Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

[ozenine]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Here is the aluminum:
http://toronto.en.craigslist.ca/tor/boa/1437604112.html

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Here is the aluminum:
http://toronto.en.craigslist.ca/tor/boa/1437604112.html

That was pretty much my first boat. Check out the link in my signature.

 

[ozenine]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Originally Posted by ozenine
Here is the aluminum:
http://toronto.en.craigslist.ca/tor/boa/1437604112.html

That was pretty much my first boat. Check out the link in my signature.

Looks amazing!
You mentioned in that post that you had to rebuild the engine and transom. So couple questions on that: what is transom made of taht it rotted? Should not it be same as whole boat, aluminum? and then how can it rot?
And also u mentioned that u rebuild the engine on it. What is the price range for job like that?

Add: I called the guy with taht aluminum and he said taht hull is in great shape but the motor smokes and he has a almost complete motor in parts extra that he will throw in free.

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Silvertip said it well; I don;t want to repeat but here are some additional thoughts

1. get an outboard not an I/O.
2. Like many shoppers, you have some conflicting wants and restrictions. A 16' garage won't hold much boat and trailer: the moto sticks out 1-2' and the trailer tongue about 2-3' leaving you with an 11-13' boat. So much for 6 passengers and big water.
3. focus on the motor; that's where the money goes first, in the purchase and second, in the maintenance. Get an outboard.
4. When you buy an old inexpensive boat know that you are buying a hobby, not transportation. It is like buying an old sportscar that requires tinkering and patience, not like buying an old F150 workhorse.
5. Although I'm partial to fiberglass center consoles with little fixed upholstery, few if any electronics and no carpet (and it has an outboard), I agree with the 16' Aluminum starcraft--I had 2 of them (in succession) growing up, with OMC 55's on them. That's an outboard.
6. Because I'm familiar with boats, a test drive isn't as important to me, but for the unfamiliar, it's important. Don't take the family with you (and never on the maiden voyage) but on the test drive be thinking about others on the boat-will they be comfortable or cramped, subject to spray, etc. Therefore take some guys with you to see how it rides. (For example, don't be fooled by seats in the rear (stern) , no one sits there unless they need a face washed.)
7. Budget in initial repairs equipment insurance and licensing--I'd say $800 on a $3000 boat, unless the motor is under warranty and has just come out of the shop with tune up, carbs and waterpump. Factor in storage based on #2.
8. Finally, get an outboard.

 

[ahannas]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Oleg, A few thoughts on your decision.

1. Price - $4k can get you into boating but you?ll be looking at 15 y/o boats.

2. Problems - Older boats often have them. Plan on finding a couple. If it doesn?t happen, you?ll be pleasantly surprised!

3. Towing ? It depends on what?s in that F150. My 19 footer weighs 2800#. Add the weight of the trailer, gas and gear and I?m over 4000#. I?m not saying your truck won?t do it, I?m just saying you should be aware that the weight of the boat is only part of the story.

4. Wood rot. Older fiberglass boats have wood parts in their structure. These can sponge up water and rot. My first boat was 15 y/o when I bought it and had a floor like standing on a large bass drum. Early that first spring, I replaced the floor with treated ?? plywood and two layers of fiberglass. Actually, it was an easier job than I expected. Now a rotten transom is a different story!

5. OB vs. IO ? You mention that you?re mechanically inclined so consider the IO. They are much more ?car-like? than OBs. If you?re going to be skiing or tubing, the IO design often affords a helpful platform in the stern. Also, a 12-15 y/o OB will very likely be 2-stroke so you may end up mixing oil. (not a big deal ? but you should know that.) That said, the OB certainly has its advantages. It?s lighter, easier to get at for maintenance, does not require the 3 min of venting before starting and is cheaper to winterize. One other thing, the OB is self draining. Suppose you get a couple nice early Spring days and want to do a little fishing. (Believe me, once you catch this boating disease you?ll be chomping at the bit by April.) With an IO, you?ve got an hours worth of crawling around the motor to properly drain the block, risers, impeller, water pump etc. With the OB you just pull the boat out of the water and it drains.

6. Finally, I agree with several other posters here. Find a 17 foot bow rider, (they?re plentyful) with a good running OB (75 ? 90HP for an aluminum boat, 90-115 for fiberglass) and jump on in! The water?s fine.

Oh, one other thing. Take a boating course. Several organizations (Pwr. Squadron, Coast Guard Auxiliary and probably some provincial authority) teach these courses, usually they start holding classes in the early spring. If you plan to bring your boat into the US at all, many states now require a certificate showing that you've completed this training.

Hope this helps.

Alan

 

[Snobike Mike]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

What Ontario lakes are you looking to go on?

