91 200xp fuel peoblems

[bigdawggie]

hello

took the boat out last year and it worked great all summer. the last trip (labor day last year) i towed it a couple hundred miles and dropped it in the water and couldnt start it. once i managed to get it started it idled like crap and had no power at all. towed it back home and parked it till this weekend.

i tried to pump the primer and it would not get hard. I changed the primer and installed new fuel lines from the tanks to the bulb. I even replaced the tank selector. the primer still would not get hard. I removed the engine side hose and the priumer bulp works. I connected it back and pumped the bulb and heard a click then it got hard for a second and soft again.

I managed to start it by turning the red valve up but it had a lot of white smoke and did not idle too well. I looked at the carbs and upon removing the drain plugs for each the bottom left and middle right floats did not have any fuel in them while the others were full. I disconnected the hoses and fuel came out of them.

i am a total noob but i am mechanically inclined to do my own work (called a shop and they are charging me 100 for each carb rebuild) sot he money i'll save i figure i can buy a manual, some beer and still have enough left over to fill up the truck and boat a couple times over

for the sake of saving time from not having to read the manual, can you recommend things that i should check and replace to get it running properly again.

thanks in advance and sorry for the long post

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

it is time to clean and rebuild the carbs, did you use install alcohol resistant fuel lines (ethanol)? you should replace all of them. your carbs are not that complicated. read the basics in the TOP SECRET FILE. also read your manual on carb cleaning.

 

[jonesg]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

Get your carb rebuild kits here on iBoats, I think I paid $120 for all 6.
Beats paying $600 for a very simple job.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5cxBMDezuU&feature=related

if you don't have a manual yet

www.outboardbooks.com

 

[bigdawggie]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

thanks that's what I suspected. I took one carb out and it looks fairly simple.

I did use the alcohol resistant lines by the way.

 

[bigdawggie]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

OK guys,

bought the kits ($200) and rebuilt all 6 Carbs and now im getting fuel into all the float bowls. I tried to start it and it would not fire even once. after about 15 minutes of pumping and cranking with no luck I turned the red dial upwards and it started right away. I noticed that there was fuel on top of the unit with the red lever (not sure if that is normal) I let it run for about 5 minutes then turned it off and moved the lever back perpindicular with the body of the unit and it started up and ran. I let it sit for about an hour and it started again. i let it sit for two days then pumped the bulb and it again would not start with the lever perpindicular with the body. upon turning it upwards it started no problem.

what should I check / replace next?

what would happen if i took it out and ran it with the red lever upwards (not perpindicular)?

I am also hearing a click noise when i pump the bulb and after the click it gets hard then becomes soft upon the next pump.

thanks

 

[Vitamin Sea]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

Crank case vacuum switch under the carbs may be the culprtit it happen to me

 

[jonesg]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

before you start throwing parts at it,

cold engine, what is your start proceedure?

Heres mine.
Pump bulb firm.
Push key in 3 times for a few seconds to prime.
Turn key , after it cranks a couple seconds I bump the key in a couple times.
It usually starts on the second try if not the first.
Keep bumping the key after it fires up to keep it running rich for about 30 seconds, after that its fine.

 

[bigdawggie]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

in the past when it was working fine i would just pump the bulp till firm, lift the lever, push in the key and crank it for about 5 seconds till it started.

this time I tried all the cold start procedures, pushing in key couple times, using the idle lever, etc... no luck but as soon as i turned thr red lever it started right away.

I also am not 100% sure but when the boat worked fine I think the bulb would actually get hard as opposed to now where it gets hard after i hear the click than not hard on the next pump

thanks

 

[bigdawggie]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

i tried to start it again tonight and still no luck.

any ideas?

 

[daselbee]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

Make sure the primer solenoid is actually working.
When you push the key in, (key in on position), you should hear a click from the primer solenoid.
Remove one of the very small primer fuel lines UP AT THE MANIFOLD, the top one is easy to get to, and check for fuel there when the primer solenoid is engaged. Have a bottle there to catch fuel.

When you turn the red solenoid lever, you are "manually" activating that fuel enriching system.

Look for fuel leaks around the output of the primer solenoid. Maybe the line is completely off....

When you pump the bulb, and it gets firm, then you hear a click, that click is coming from the fuel pump. You are again "manually" pressurizing the fuel system with the bulb, and the fuel pump can click like you are describing.
Also, when running, you will hear a click everytime the fuel pump "unloads" and pumps a shot of fuel to the carbs.

 

[bigdawggie]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

when i turn the key to the on position and push it in i hear a click but i thought that was for the choke?

I am leaking fuel and can see it on top of the unit with the red lever but can't track down where it's coming from. I doubt that a hose fell off completely since there are no fuel puddles but it seems like it's just enough to wet the unit then evaporate.

the primer hose you are talking about is that connected to the carbs or it goes directly to the manifold? assuming i am getting fuel through it then what next?

thanks for your help

 

[daselbee]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

Here comes a book....

Yes. The primer solenoid clicks when you push the key in. It is Evinrude's modernization of the old fashioned choke. It performs the same function...enriching the mixture for cold starting.

You absolutely should be getting fuel thru the primer system, but ONLY WHEN ACTIVATED by pressing the key in.

So, if you look very carefully, you will see three small fuel lines attaching to the top of the primer solenoid. One is fuel in from the fuel pump out, and two are for sending fuel up to each cylinder (back of intake manifold).
You can trace them up to their fittings on the back of each intake manifold (six of them...they tee off a couple of places).

