3year old gas

[bluecollerboater]

Re: 3year old gas

I am the O.P. Looks like I sure stirred up a debate. The engine I have is a 1988 mercruiser 260 h.p. I bought the boat from a friend and saw it run the day before it was winterized, he also gave me the boat for a song. That is the only reason I bought the boat. I guess I should be getting a sample and checking it out. Thanks for all the responses.

 

[jimbo_jwc]

Re: 3year old gas

Best way I found to remove suspect gas from Boat or any large tank at home has been with aftermarket electric fuel pump on 12vdc .
It will pulse /open antisiphon valve ,easily hose bib , hose over steel fuel line and be fast enough to give me time to look for another container . I keep 15 gal plastic ones for mixing later with oil .Pump suction and pressure hose long enough to be far enough from fumes .

 

[MH Hawker]

Re: 3year old gas

No you didnt stair it, This is the yearly old gas debate it happens at least once ever year and as you will see it is just one of several running debaits not to be confused with the dino vs synthetics oil or tires or battery's and the ever famous to stablize or not on fuels. how ever as each runs you will read a good bit and get some really good information and while I am at it I will kick the old E 85 argument right in the knee cap just cause.

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: 3year old gas

So question for all you guys that think 3 year old gas is fine to use...do you guys use a fuel stabilizer? If so, why if fuel isn't degrading?

stabilizer only works for a period of time, not forever. three months, certainly; three years, maybe not.

This is just me, but I don't want to use untreated E10 that's been sitting more than about 4 months and treated more than a year. I don't worry about non-ethanol gas, which is why I'd rather run 20 year old gas than 2 year old gas. OK, I exaggerate some.

I have a boat with an 80 gallon tank that never gets empty, but I add typically 20 gallons at a time, and treat it, and have carbs, so I have done OK with mixing old and new. Another boat with a 20 gallon tank I use about every three months, but I use ethanol free gas in it, treated, and have done OK.

I avoid gas from marinas that have water in the gas.

My experience is for coastal Virginia and has nothing to do with Arizona or Minnesota

 

[Oshkosh1]

Re: 3year old gas

So question for all you guys that think 3 year old gas is fine to use...do you guys use a fuel stabilizer? If so, why if fuel isn't degrading?

Nope...Like I said...I've used it before.
To many variables to state absolutes.
If it's in a FULL tank/can/jug/bladder with little or no air exchange then it's probably fine. If it's 3 years old, in a half full can with the vent open it's probably long been turned to paint thinner.

There is no limit to the STUPID things ppl will do.

Yeah there is..."Buying"(I plead the 5th on what our currency was) Russian Makarov pistols by the crate from some of Pol Pots ex-cronies while be surrounded by AK toting (and pointing)ex-KhmerRouge sympathizers just inside the Cambodia/Thai border is pretty much my limit. So a new shop vac 4ft away from a fuel inlet doesn't really make me nervous.:faint2:

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: 3year old gas

Ha! I remember that. you were so nervous you ran off without your change! I've felt guilty keeping it ever since. Want to meet me in Fang to settle up?

 

[Oshkosh1]

Re: 3year old gas

Ha! I remember that. you were so nervous you ran off without your change! I've felt guilty keeping it ever since. Want to meet me in Fang to settle up?

How about Marylins-a-go-go in Pattaya? (Close to the beach...far from the booger eaters of the jungle) and much less "touristy"(read more Seedy than Phuket) Feel safer on that side of the gulf. And you owe me 21 years of interest...so you can buy be a Guinness and a bowl of lemon-grass noodles with that! I'll be the guy in flip flops/Subic Bay Beach Club T-shirt and wearing a "hogs tooth"(I'm not a Marine, but "won" it from one at Quantico's 1,000 yard line with an M1-A...long story)around my neck!

 

[UncleWillie]

Re: 3year old gas

I am the O.P. Looks like I sure stirred up a debate...

This issue peaks every spring when people start up the engines the first time.
And every Fall when they try to figure out what to do with the remaining fuel.

So question for all you guys that think 3 year old gas is fine to use...do you guys use a fuel stabilizer? If so, why if fuel isn't degrading?

No, I don't use Stabilizer.
It is just really expensive Kerosene and some Colored Dye.

Sta-Bil MSDS
Petroleum Distillate ... 95% CAS# 64742-47-8
Additive Mixture ....... 5% (Color Dye??)

CAS# 64742-47-8 MSDS
Low Odor Paraffinic Solvent ... 100%
A.K.A. .. De-Aromatized Kerosene
A.K.A. .. Deodorized Kerosene

But they still sell it by the Tanker load.
The debate will never end, so let's just agree to disagree! :joyous:

 

[BrianCinAz]

Re: 3year old gas

I am the O.P. Looks like I sure stirred up a debate. The engine I have is a 1988 mercruiser 260 h.p. I bought the boat from a friend and saw it run the day before it was winterized, he also gave me the boat for a song. That is the only reason I bought the boat. I guess I should be getting a sample and checking it out. Thanks for all the responses.

