Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

[rivermouse]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

I would get a 2 stroke because I love the old school smell.

 

[kahuna123]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

If it were me I would buy a Honda, or a Yami any day over an optipop. But its no different than a car. Take them for a test drive and see what you like.
A four stroke has very little torque out of the hole compared to 2 stroke. So if you are considering skiing that could make a huge difference. Here in Florida we kinda look at things different. With all the salt and constant use our motors don't last 30 years like some of the people on this forum. The question you are asking is Ford vs Chevy.

You need to go out and drive them.

 

[aerobat]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

What is magic about the Etec? I am in a similar situation, re-powering an older boat.

on the paper : very responsive, superb holeshot, good fuel efficiency, low maintanance, good warranty. in real life it has like every other motor some advantages and disadvantages.

being myself an owner of a DFI 2 stroke i think i would go for a four stroke today.

 

[The Man 5150]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

I have actually driven both although the 2 stroke was a 1996 model I did get the I deal of the 2 stroke power.
What I am looking for is maintance and reliabilty issues that you guys have come across over the years.
I am not too conserned with the high power take off you get with the 2 stroke as I will never be skieing or tubeing, this is strictly a fishing
boat with the exception of the ocasional cruise around the lake with my wife.

 

[dingbat]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

A good friend of mine has a Merc 4 stroke on his crabbing boat. He is a firm believer in not fixing anything until it dies.

In the 7 years that he has owned this motor, he has changed the oil twice and I rebuilt the carb for him this spring because he never remembers to use stabiler when he pulls it out of the slip for the winter.

Locally, a 2 stroke on the back of a boat hurts resale. Nobody wants them. They would rather change the oil once a year instead of dealing with 2 stroke oil all the time. All the commerical guys have long since changed over to four strokes it that tells you anything stroke. You will also find that 4 strokes are much more tolerate of fuel problems.

 

[The Man 5150]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

are you refering to things like water in the fuel.

 

[Bamaman1]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

Like it was said:

Cruise slow, get a 4 stroke. Cruise fast, get a 2 stroke.

2 stroke advantage: light weight, few parts to break, good "out of the hole," inexpensive upkeep/maintenance.

4 stroke advantage: so smooth and quiet at slow speeds, improved fuel usage, longer life.

I've got a Yamaha 115 hp 2 stroke on a 24' pontoon boat--26 years old and still running great. I'll be switching to 4 stroke next time.

Thanks guys for not getting to that Chevy/Ford/Dodge comparison of Merc/Evinrude/Yamaha. All the engines are good--and getting better all the time.

 

[The Man 5150]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

Like it was said:

Cruise slow, get a 4 stroke. Cruise fast, get a 2 stroke.

2 stroke advantage: light weight, few parts to break, good "out of the hole," inexpensive upkeep/maintenance.

4 stroke advantage: so smooth and quiet at slow speeds, improved fuel usage, longer life.

I've got a Yamaha 115 hp 2 stroke on a 24' pontoon boat--26 years old and still running great. I'll be switching to 4 stroke next time.

Thanks guys for not getting to that Chevy/Ford/Dodge comparison of Merc/Evinrude/Yamaha. All the engines are good--and getting better all the time.

Thanks for your reply but I would like to know if you've had such good luck out of a 2 stroke,
then why are you goinig to switch over to a 4 stroke on your next boat ?
Is it because its a pontoon or is there other reasons. Thanks

and yes I really appericate the fact that this discussion has not turned into a
Ford ( which is obviously superior in every way LOL) vs. Chevy debate.

 

[aerobat]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

when you take a 2stroke carbed model the 4stroke has clear advantages in fuel efficientcy, reliability especially at trolling sppeds, emissions and some more. the 2 stroke tend to be cheaper , lighter , more powerful and easier to repair.

when you take a two stroke DFI they may be head to head with a 4 stroke regarding fuel efficiency and emisions, but the befefit of an easy repair , low price and a lightweight package is mostly gone, so here its a personal decision which technology you prefer.

