2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

[arthurj12]

hello my dads friend just gave me a 2000 evinrude ficht 225 says RAM on the side. it has lost its spark and he just re powered says its gota a bad reputation i thought it was the 98-99 150 175 that were bad or all the early ficht bad ? im gona call evinrude and see if it has any recall work done anyone have any input on this would be help full , its in good shape and im sure cost a pretty penny at one time im just thinking is it worth my time and money it has 700 hours he said, one day it worked fine the next day no spark? thx

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

I would not sink much into that motor. probably could not sell it for much, except for parts to some poor sap who is trying to fix his.

 

[aerobat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

all fichts were in many items improved and called ficht "ram" and basicly run great. further the most problems like you said correctly were with the first 150-175 2.6L V6 fichts, not the big 3.3L V6 .

i would so respectfully disagree with sparkie since many many would like to have a direct injected V6 225hp on their transom which is known to be strong as hell , but are stucked to their carbed 2 stroke grandpas.

the downside on the fichts is that they are such complicated that without serious knowledge and diagnostic computer you cannot do much by yourself , further , at least in europe, parts are rare and very expensive .

when it runs you will be amazed about the hole shot and top end of this beast. good luck !

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

well I have seen plenty of them for sale...not many sold...sell it for parts or part it out. as aero correctly stated, they are difficult to work as most EFIs are and parts are pricey, you could easily sink 3K plus into that motor to get it running. I would be surprised if you could sell it for that much. you could probably get $1500 as a parts motor or even more if you sell the parts individually. there are a lot, and I mean a lot of broken fichts out there. just search the word ficht in this forum

 

[droach77]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

All outboards have there problems or else there would be no need for this forum. If you search any type of outboard or in fact any motor on this forum you will find problems with them....like i said thats what this forum is for.


dave

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

all I am saying is that it is a 12 year old motor, that has a lot of pricey parts, if you want to pay a qualified mechanic to check the motor out it may be worth the risk of a couple of hundred dollars, but I would not sink much money into the motor, it is worth about $1500 as is, more if you part it out. in good running condition it would only sell for $3000-3500 tops and you may not be able to sell it even then, I have found selling used motors/boats over the last few years has been real slow, I have some motors and boats that have been for sale for almost a year now, and for very reasonable prices, I have sold some stuff. but you could part it out and list it on ebay or craigslist and make yourself a few dollars. if you have a boat for the motor and you want to fix it for yourself you could, but for $3500 or less I could find you nice late 90s early 2000s motor already running that does not have the ficht stigma. I prefer carb motors because I can work on them myself and the parts are way cheaper. those old carb motors run out strong and if you maintain them they are very reliable.

 

[boobie]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

Part it out and get yourself a carbed mtr. 2000 was the yr that OMC went bellie up and just think what the quality control was.

 

[arthurj12]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

ok guys i was kinda expecting that pretty sure that's why he gave it to me....... its just so big and pretty hate to see it thrown out but i do understand that its the engine that they made when they belly flopped so that in its self ....right thanx for your input i have a boat with a 1991 90hp johnson and its a dream to work on so i think ill stick with it. looks like i got a good buoy anchor lol jk i guess ill part it out thx again :facepalm:

 

[aerobat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

hm... everyone should use what he prefers, and of course you can sink a lot of money into this engine when something serious is down.

you simply cannot compare a 225hp fuel injected engine , full of electronics, to a carbed one where you can start to search used parts and fix it easily by yourself when it comes down to repair costs.

but some statements here sound really strange. first ,you will find far more threads about simply tired low compression carbed 70-80-90,s 2 strokes than about fichts. then , but everybody should use what he prefers , it sounds funny to throw away this 225 ficht and buy something carbed.

not sure who of you has real experience with a V6 ficht ram, but i can tell you that the running characteristics are not even comparable to ANY 2stroke carbed engine. it starts turn key cold or hot absolutely smoke free where the carbed guy pumps some bulbs, tries the choke to finally get it fired up with a huge amount of blue smoke when its cold.

you can troll for hours and it will give you an immediate and massive throttle response where the carbed guy struggles with sooted plugs. its more fuel efficent , uses very little oil...

europe may be other than usa , but the resale value of a good running direct injected engine is FAR more than for any carbed 2 stroke


you really recommend to throw this away

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jffofy8GDaw

and get lets say that ??? :facepalm:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxJqCEESbLw

 

[aerobat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

hm... everyone should use what he prefers, and of course you can sink a lot of money into this engine when something serious is down.

you simply cannot compare a 225hp fuel injected engine , full of electronics, to a carbed one where you can start to search used parts and fix it easily by yourself when it comes down to repair costs.