The gas most likely is an ethanol blend, so the wise choice is to drain it. Do a google (or bing) search for ethanol gas separation. Ethanol blends ALWAYS separate when sitting for more than 6 months. This is a scientific and well documented fact. 3 year old fuel will be at least partially separated. There is no way to un- separate it, it will not remix in the tank no matter how much you shake it up. What happens when the separated fuel enters your engine? either the engine stalls and then needs to be thoroughly cleaned to restart, or it will blow a cylinder. Either way, you are risking more than $300 in repairs to save $300 in fuel. Not a good bet. You CANNOT smell the gas and determine if it is separated, that is an internet fable.

 

[UncleWillie]

Re: 3year old gas

The gas most likely is an ethanol blend, so the wise choice is to drain it. Do a google (or bing) search for ethanol gas separation. Ethanol blends ALWAYS separate when sitting for more than 6 months. This is a scientific and well documented fact. 3 year old fuel will be at least partially separated. There is no way to un- separate it, it will not remix in the tank no matter how much you shake it up. What happens when the separated fuel enters your engine? either the engine stalls and then needs to be thoroughly cleaned to restart, or it will blow a cylinder. Either way, you are risking more than $300 in repairs to save $300 in fuel. Not a good bet. You CANNOT smell the gas and determine if it is separated, that is an Internet fable.

Green, Agree.
Red, Disagree.

Ethanol blends do NOT spontaneously separate.
It takes excess water to cause separation.
No Water, No Separation!
NON-Ethanol gas is even worse in this regard.
It E-10 gas will harmlessly absorb 0.5% water at room temperature.
That is over 6 ounces of water in 10 gallons!
Non-Alcohol blend gas will absorb None!

Smelling for water in Gas is almost too funny to comment on! Truly a fable!

Shaking separated fuel will not remix it, adding fresh E-10 Will!
Once separated adding addition E-10 gas to re-absorb the water works just fine.
THIS is Physics and Chemistry, and is a demonstrable Scientific Fact!

 

[bruceb58]

Re: 3year old gas

It is just really expensive Kerosene and some Colored Dye.

It likely is. Probably sits on the surface of the fuel and its purpose in life is to slow down oxidation.

 

[UncleWillie]

Re: 3year old gas

It likely is. Probably sits on the surface of the fuel and its purpose in life is to slow down oxidation.

That is the first reasonable explanation I have ever heard as to how Sta-Bil might work.
Sta-Bil does not float on the surface and appears to completely dissolve in gas; So I do not agree with the explanation.

But, I still like the explanation just the same! :joyous:

 

[lakegeorge]

Re: 3year old gas

Now we REALLY know what happened. Who knew they had Shop(Franken)-Vacs back then?
Hindenburg Crash - How It Really Sounded - YouTube

Remember...I'm only talking about using it to BLOW air into the tank...not to PULL fuel out of it.

The fumes are more explosive then the gas, keep all electrical things away. I personally try running the motor with the gas. If it was winterized properly the odds are good that the gas will be fine.

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: 3year old gas

I have a more important techical question for Uncle Willie--how do you make your fonts different colors?

 

[hostage]

Re: 3year old gas

From my understanding the problems with ethanol in this situation is the following:

1) Ethanol is hygroscopic (will separate from fuel and bind to water)
2) Ethanol is a higher octane that is used to boost the lower octane of the rest of the petrol

Though there are a couple of questions:
Any idea to find out if the PO used E-10?
Could you ask the shop if they include stabil w/ winterizing, the PO should be able to tell you if they did or not

From my understanding of current winterizing practices:

1) Top the tank off before you winterize
a) reduces gas vapor
b) reduces ambient air in tank, which reduces the amount of water that could be introduced via a drop in humidity

If you had only a few gallons, I would say ditch it, though as you have $300 worth of gas in the tank I would hesitate tossing it out. I would honestly look at buying a tester to see if the gas is really bad. While I am against ethanol for many reasons, I think people exaggerated the issues, I have had no issues and know no one off hand that has had issues.

I prefer a scientific approach than going off hear say. I have saved a lot of money by doing that.

All this being said I think you will do a bit of research before you crank her up.

-Hostage

 

[UncleWillie]

Re: 3year old gas

I have a more important technical question for Uncle Willie--how do you make your fonts different colors?

Easily!

 

[bruceb58]

Re: 3year old gas

I say...drain a gallon out and look at it compared to a gallon of new clean fuel.

I had some 2 year gas in one of my boats and went out off the coast here. I thought I was lucky to get back the way the boat was misfiring. Drained all the gas when I got home and put new fuel in. Next time out, the boat worked flawlessly and the fuel change was the only thing that changed.

$300 worth of gasoline is a lot of money but so is the hassle factor cleaning out the fuel system down the road and the risk of getting stranded.

 

[57crestliner]

Re: 3year old gas

Look in your font choice area. The A<

I have a more important techical question for Uncle Willie--how do you make your fonts different colors?

Doh! Late again!

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: 3year old gas

I don't get that font choice bar

 

[bruceb58]

Re: 3year old gas

I don't get that font choice bar

Why?