Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

LAC_STS

Master Chief Petty Officer
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Jul 1, 2010
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895
Ok so I saw a few of us here are having some of the same problems and putting a new coil in has seemed to solve it for a little while, until it goes bad again.

I replaced my coil and now the engine runs great. But I can still feel that the coil is getting hot. Not as hot as the last one but almost.


So tell me if this sounds right.



In my manual at the beginning of the part that talks about breaker point IGNs it gives a general how it works desc.

It says

"Beginning at the key switch, current flows to the ballast resistor and then to the + side of the coil. When the resistor is cold its resistance is approximately 1 ohm. The resistance increases in proportion to the resistors rise in temp."

Ill summarize the next part.

It goes on to say that when the engine is at idle or slow speed the cam on the dist shaft revolves at a relatively slow speed, making the breaker points remained closed for a slightly longer period of time. Because the points remain closed longer more current is allowed to flow and the current heats the reisitor and increases its resistance to cut down on current flow, thereby reducing burning the points.

Durnign high RPM engine operation, the reduced current flow allows the resistor to cool and reduce resistance, increasing current flow.



So, I dunno about everyone else but the coil I have says it is supposed to be used with a .75-.85 ohm ballast resistor. The manual says at idle the resistance should be about 1 ohm. I measures it at idle at 1.4ish.

So could this be why my coil is getting hot still and why it will most likely fail again sometime? My understanding of this is that at high RPMs the resistance should be less than .75 because the resistor will coll dropping the resistance. But if I have 1.4 Resistance at idle then at high RPM it will most likely not even drop to .75. So there is too much resistance which is causing the coil to work too hard and get hot, then stop working.


Which could be why the engine was not working good after a couple hours of run time. Maybe the coil just was getting too hot because it was dealing with too much resistance?


The ballast resistors are $12. In the manual it says that the purple/black wire goes straight to the starter sol. So if I disconnect that wire then run another wire form the starter sol to the .75 ballast resistor then to the coil and run it for a while, if it runs good and the coil doesn't get hot or as hot then this must be better than the OEM resistor that is built into the wire?


I went to a marina that sells OMC parts and they could not confirm what the resistance of the OEM coil is. And according to the manual the resistor should be 1 ohm at idle and mine is 1.4. So maybe the resistor wire is junk and I should replace it and the coil with OEM, but if I am correct in my reasoning on this then for $12 I can figure this out right? Id like to figure it out for $12 first then spend the money on a new OEM coil and resis wire.


Does this sound right to you guys?

If this is true and a problem then maybe this is why the others that were having the same problem as me and which a coil fixed the issue (and kept blowing coils) maybe this is the problem?


I dunno maybe Im thinking about it too much. My engine runs great now. But I have a feeling the coil is still too hot.
 

generator12

Senior Chief Petty Officer
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Jul 9, 2010
Messages
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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

High resistance reduces the current flow, resulting in less heat. Therefore, the situation you describe suggests that your coil should run cooler than it would with the nominal resistance.

Coils for this type of engine are made with high temperature insulation between the windings. You're almost certainly okay even though it may feel hot to you.

If it will make you feel more at ease, buy a spare and keep it aboard. Worry about the cause of failure if the present one fails. I'm guessing it won't.
 

LAC_STS

Master Chief Petty Officer
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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

So there is nothing here that would suggest that at high RPMs the coil would either not be getting enough juice or the coil would not be putting out enough spark?
 

Vincentgould

Seaman Apprentice
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Jul 15, 2010
Messages
32
Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

I took my boat out today and it ran perfect after a new coil. Argh! It was still hot and I am still waiting for my resistor. Hopefully that will cool that coil down. New coil is hot hot hot!
 

jerryjerry05

Supreme Mariner
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May 7, 2008
Messages
18,074
Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

Check the voltage to the coil.It should be around 9 volts.Get a coil with a internal resistor.Then go for a ride and see if it's still getting hot. Hot?? Then check all the electrical connections and grounds.J
 

Smacken

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Jul 27, 2010
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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

I had simular problems and was fouling plugs. I'm guessing they were heating up too much and fouling after they cooled. My coil called for a external resistor which I thought I had (coil and wires were getting really hot but running great) as a resistor wire. When I checked the voltage with the key on, it was showing 12+ v where-as the manual states it should be 4-9. Fix was a ballast resistor from a local auto supply store (for a Dodge $8) and I wired it in line to my coil and it now works great.
 

6meter

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May 15, 2010
Messages
525
Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

Just remember that there is different coils. Different for external resistor and internal resistor type, both for point systems and a different one for Thuderbolt IV and V. OMC might even have there own style. Need to have the correct one.
 

Silvertip

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28,771
Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

I'm only curious here but I'm wondering how you "measure resistance at idle". That's not possible since an ohm meter uses its own power source to power the circuit. In other words, you cannot accurately measure resistance in what is a "powered" circuit. Measuring voltage at the coil is a better indication of whether or not the coil circuit is functioning properly. Since one never knows what other stuff might be connected to a circuit essentially creating a parallel circuit, measuring resistance of a component should always be done with one leg disconnected to eliminate any existing other components.
 