but some statements here sound really strange. first ,you will find far more threads about simply tired low compression carbed 70-80-90,s 2 strokes than about fichts. then , but everybody should use what he prefers , it sounds funny to throw away this 225 ficht and buy something carbed.

not sure who of you has real experience with a V6 ficht ram, but i can tell you that the running characteristics are not even comparable to ANY 2stroke carbed engine. it starts turn key cold or hot absolutely smoke free where the carbed guy pumps some bulbs, tries the choke to finally get it fired up with a huge amount of blue smoke when its cold.

you can troll for hours and it will give you an immediate and massive throttle response where the carbed guy struggles with sooted plugs. its more fuel efficent , uses very little oil...

europe may be other than usa , but the resale value of a good running direct injected engine is FAR more than for any carbed 2 stroke


you really prefer to throw this away

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jffofy8GDaw

and get lets say that ??? :facepalm:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxJqCEESbLw

 

[Faztbullet]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

further the most problems like you said correctly were with the first 150-175 2.6L V6 fichts, not the big 3.3L V6 .

The 1999-2001 200/225hp was a 3.0l and had tons problems, the 3.3 did not come out till late 2001. These are ok motors if they have had all the factory updates and run pretty good. Most problems on these engines are EMM and injector issues all which are not DIY repairs unless unbolting and sending off for repair. The early models are known for hard starting when cold due to low starter rpm and throttle shaft problems. The best years are 2004-07 as they make the best hp as the newer engine are about 10-15hp weaker

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

resale here is not that much difference. used EFI motors or carbed are about the same, as a matter of fact there are a lot of people (including me) who just can not afford the maintenance cost of a EFI motor. EFI motors start really costing you after about 8-10 years, sometimes before that. I pay cash for my boats/motors/fishing, and I have a wife and 4 kids that come first, so my hobby gets whatever is left over. So with me it is just a matter of dollars and cents. most posters in here, are here because they cannot afford to just take their boat to a dealer for repairs/maintanince and are trying to save every dollar they can, so I give advice from that line of thought.

I never said to throw any motor away.

I may be wrong but I assumed the OP wanted to know if his free motor was worth fixing and then selling so he could make some money, the fact is he could most likely make the most profit by just selling it like it is. If the motor was on his personal boat, I would suggest a trip to a qualified outboard mechanic and get an estimate for repair. Every financial decision in my life has to revolve around resale value, if I cannot sell it and get my money back, I am paying too much and will look for a different approach/deal.

I would never even buy a ficht motor because of the stigma, some of them may have been the best motors ever, but when you are trying to sell a boat with a ficht on it and people say, my buddy said ficht is crap, you just go ahead and try to tell them different if you want, but you are trying to sell them a boat and they know that.

 

[aerobat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

and I have a wife and 4 kids that come first, so my hobby gets whatever is left over

4 kids? you seem to like THIS sports ! seriously- you are basicly right ! boating is not everything and in every family budget is somewhere limited and the kids come first !!!

a carbed 2 stroke will give you a far better chance for a cheap DIY repair than a higly comlicated fuel injected ficht .

OMC tried with the first fichts a revolution and , since this technology was not fully understood , gave many problems . then they put all afford they can to introduce the ficht "ram" which had massive improvents but was that costly that it result to bancrupcy. bombardier took it over and stabilized the situation, gave it basicly e new name - the etec.

yes, the ficht ram will cost you far more than a carbed engine , but yes, the ficht will blow away any carbed engine when it runs , and yes its all about your budget you want and can spent on your engine. thats the story of carbed vs direct fuel injected engines.

cheers !

 

[hidef]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

Although the Ficht was costly to OMC it didn't bankrupt them it was the manufacturing of boats that put them under. If OMC had stuck to outboards and stern drives they would hav been fine. BRP only took over the engine manufacturing for one reason it was profitable and the Ficht technology was the path to the future for two strokes.

 

[Faztbullet]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

Ficht and "Ram" ficht as exactly the same with just a few changes, they put the "Ram" name on there as the Ficht name had got a bad reputation and customers thought it was a new improvement. Early injectors were built to a strict tolerance specification and fuel map in the ECU/EMM. When BRP bought the technology for their skis and water craft they was going to let the outboard side die but saw there was tons of money on table to be got. The new injectors are built to less exacting spec's and that why you enter in the serial/cal number of injector and the EMM compensates for the tolerance of the injector. The high number of failures with the Fichts and Cobra drives along with declining sales of pre-rigged products is what rolled them belly up.