If it's any of the Great Lakes including Georgian Bay or Simcoe then you're way to small in that size range.

If you're going to be on "cottage lakes" you'll be fine.

Good to see another canuck on the board. To bad we'll be mothballed till May though.

Good luck.

 

[ozenine]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Thanks again guys!

What Ontario lakes are you looking to go on?

If it's any of the Great Lakes including Georgian Bay or Simcoe then you're way to small in that size range.

If you're going to be on "cottage lakes" you'll be fine.

Thanks for advice, Mike! And yes, It is nice to see a fellow from our cooooold country
Well I want to go fishing and sutisfy my family with some pleasure rides So cottage lakes are fine, but why do you think taht Simcoe (Georgian Bay I am not interested in) is too big? Do you mean that waves will overturn the boat or it is not reliable enough for the longer distances?

Towing ? It depends on what?s in that F150. My 19 footer weighs 2800#. Add the weight of the trailer, gas and gear and I?m over 4000#. I?m not saying your truck won?t do it, I?m just saying you should be aware that the weight of the boat is only part of the story.

Thanks Alan, I checked towing capacity on my truck and it was over 9000#, so it should do. BTW, you answered my other question - weight, I had no clue how much these boats weight. Garage is 21 feet long, so my calculations show that 16 footer will PROBABLY fit, but final measure will prove it.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Looks amazing!
You mentioned in that post that you had to rebuild the engine and transom. So couple questions on that: what is transom made of that it rotted? Should not it be same as whole boat, aluminum? and then how can it rot?
And also u mentioned that u rebuild the engine on it. What is the price range for job like that?

Add: I called the guy with that aluminum and he said that hull is in great shape but the motor smokes and he has a almost complete motor in parts extra that he will throw in free.

Both aluminum and fiberglass hulls have a reinforced section in the stern to support the weight and force of the motor. Usually it's comprised of 2 pieces of 3/4" plywood sandwiched together. On an aluminum boat you literally take off the motor and some trim pieces and slide (or vacuum HA!) the old one out and slide the new one in. It's a little bit more work for a glass boat.

I did not have to have the motor on my Jupiter rebuilt. I just had the carbs redone and a lot of electrical stuff replaced. This was before I found iboats. I could do a lot of this work by myself now with the help found here. Both my last boat and my current boat had not been run in many years when I acquired them and I was able to get them running with little effort.

 

[Jeep Man]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Hey Oleg,
What side of T.O. are you on? There are plenty of boats available this time of year for a good price. Check out the local boat dealers. They usually have a few decent trade-ins at the back of the lot in your price range they want to move out before the snow flies. They want to avoid winterizing it. Also, check out Aeromarine on the web. I think they are holding their last auction for the year this weekend. A lot of dealers bring their overstock to get them gone. Prices are usually good at this time. They have moved recently. They used to be on the 400 at Innisfil Beach Rd. south of Barrie, and now are off Hwy. 11 just north of Barrie. I'd stick to an 18' or 19' with a 90+ if you want to get on plane with 6 on board. Good luck!

P.S. Adding your hometown or area to your sign-up info helps narrow the field.

 

[Rickairmedic]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Ozenine I would be running to get that 16' Starcraft quick like . I agree with Ez that is a perfect starter boat most likely a Jupiter which is what I have and what EZ had before he got his current Starcraft.



Rick

 

[Jeep Man]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Ozenine I would be running to get that 16' Starcraft quick like . I agree with Ez that is a perfect starter boat most likely a Jupiter which is what I have and what EZ had before he got his current Starcraft.



Rick

When are these tinwackers going to stop pushing Starcrafts on newbies? LOL

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

When are these tinwackers going to stop pushing Starcrafts on newbies? LOL

Ya know Jeep Man, I know your post is in jest but this actually something I'm concerned about. I don't want to sound like I'm pushing Starcrafts on people or trying to convert anyone. It's just that we do have a number of new members coming and asking for advice looking to get on the water inexpensively. I just personally feel that an outboard powered tin boat has the least potential to be a money pit. There's a lot of scary stuff out there in the <$3000 fiberglass boat world! The last thing I want to see is someone unknowingly buy a rotted hulk of a hull and end up being turned off on boating altogether.

 

[Snobike Mike]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Thanks again guys!

So cottage lakes are fine, but why do you think taht Simcoe (Georgian Bay I am not interested in) is too big? Do you mean that waves will overturn the boat or it is not reliable enough for the longer distances?

Hi Ozenine,

You have to be careful with Simcoe as it really is fairly big water. I believe the largest recorded waves there exceeded 7 feet and it can get squirely on Simcoe fairly quickly.

