35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

[pabloescobedo96]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

Well it can mean 2 things, I'm thinking being rude and no I don't know everything. The reason I asked if they were new is some on here find it more cash friendly to buy a used forward gear and clutch dog than new. Putting in used parts can lead to the same symptoms. I wouldn't have replaced the parts, like you said in your first post, you replaced the impeller and now it's doing it. Why would the motor start popping out of gear after an impeller replacement, you don't touch the gears when replacing an impeller, the only thing you touch is the shift rod. If the shift rod isn't lined up properly when it's reassebled and the lengths are not right you will start popping out of gear. Now the question and answer as you so love my methods, was the clutch dog and gear shot or were they perfectly fine?

The gears and clutch dog were worn fairly bad. The symtoms of that were popping out and then back in gear. Now it pops out stays out and shift lever moves into nuetral.

I too think it may be the shift rod issues but I would like to know what tests can be done to find out.

Like I stated in my latest post I think I may have found the problem. with the shift lever assembly at the motor and inside the center section. did you read it? and do you think that could be the issue?

 

[pabloescobedo96]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

maybe this picture will make it easier to understand what I think may be going on.

red circles areas of interest.
Blue circles possible problem areas.
Green arrow indicates wear I found 1 inch of play.
yellow arrow indicates were I found a half inch of play.

Could the pivot be wearing out or is it typical to have this sloppiness?
all bolts are tight

 

[pabloescobedo96]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

Hmmm... I dont know either.
Maybe something is messeing up in the lower unit then.
Different symptoms but who knows

 

[pabloescobedo96]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

I really dont know what it is at this point

 

[pabloescobedo96]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

If I did bend the linkage I think it is most likely the upper linkage and I dont know how hard it is to get to. I really dont want to seperate the center section as I have never done this and dont know what all is involved. I guess I'll just not go full throttle and I'll be fine. Sorry just talkin to myself now.

 

[CharlieB]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

Think of the 'eye' at the top of the shift shaft when in Neutral as stationed at the Nine-o'clock position when connected to the pin/clevis of the shift crank/linkage. The shift crank rotates only + and - about an 'hour' when raising/lowering the shift shaft.

Clearly shift shaft length/position makes a great difference if NOT correct, as well as the shift crank/cable adjustment.

 

[pabloescobedo96]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

Think of the 'eye' at the top of the shift shaft when in Neutral as stationed at the Nine-o'clock position when connected to the pin/clevis of the shift crank/linkage. The shift crank rotates only + and - about an 'hour' when raising/lowering the shift shaft.

Clearly shift shaft length/position makes a great difference if NOT correct, as well as the shift crank/cable adjustment.

Cool. is there a way to tell if this is the problem without major disasembly

 

[R.Johnson]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

Hook a known, good batter direct to the starter. In your service manual, they tell you what the starter should run under no load which yours is doing when it don't engage the flywheel. I don't have the manual in front on me, but as I recall it should be about 18,000 RPM, or about like a wood router. Is your's running that fast? If you are testing the battery with a volt meter, that is a very poor test. Keep in mind a battery that read's 12.8, or 12.9 is full charge. 12.5 mean's it's dowm fifty percent. Have uou tried hooking a volt meter across the battery while cranking? If so, what was the voltage?

 

[CharlieB]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

It is awkward to look at it, because of its location but it is possible to pull the pin and look at the alignment of the holes. some models it may be necessary to remove either the starter or carb to gain enough clearance to easily see the connection.

Two things you said make me think that the shift shaft length is not set correctly.

The difficulty in removing and replacing the pin, if the length is correct they should line up easily.

And that the shaft was threaded all the way down into the lower unit, THAT thread is the method of adjusting the shaft length.

Of course if all else fails, you could find and purchase the factory service manual, look up the spec, drop the lower, measure and adjust the shaft length.

 

[oldrudedude]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

I think I found the problem though. I got to looking and the linkage piece that bolts to the motor and the cable hooks to it. Well this piece has a lot of play both in and out about a half inch, and front to back about an inch.