 

[connemaraisland]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

Tracker very likely has a contract with Merc and you won't find a different engine because that sets the price differently. There are lots of boats equal or better than the Tracker that you can get whatever engine you want. Alumacraft for example will sell you a "No Prerig" boat (no engine or controls). You then put whatever engine you want on that boat. More and more manufacturers have gone to the "package" concept so you may be stuck with whatever engine they package.

Well I am going to screw you up but - Why would you buy a Tracker? The Alumacraft above is a much better constructed boat, rides MUCH better and has a better reputation. I have driven one of these and was really impressed. It had Yamaha's new 70hp engine on it and it was fast and VERY quiet. Yamaha's have the best reputation for reliability and NO electrical/ignition issues that have plagued Mercury for years. Other than Yamaha go for the Etech - great performance, quiet but long life is still to be determined because they are breaking new ground with this technology - Bob

 

[The Man 5150]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

Well I am going to screw you up but - Why would you buy a Tracker? The Alumacraft above is a much better constructed boat, rides MUCH better and has a better reputation. I have driven one of these and was really impressed. It had Yamaha's new 70hp engine on it and it was fast and VERY quiet. Yamaha's have the best reputation for reliability and NO electrical/ignition issues that have plagued Mercury for years. Other than Yamaha go for the Etech - great performance, quiet but long life is still to be determined because they are breaking new ground with this technology - Bob

Well I have not decided on the tracker Boat yet. Mainly I used the Pro Guide 16WT as an example of the size
and type of boat that I was considering. I am looking at several diffrent brands of boat.
I am a disabled vet and live on a fixed income. So I am trying to find a brand that will give me the most features and best boat for the money,
and that has a certified dealer that is close to me. There are 2 Tracker dealers about an hours drive from me.
The nearest Alumacraft dealer to me is almost 4 hours away. I do have an Alumacraft brochure and I have found a couple of
there boats that I like that should be in my price range. I just need to take a day to go up to the dealership and look at them in person.
I am also looking at G3 boats, Lowe boats, Lund boats, Crestlinerboats, SmokerCraft boats, and Fisher boats.
So I have not just stettled on Tracker boats I am trying to research all of these brands to determin which one I like the best.
I have looked into the ETC engines and like what they have done. However I havent looked into the Yamaha engines or Honda engines.
Right now I am trying to determin which way to go either a 2 Stroke or a 4 stroke. I am a mechanic and I understand how they both work.
I am just looking for owners experiances and advice on the two types of engine.
As I have never owned a boat and I am looking for advice that is not comeing from a dealer, as I do not have any friends that own a boat.

 

[HT32BSX115]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

There was a time that I said I would NEVER buy a 2 stroke.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evinrude_Outboard_Motors

Evinrude has been making outboard motors for more than 100 years.


When you read through the forums and people talk about 2-strokes, they usually talk about 2 stroke disadvantages. (mostly carbed disadvantages)

I like the fact that Evinrude (and Johnson I suppose) have a 3 year warranty and NO service requirements whatsoever for 3 years....


There are all sorts of opinions out there. I don't plan to buy a boat with an outboard on it (I WILL probably replace my current engine with a tricked 502 though!!)


You are going to get all sorts of opinions...... Your best bet will be to get in the car and go to a place that sells a few different types of boats and engines and TEST drive some of them to make up your mind.

ALL the new engines are very reliable and fuel efficient. I doubt you'll be able to tell a LOT of difference in running etc...

Most of the testimonial info you'll get here and on other forums is "here's what I have and I LOVE/HATE it"


Go drive some boats!! Dealers are usually happy to oblige if they're near a lake... (and they think you're ready to buy a new boat/motor! Just don't let yourself be pushed by a salesman!!


Good luck!


Rick

 

[timdan94]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

I have a crestliner superhawk 1700 with a merc 115 4 stroke on it and am very happy with it. we actually skiied behind it the other day. I just use different props for different situations. a 3 blade for light cruising/fishing and a 4 blade for watersports. 4 blade hits 37mph and the 3 blade hits 40mph. I'm very happy with the performance and fuel effeciency of the boat. the oil change once a year is better than adding fuel at every fill up. I will never own a 2 stroke ever again after having the 4stroke. and with efi the starts and idle are awesome.