It's all about conditions which can change fairly quickly. I've been out on Simcoe in a friends 18 footer before we bought our boat on a really nice day and if the waves were much bigger I would have started to be uneasy. Being out that day convinced me and my wife that we needed a bigger boat so when we bought ours, it was a 21 footer.

I'm not saying you can't go out on Simcoe with a 16 footer, but compared to a cottage lake, it's a whole other magnitude of problems that can arise.

Like anything be careful and have fun. And of course, if you can, stretch to buy the biggest boat you can afford, you'll have more fun and generally be safer in the larger waters.

Cheers.

 

[Rickairmedic]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

When are these tinwackers going to stop pushing Starcrafts on newbies? LOL

I was a newby at the beginning of summer ( or at least renewed ) as it had been 20 years since I had owned a boat. I started out the sumer with a 1974 Larson shark 1700 ( trihull fiberglass 17' boat) I ended up selling it as I figured out quick it was way more than I wanted to deal with . I own 3 boats right now a 1964 Crestliner ( fiberglass ) , a 1960 Cutter runabout ( fiberglass ) and a 1970 Starcraft jupiter V ( Tincan ) . I am pretty sure you can pick which one I decided was the easiest ( cheapest ) to get back on the water with . I do plan to keep the 1960 Cutter ( long enough to turn a profit ) as its a pretty rare boat . The 64 Crestliner I am unloading on my scrapman and needless to say I will be on the water next spring in my Tincan . Yes I am a Tinwacker and I have to say if you want to0 get on the water ( safely ) with a small investment Tin is in . I have right around $1100.00 into my tincan right now and will end up with around $1500 into it with the boat completely rebuilt like new . I have not itched once while rebuilding this boat . I could have had it on the water this summer but work and money of course got in the way . I would say if the OP has $3000-$4000 to invest The 16' Starcraft he posted will get him on the water quickly and comfortably and safely ( as long as he sticks to the smaller lakes ) as a newby I honestly dont think he needs to be trying BIG water even with a 21-22'er as another poster stated conditions can change real quick in big water and its not a place a new boater should be figuring things out and I have boated the Gulf of Mexico so yes I have been out on BIG water . I have not seen a Glass boat in his price range that I would feel sure was safe to take out without pulling the deck and checking the stringers and such .



Rick

 

[ozenine]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Cool. Thanks for the advice on Simcoe and on the tinworld I am thinking about taht boat for 950 now.

I guess my biggest concern is that engine is smoking. It does not sound like a easy fix since Smoke -> Burning Oil -> Need to change rings or possibly bore cylynders. So it is not something that can be done in the homeshop.

Do not get me wrong, I know that there will be issues and a lot but some of them I can do 95% myself and some (like this one) requires a lot of investments.

What do you guys think?

Add: Should I look at this one:
http://toronto.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehicles-boats-watercraft-powerboats-motorboats-nice-rider-runs-amazing-fun-in-the-sun-W0QQAdIdZ164799230

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Add: Should I look at this one:
http://toronto.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehicles-boats-watercraft-powerboats-motorboats-nice-rider-runs-amazing-fun-in-the-sun-W0QQAdIdZ164799230

That boat looks to have absolutely no interior room. Very impractical.

As for the other one, not sure how serious that issue is. Older 2-strokes smoke. That's a fact of life. Switching to a synthetic oil may help.

 

[Rickairmedic]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

I agree with EZ 2 strokes burn oil its mixed in the gas so they do smoke it is possible that the person selling the 16' Starcraft has never had a boat before and figures if its smoking theres a problem when there may actually not be a problem . I still say to get on the water cheap that is a great boat and looks to be in better shape than my 70 Starcraft was when I got it for $800.00 . You might even be able to get that one and go out boating right away with it .


The last one you showed I agree with EZ as well looks like there is NO interior room . You are wanting a boat you could take up to 6 people out on and that one looks tight even for 4 people. The $950.00 Starcraft you are looking at if you worked on it and watched your money would be one heck of a boat with less than $3000.00 invested .



Rick

 

[204Angler]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Get a 24' Grady White with twin 115's

 

[Snobike Mike]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

Get a 24' Grady White with twin 115's

That boat would be underpowered. I'd want twin 250's on the back.

Having said that, if you're selling one with those specs for $3 grand I'm in.

 

[ozenine]

Re: Absolute beginner wants a boat but very lost

That boat would be underpowered. I'd want twin 250's on the back.

Having said that, if you're selling one with those specs for $3 grand I'm in.

Nonononono!!!!!!
This is my thread, I started it, so I have the first shot at this one!!!!!

I will probably go take a look at it tonight.