearly positive there is plywood under there..

The blue stuff is the protector fabric that I used on the bunk. Basically Tee shirt material but a little fuzzy

The cutout still fits tight, so repair is NBD. I know it needs outside and inside repair but for now, it has to go on inside

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

Well, 'glass is curing. I ground out everything until I was certian I had gone far enough.. Probably should have gone with some 1708 but 2 layers of 6oz CSM is what I used. Should be fine until more of the deck is out, then I will grind it out ( given it was waxed resin ), use 1708 and 635 resin to finish inside

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

6 oz CSM ??? Would like to see some of that!!! Never seen any before. 1.5 and 2.0 oz is all I've ever seen.

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

I'll take a pic what's on the roll tomorrow night.. US Composits sells it, and it's not much more expensive than the cheap stuff. I got the 6oz because it comes in a 60" width, the 4" comes in 50" wide but is only $1/ yd cheaper. It's probably overkill for it's uses but seeing how the boat was built, overkill might be good.

One mod I have been thinking of is sureply underlayment ( 1/4" ) over the entire deck, to cover up the 'raw' fiberglass deck. Is that a good idea? I would bond it with either thickened resin or PL-400, and tab it with 1708 and CSM just as a 'normal' glass boat would with a 1/2-5/8" deck.

Added pic: It's coming out ok.

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

Got a bit of time to dig some.. Really not sure what to think.. I've got a layer of factory 'glass. under that is a thin plywood, foam and then another layer of thin plywood. On both sides of the bilge, there is what appears to be old dimensioned 2x4 split into a 2x2. The cross peices are also rotted but they are 1 3/4"x3" so a common 2x4 made out of douglas fir ( hard to get but obtainable ) should work for everything

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

I'm sorry but USC does not sell 6 oz CSM. Your pic appears to be a pic of the 6 oz E glass from USC. It requires a layer of CSM to be installed before it is installed if it is to have a good bond. Without the CSM there's a good chance the cloth with delaminate.

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

Don't know what I was thinking. Yes it's 6oz E glass. Sorry about that. I'm not worried about delamination at this point because this was only to seal up the hole so that I did not loose the piece I cut out. I'm not going to put the boat back together less than 100% correct. It will be ground out and redone with the rest of the decking and also outside of course.. Is the 1708 a good idea for that repair? The boat hull in that area appears to be woven roving. The hull bottom below the plywood and foam appears to be at least topped with CSM.. I haven't a clue on Custom Craft's actual construction methods at this point.. I have even had the idea of prepping the hull to get splashed, splash it and build the boat with a brand new hull and the old cap and then structure it with stringers and 'traditional' building methods but it seems like a good and bad idea at the same time.

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

The 1708 would be a much better choice. It has CSM stitched to it and would adhere much better.

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

I've got more of the sides torn out. Still don't know 100% where the plywood ends but I found the hull sides under the fiberglass.. Foam is 100% water logged

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

The deck of the boat was built w/ a layer of glass, thin plywood, thin foam, thin plywood & then the bottom of the deck was also glassed?

Interesting, 1st Custom Craft I've seen taken apart, but that's a strange layup schedule. Interesting~strange....

Any idea what type of a foam? An open cell sheet foam like foundation plate insulation? Or more of a rigid sheet like the pink/blue sheets at HD/Lowes?

Lightweight and prefab so they could just drop it in & lay another single layer of glass, maybe?

To bad it's so trashed to not be able to get better info to replicate how it was built.

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

The foam looks to me like it was poured in and then the top layer of plywood was pressed into it, but it may have been a large block just dropped in and installed. Open cell for sure.
Once I get the back section demolished, I will then know where the plywood starts, so I should be able to cut it out and dissect it from there to see how it was put togther and where the 4 small stringers were/are

When I was first getting into it, I removed a small section of the top fib, fiberglass, found rotted plywood, drilled the plywood just to see and found foam, dug deeper and found more plywood and then the boat hull, so I do know the layup scheduled.. This boat is also a deck drain boat, the bilge is sealed and I think an old hit to the keel let some water in before my grandfather gave it a quick patch.

This is the layup schedual as best as I can figure. The plywood is single ply, probably of the Luan type or whatever was available back then.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

Any chance it's balsa? That's often a core material. But usually layed up in narrow strips or smallish squares.

Have you done much research into Custom Craft's or their construction. Your graphic looks like what I'd think of as pressed construction. Fabbed out of the boat, with high heat or high pressure (possibly both) trying to create a lightweight & structurally sound lamination.

Intriguing.

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

It might be balsa. It is coming in strips but it looked like one single piece laid down. Balsa was my first thought. I tried to get info on what to expect under the deck from the Nicklecityclassics (Custom Craft specific forum ) but never heard anything back. I revived my old thread and also posted again on Fiberglassics trying to get info. Custom Craft only built in the realm of 3,500 boats between 1958-1965 in total so there is not much info on them

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

Interesting what's out there:

That lead to:

US Rubber:

United States Rubber Company
Naugatuck, Connecticut

US Rubber was the source of resin for the early glass experiments of the Tomhawk Boat Co.

When Carter Craft ventured into fiberglass-hulls, U.S. Rubber supplied a special five-ply laminate material made of a "foam-plastic-rubber core", hard plastic-rubber outer layers, and a rubber skin. Termed "Royalite", this material provided built in flotation and insulation and was used by the Thompson, Custom Craft, and Connecticut brands (February 1961, Popular Science). Developed by William S. Ellis and Robert C. Kohrn of US Rubber, Wagemaker and Crestliner planned to use the material in their 1958 lineups (Jan. 26, 1958, New York Times). Custom Craft used this material for a 17' catamaran model to be shown at the 1961 New York Boat Show (November 6, 1960 New York Times).


According to the Feb 6, 1959, Chicago Tribune, Thompson Royal-Craft of Cortland, New York showed five boats made of this material at the 1959 Chicago Boat Show. The outer layer contained a color-impregnated skin, a color-impregnated rigid "stability" layer, and a center "buoyant" layer of expended cell, non-water absorbent material, then another stability layer and inner skin.
​

Apparently Royalite was used to make the HULL not decks, and unfortunately it tended to distort in the heat of the sun :facepalm:

But as a show of toughness in it's marketing campaign, it was shot (weapon/caliber unknown) and the bullet hole thru the hull was 'self-sealing'...

I wouldn't doubt that Custom Craft used something extremely similar to make your deck. But I didn't find anything that indicated Royalite~US Rubber made a specific deck or sole material.

When you cut that hole thru the hull, was it a solid fiberglass hull, no core?

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

No core material. Bout 1/8" thick. looked like 2 layers in the cross section+ gelcoat. When I ground it for re application, I had it pretty thin and looked like 'normal' fiberglass.. . The hull itself appears to be woven roving

I remember something about the Royalite but I don't recall if they actually used it. I know a lot of innovations they had planned never got off the ground and that lead to the end of Custom Craft. They still had some of the coolest boats of the early 60's

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

Yes they did use Royalite, FG's library also mentions records lost in a fire, if I remember right.

 

[matt167]

Re: 1961 Custom Craft Sea Ray Rebuild

I found the bit about Royalite. It was only used in 1961 on the Delta Ray which is the boat in the ad.. I'd agree the boats were probably similarly built.

Custom Craft Numbers - Nickle City Classics