 

[aerobat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

Ficht and "Ram" ficht as exactly the same with just a few changes

no. e.g the most problematic 150/175 got with the "ram" completely redesigned heads ( pinned heads) which incorporated a deflector to keep the fuel spray away from the plugs, the ECU was replaced by a far more advanced water cooled EMM , further the mapping was changed , the rams switch from lean burn to homogenous burn at i think 1800rpm where the original ficht kept lean burn up to over 3000rpm ( and this caused burned pistons) . ficht and ficht ram is a deep redesign , not just a new name for minor changes !

with the "ram" all fichts were basicly a runner , but of course can give very costly problems. the other point is that the modified ficht "ram" is the strongest engine i ever saw. especially at the hole shot not even a 4 stroke EFI will take it up with this thing. ( at our marina we have a direct comparision with a same horsepower honda EFI and similar boat weights)

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

I recently sold a 1989 Johnson 200 HP motor that I would put up against your ficht any day, pushed my 20' well craft over 50 MPH and got there quickly. I also would compare fuel mileage at WOT and I bet your EFI would barely beat me. the motor idled great, the biggest benefit with EFI is trolling and idling a lot which I really do not do, if I did, I would get a kicker motor and still come out way cheaper.

I still have a 1988 Merc 150 XR2 that would probably almost keep up with your 200 ficht, for some reason these motors produce a lot more HP than advertised, they get great fuel economy also, many late 80s and early 90s 18-21' bass boats came with these motors and would run 65 MPH, many had 23-24 pitch props, some even 25, a real stroker engine.

If you can get your hands on one of these motors you should hold on to it, they are starting to get hard to find, the people who "know" are snatching them up. the late 80s and early 90s OMC motors are still plentiful though and really great motors, I just love them, wish they were still producing them new.

 

[Faztbullet]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

No...Ram is just a word like E-tec ,it stands for nothing. The "Ram" engines was just regular fichts with the listed updates. The pinned heads was a update to stop low end plug fouling from fuel and soot(the killer of these motors), the injector voltage and rectifier was changed from 26v to 40v, the ECU mapping was changed 26 times in 1999(I have access to all the maps and dealer/tech software) and a second fuel pump was added. In late 1999 and early 2000 is when motors went to injector compensation from ECU/EMM, the early non compensation injectors (screw in and some flange mount) was a bolt on and go as they were the precision spec ones, the later 1999 and up (flange mount)are the compensation style and need numbers off injector to bring Emm/injector to specs. Then they added a exhaust sensor so EMM could see engine load and compensate for that.

 

[aerobat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

hey ! of course the word "ram" by itself stands for nothing- but when the improvement incorparated new powerheads with fuel spray deflectors, new injectors, new EMM with watercooling, several new sensors ( e.g the exhaust sensor) , new injector system voltage, new engine mappings , new fuel supply design and some other things more you cannot call it a "minor" change with just a new name i think.

i think ficht and ficht ram are not minor changes but a very deep redisign, OMC put all resources they had to do that , and brp took the advances of it- renaming it again.

look at the shop for a 1999 ficht and a 2000 or newer ficht ram and you will see the tons of different parts and part numbers.

@sparkie... well- i do not have exact numbers but i think its not a discussion when you try to compare ANY carbed 2stroke again a ficht ram or maybe even more an etec. the overall fuel milage, the oil consumption are a different league. the running characteristics from a cold immediate start over trolling to the hole shot also. and when it comes to power the ficht rams were legendary- one of the strongest arguments for keeping on the 2stroke design with high pressure direct fuel injection with such a massive efford .

cheers !

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: 2000 Envinrude Ficht 225 one of the bad ones?

they definatly use less oil for sure, mine would use less oil if I used the VRO, but I bypass them and premix, so yes lots of oil and some smoke, which can cause some fouling with extended idle/trolling, but fuel consumption is not in a different league if you run mostly at 3/4 throttle or above, EFI motors (including 4 strokes) only slightly beat an old 2 stroke carb motor, they begin to pull away at idle and trolling speeds a good bit. I was surprised to see how many hours are spend at idle when I did a check on a 2003 F115 I use to have, so even I would see some fuel savings with EFI, but you just have to balance out the cost, with me it is all about the dollars and cents. these old carb motors run great if you have a good one, they are cheap to maintain and easy to work on. for me EFI motors just do not hold a candle to the cheaper/simpler carb design.

I use to drive when cars had carbs also, the cars/trucks I drive today have smoother running engines but I am not seeing any big savings in fuel. I wish they could go back to carbs, would slash the price of a new car by thousands of $$$.