If the "play" is from wear, I think you have to repair this "play" as best you can before anything else. Then compensate for any "play" that is remaining by adjusting other points on the linkage. My 2 cents.

 

[pabloescobedo96]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

It is awkward to look at it, because of its location but it is possible to pull the pin and look at the alignment of the holes. some models it may be necessary to remove either the starter or carb to gain enough clearance to easily see the connection.

Two things you said make me think that the shift shaft length is not set correctly.

The difficulty in removing and replacing the pin, if the length is correct they should line up easily.

And that the shaft was threaded all the way down into the lower unit, THAT thread is the method of adjusting the shaft length.

Of course if all else fails, you could find and purchase the factory service manual, look up the spec, drop the lower, measure and adjust the shaft length.

Im not real great with boat terms so could we refer to the numbers in the diagram. As far as removing pin to look in, are you refering to #39 as the pin?
And I'm not seeing exactly were removing the starter or carb will help but I dont know much.

The pinch bolt that slides in the notch lines up perfect. the brass connector thing was just a little corroded some wd-40 and pushing and holding the shaft with needlenose helped that. So there is a spec on the shaft length. I was under the impression it varied for each individual motor as far as adjustment? Yes the shaft was turned all the way in. How do I adjust it correctly?

So lets think of a test I can do here guys to find the problem.
Can I disconnect the linkage and shift manually to verify shift linkage issue.

Im not 100% sure it isnt just a coincidence it happened after water pump replacement. So I want to verify it is not the lower unit.

How can I make sure it is not the lower unit???

 

[jbjennings]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

You can't verify it's not the lower unit without taking the lower unit apart and inspecting the dog and gear mating surfaces. I would suspect that since your motor has jumped out of gear at full throttle several times already, even if the parts of the lower unit were at relatively new, they're definitely not now, and your gear ears or clutch dog probably have some tiny chunks out of the mating surfaces. I would follow the advice above and make all your adjustments you possibly can toward the forward side. If that doesn't solve the problem, then it's time to break apart the lower unit and be prepared to replace the dog and probably the forward gear as well. That 35 powerhead is on the same lower unit as the 25hp, so I'd think that a full power jump out of gear would be particularly fatal to a clutch dog. I also doubt that your shift rod is bent, because those shift rods are really strong from what I've seen.
Most likely, something was out of adjustment after the impeller change causing it to jump out of gear, and your later adjustment put it back where it would work were it not for the damage done from the previous "jump-outs".
JMO,
JBJ

 

[pabloescobedo96]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

You can't verify it's not the lower unit without taking the lower unit apart and inspecting the dog and gear mating surfaces. I would suspect that since your motor has jumped out of gear at full throttle several times already, even if the parts of the lower unit were at relatively new, they're definitely not now, and your gear ears or clutch dog probably have some tiny chunks out of the mating surfaces. I would follow the advice above and make all your adjustments you possibly can toward the forward side. If that doesn't solve the problem, then it's time to break apart the lower unit and be prepared to replace the dog and probably the forward gear as well. That 35 powerhead is on the same lower unit as the 25hp, so I'd think that a full power jump out of gear would be particularly fatal to a clutch dog. I also doubt that your shift rod is bent, because those shift rods are really strong from what I've seen.
Most likely, something was out of adjustment after the impeller change causing it to jump out of gear, and your later adjustment put it back where it would work were it not for the damage done from the previous "jump-outs".
JMO,
JBJ

Kinda what I was thinking. I just dont want to believe it.

 

[jeesybubba1]

Re: 35 johnson pops out of gear after water pump replacement

I would disconnect the shifter cable from the motor, put the lever in forward manually, the throttle will still work, if this stops the issue than the problem is in the shifter cable or cable linkage, if the problem does not stop then the issue is in the lower unit or you did bend the shifter rod. at least this narrows it down