When you manually pressurize the fuel system by squeezing the primer bulb, fuel flows thru the fuel pump, and into the carb bowls, until each float rises and shuts off the fuel flow. That is the point when you feel the primer bulb get firm.

The system is pressurized by your manual pumping of the bulb.
So, now, when you press the key in for priming during start, that residual pressure shoots fuel out the two primer solenoid outlet lines and up to the back of the intake, where there is a fitting for the small hoses to connect to.
The residual pressure is not really enough though. While you are cranking the engine, with key in, the fuel pump is working, and it "repressurizes" the system, so that everytime you press the key in, fuel is available under pressure to flow up to the back of the intake, and into the mix.

Fuel is injected into the intake, on the cylinder side of the carbs, and the whole mixture is enrichened.

Consider this: If you pump the primer bulb up til it is firm, and then TURN THE RED LEVER 90* to the solenoid body, you manually open the solenoid valves, and IF you pump the bulb again...you will see it is not firm anymore. It is because you are then directly pumping fuel into each cyl's intake because the primer solenoid has been manually operated. The system is not closed when the red lever is 90* to the solenoid body.

You seem to have a rich mixture when the engine is hot. Equivalent to flooding. I do not see where you verified that the primer solenoid red lever is set parallel to the body of the solenoid. Check that. Any fuel leaking or present on top of that solenoid should not be there, and your primer bulb should get firm when pumped. If it never really gets firm, then you may have a fuel leak on the engine side of the primer bulb, and a leaking primer solenoid would be considered such a leak.

There could be any number of other things to cause the engine to be rich...a leaking needle/seat in a carb for instance. I just want to be sure your primer solenoid is not leaking, and that the red lever is set right. One key is this: The primer bulb must get firm. If it never gets firm on initial pumping, you have a leak somewhere, or a bad bulb. It should stay firm, holding that pressure, until the engine starts. Then it will soften up a bit.

 

[jonesg]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

Thats the problem.

the red lever needs to be = parallel = along the primer solenoid body.

 

[daselbee]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

Sorry, I got your post mixed up with another very similar one. Just disregard the part about rich mixture when hot....doesn't apply to you...the other guy is the one with a rich, flooding engine when hot. Sorry.
The rest of the post does apply to your issue.

 

[bigdawggie]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

ok here are the facts

i rebiult all 6 carbs after the rebuild the white smoke has dissipated and the motor runs great once i get it started.

the primer will get firm only after i hear the click while pumping. if i release the pressure on the primer after the click and pump it again it is no longer firm

I have tried cranking it for 5-10 seconds multiple times witht he red lever down or parallel to the body of the solenoid and it would not start.

I removed the spark plugs and they were wet but it looked like oil not gas does that make sense?

with the red lever turned 180 degrees up it starts and runs fine. if the red lever is down or parallel to the solenoid body it will not start. I have not tried turning it 90 degrees so it is perpindicular with the solenoid yet.

 

[daselbee]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

I never saw a red lever that rotated a full 180*. They are parallel to the body in normal run position, and when you turn them to manual, it stops at about 90* to 110* to the body of the solenoid.
But it may be out there, I just never saw one turn that far.

You have something strange going on with the primer solenoid unit.

As I said before, pull the primer line off the top fitting on # 2's intake (very easy to get to from the starboard side) and crank the engine with the key in.
Fuel should flow out that loose line, and into the bottle you should be using to catch it.

Also, those fittings are very small, and can gum up and clog. Run a wire thru to make sure they are open.

 

[bigdawggie]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

I am getting fuel to all the float bowls of the carbs if that means anything.

I'll try the bottle technique this weekend and also get a price on a new solenoid unit if it's cheap enough might as well replace it.

I was reading up on the crank case vacuum switch and it also may be a culprit. I'll have to look at it this weekend also maybe swap it out while im at it.

thanks

 

[jonesg]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

ok here are the facts

i rebiult all 6 carbs after the rebuild the white smoke has dissipated and the motor runs great once i get it started.

the primer will get firm only after i hear the click while pumping. if i release the pressure on the primer after the click and pump it again it is no longer firm

theres something going on here that you have not fixed.
the bulb should get firm, click or not.
the bulb should get firm period.
You have a sticking float valve , or a float installed upside down.
With the float problem it keeps pumping til the float lets loose and you might be hearing it click when it does, in the meantime it might have flooded the throat.

the other problem is the primer solenoid.

 

[daselbee]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

theres something going on here that you have not fixed.
the bulb should get firm, click or not.
the bulb should get firm period.

Absolutely correct. ^^^^^

You have a sticking float valve , or a float installed upside down.

Can't install a float upside down on this engine. It physically will not fit.

With the float problem it keeps pumping til the float lets loose and you might be hearing it click when it does, in the meantime it might have flooded the throat.

The click is coming from the fuel pump. Very normal to hear if you pump the primer bulb way way up. I was wondering that myself...when the fuel pump clicks...where is that pressurized fuel going???? He has a fuel leak somewhere after the fuel pump...maybe the fuel is leaking through the fuel pump itself and into the pulse line and then into #6 crankcase.....

 

[jonesg]

Re: 91 200xp fuel peoblems

And he's showing leaking fuel around the primer solenoid so yeh its going someplace. A good light and watching close will show where.