 

[sschefer]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

I have a JetCraft Falcon 1625 with the 2011 Merc 60hp 4 stroke. It trolls all day long at 2.2 mph without a hicup. It's no race boat with a top end of about 35mph but that's fine with me. I've got 35 hours on mine and so far it's the sweetest engine I've ever owned. It sips fuel. Yesterday I made a three mile run up the lake and trolled or drifted for about 2 hours and then came back. Total fuel usage according to SmartCraft was 1.4 gals. That's darn hard to beat and the motor is still running in break-in mode! I used to burn up 15 gals in a 1/2 day with my 150's so you can imagine how happy this makes me.

Edit -- I just read your last post about Alumacraft and the other boats you're looking at. For the most part, you're looking at the same boat with a different name. You have a lot of Brunswick boats on your list. You might consider a heavy gauge aluminum boat if you're looking for something that will last a lifetime. I chose JetCraft because I could order it just the way I wanted it and then have it built. Mine was 20,000.00 out the door with the 60hp Merc on it and the low water launch EZ loader trailer. I got mine with just the essentials and then added on the things I wanted as the money became available. The payments are 300.00 a month and insurance is about 250.00 a year. Just saying, it's something you might want to consider if your budget will let it happen. You can check them out at either www.jetcraftboats.com or www.harbercraft.com.

 

[HT32BSX115]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

I have a crestliner superhawk 1700 with a merc 115 4 stroke on it and am very happy with it. we actually skiied behind it the other day. I just use different props for different situations. a 3 blade for light cruising/fishing and a 4 blade for watersports. 4 blade hits 37mph and the 3 blade hits 40mph. I'm very happy with the performance and fuel effeciency of the boat. the oil change once a year is better than adding fuel at every fill up. I will never own a 2 stroke ever again after having the 4stroke. and with efi the starts and idle are awesome.

Yours is a great example of the differences. According to Evinrude, Their 115 HP ETEC will use LESS gasoline AND oil per year than your 4 stroke Mercury. (because changing your oil is "using" it right? after it's drained, it's "used" and must be replaced)

I think your Mercury engine is a Yamaha isn't it?

The amount "less" is is not much however....probably negligible.... Even though the XD-100 oil is a LOT more expensive than regular 2-stroke TC-W3 oil it's similar in cost to the total oil change cost of a 4 stroke (I think this is also if you have the "dealer" do it) If you buy an aftermarket filter and use Walmart Supertech oil, it WILL be cheaper!

If you're considering a Honda 115 for example, weight is a factor. It weighs almost 100lbs MORE than the ETEC. (and the other engines too!)


Here's some comparisons, admittedly by Evinrude http://www.evinrude.com/en-CA/Engines/ETEC_V4/ETEC_115_V4


There's lots of pros and cons.......I LIKE the idea of not having to adjust valves and replace timing belts!

 

[sschefer]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

The E-Tec is a great motor but dealers have complained about parts availabilty, if and when you need them. The Merc's are not Yamaha's, the 25's and below are Tohatsu but Yamaha does work with the Merc design team so that's where the confusion comes in. There was one or two years when Yamaha did make a few Merc motors but that was awhile back. The Yamaha motors are also great motors. Their 150 4 stroke is definitely a best in class. Evinrude went out on a limb when they developed the E-Tec but so far it's been a good decision for them. However, with all the other manufacturers developing heavily in 4 strokes now it will just be a matter of time before they are forced to go that route also or be doomed. The term two stroke is an evil word to the EPA and environmentalists. Few have the knowledge to understand that Evinrude is a ECO friendly two stroke.

 

[pootnic]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

Like it was said:

Cruise slow, get a 4 stroke. Cruise fast, get a 2 stroke.

2 stroke advantage: light weight, few parts to break, good "out of the hole," inexpensive upkeep/maintenance.

4 stroke advantage: so smooth and quiet at slow speeds, improved fuel usage, longer life.

I've got a Yamaha 115 hp 2 stroke on a 24' pontoon boat--26 years old and still running great. I'll be switching to 4 stroke next time.

Thanks guys for not getting to that Chevy/Ford/Dodge comparison of Merc/Evinrude/Yamaha. All the engines are good--and getting better all the time.

Just wondering how long your "new/old" 2 stroke has to last before you put longer life in it's collum.
Like mentioned before this is almost a Ford-Chevy fight.
As long as you buy one that meets today's standards,you will probably do fine.
On that size boat weight can be an issue and cc's rule...99% of the time.

 

[The Man 5150]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

I have a JetCraft Falcon 1625 with the 2011 Merc 60hp 4 stroke. It trolls all day long at 2.2 mph without a hicup. It's no race boat with a top end of about 35mph but that's fine with me. I've got 35 hours on mine and so far it's the sweetest engine I've ever owned. It sips fuel. Yesterday I made a three mile run up the lake and trolled or drifted for about 2 hours and then came back. Total fuel usage according to SmartCraft was 1.4 gals. That's darn hard to beat and the motor is still running in break-in mode! I used to burn up 15 gals in a 1/2 day with my 150's so you can imagine how happy this makes me.

Edit -- I just read your last post about Alumacraft and the other boats you're looking at. For the most part, you're looking at the same boat with a different name. You have a lot of Brunswick boats on your list. You might consider a heavy gauge aluminum boat if you're looking for something that will last a lifetime. I chose JetCraft because I could order it just the way I wanted it and then have it built. Mine was 20,000.00 out the door with the 60hp Merc on it and the low water launch EZ loader trailer. I got mine with just the essentials and then added on the things I wanted as the money became available. The payments are 300.00 a month and insurance is about 250.00 a year. Just saying, it's something you might want to consider if your budget will let it happen. You can check them out at either www.jetcraftboats.com or www.harbercraft.com.

Thanks for the link.
I looked them up and the nearest dealer to me is over 800 miles, That is just a little to far for me to go for warenty work. However I really did like the look of those boats. Also thanks for the info on the fact that all of or most of the boats I am looking at are all owned by the same parent company. I had no ideal about that.

The more I here and read I am really leaning tword the 4 stroke engines. I really am likeing the ideal of not haveing to buy the oil to mix with the gas. Also the yearly oil change to me is not a big deal as I will probley just do that my self. I am not worried with a fast top speed boat as all I want to do is fish and it sounds like a 4 stroke is really good at trolling.

 

[aerobat]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

The more I here and read I am really leaning tword the 4 stroke engines. I really am likeing the ideal of not haveing to buy the oil to mix with the gas. Also the yearly oil change to me is not a big deal as I will probley just do that my self. I am not worried with a fast top speed boat as all I want to do is fish and it sounds like a 4 stroke is really good at trolling.

on an etec or other dfi you do not mix with the gas but have a separate oil tank. further my evinrude 150 V6 does not sound like you would imagine from a carbed 2 stroke. it sound like a 4 stroke V6 but with double ampitude since it fires every revolution. further it like said neither sucks a gas/oil mixture nor it sucks gas through the crankase. it suckes only air and after all ports are closed and the air compressed fuel is sprayed in at high pressure by a electromagnetic pump injector -and all is controlled by a computer. at low speed even in a stratisfied mode. oil is sprayed just to critical parts that need lubrication and depends on load and speed, it is very low on oil consumption.

on an etec engine the simplicity of a carbed 2stroke is definitly gone, but you will be stunned when you believe an etec is a smelling and rumbling engine with a sound similar to a chainsaw like you would imagine from a two stroke.

 

[The Man 5150]

Re: Cant decide 4 Stroke vs 2 stroke help

I understand that the new DFI 2 strokes are a lot quiter than the older 2 strokes.
Myself one of the reasons I am leaning to the 4 stroke is not haveing to buy the 2 cycle oil.
I know that inplace of the 2 cycle oil I will have to take care of the oil in the crank case.

I am not sure how much 2 cycle oil is used to a tanks of gas.
Or how much 2 cycle oil I would have to buy over the corse of a summer.
I plan on useing my boat at least once a week for a good days worth of running around.
Can you tell me how much 2 cycle oil is used on an average day of running around or how much do you use over the summer?