LAC_STS

Master Chief Petty Officer
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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

Ok so today I went to the boat. Engine hasn't been started, it's completely cold.

With the batt switch off I unhooked the resistor wire from the coil and hooked the + probe to it and the - to the engine block.

It read 1.12. This is with everything completely cold.

Still not sure im measuring this right. But if i am then wouod this mean that when the engine is on the resistor wire heats uo making more resistance? Maybe too much?

In my manual it says the res wire goes ti the starter sol. Should i disconnect it from the coil and the starter sol and test it that way? By putting one probe in each end of the wire?



Thanks
 

Howard Sterndrive

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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

With the batt switch off I unhooked the resistor wire from the coil and hooked the + probe to it and the - to the engine block.

It read 1.12. This is with everything completely cold.

Still not sure im measuring this right.

no,
book says to disconnect the purple/red resistor wire from the coil and put positive lead there (like you did) and disconnect the purple lead from the back of the alt. and put your neg lead there - should read 2 ohms +/- 0.5 from end to end (purple/red to purple).
If less, it is possible someone shortened the resistance wire. The OMC manual warns to never shorten it.

the spec is 2.0 +/- .5, so before you measure - touch your leads together and make sure your meter reads 0

A weak battery, or cheap meter can read something else...

and touching the leads with your sweaty fingers can have your body in the reading as a parallel path... don't squeeze the lead against your finger as I see so many doing... on a low reading like 2 ohms, it can have a huge effect
 

bruceb58

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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

and touching the leads with your sweaty fingers can have your body in the reading as a parallel path... don't squeeze the lead against your finger as I see so many doing... on a low reading like 2 ohms, it can have a huge effect
Actually has less affect on a measurement of low ohms vs a measurement of high ohms. It would be pretty insignificant in this measurement.
 

roncoop75

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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

the spec is 2.0 +/- .5, so before you measure - touch your leads together and make sure your meter reads 0

And if it doesn't (mine won't, you'll see the meter leads resistance) subtract that from your final resistance measurement.
 

Howard Sterndrive

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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

Actually has less affect on a measurement of low ohms vs a measurement of high ohms. It would be pretty insignificant in this measurement.
thanks, I had that backwards in my head....
 

LAC_STS

Master Chief Petty Officer
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895
Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

no,
book says to disconnect the purple/red resistor wire from the coil and put positive lead there (like you did) and disconnect the purple lead from the back of the alt. and put your neg lead there - should read 2 ohms +/- 0.5 from end to end (purple/red to purple).
If less, it is possible someone shortened the resistance wire. The OMC manual warns to never shorten it.

the spec is 2.0 +/- .5, so before you measure - touch your leads together and make sure your meter reads 0

A weak battery, or cheap meter can read something else...

and touching the leads with your sweaty fingers can have your body in the reading as a parallel path... don't squeeze the lead against your finger as I see so many doing... on a low reading like 2 ohms, it can have a huge effect




Thanks. I confused myself thinking about this so much. I keep getting it confused with the purple/black one that goes to the starter sol.

I'm also dealing with this POS Seloc manual while waiting to get my OEM manual from the lazy and slow ebay seller I bought it from.

Again from the Seloc but my diagram does indeed show a splice before it gets to the alt.
 

Vincentgould

Seaman Apprentice
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Jul 15, 2010
Messages
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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

can this wire be replaced with oem? Where do I get it?
 

nola mike

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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

your resistance won't change measurably under different operating conditions. stop messing with the wire, and check your voltage at the + coil terminal with key on (and everything connected). if you're reading 12v, you have a problem.
 

wire2

Lieutenant Commander
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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

And if it doesn't (mine won't, you'll see the meter leads resistance) subtract that from your final resistance measurement.
The resistance of 4 feet of meter leads is insignificant. If they're 16 ga copper, lead resistance is .0189 Ω.
For comparison, 1,000 feet of #14 copper is 2? Ω


.... and check your voltage at the + coil terminal with key on (and everything connected). if you're reading 12v, you have a problem.

Not really. If it's a points system, and the points are open, you'll read battery voltage at the coil + terminal. It's an open circuit, so there's no current, and no voltage drop across the resistor.
 

nola mike

Vice Admiral
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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

Not really. If it's a points system, and the points are open, you'll read battery voltage at the coil + terminal. It's an open circuit, so there's no current, and no voltage drop across the resistor.

i think there should still be a drop. you don't need current in the circuit to measure voltage (except for what the voltmeter draws).
 

Howard Sterndrive

Rear Admiral
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Re: Does this sound right about a coil and resistance?

your resistance won't change measurably under different operating conditions. stop messing with the wire, and check your voltage at the + coil terminal with key on (and everything connected). if you're reading 12v, you have a problem.

yep, 12 would be a problem.

what about 11V? problem??

10V? will that overheat the coil?

9 maybe?

7.3?

he was on the right track. Someone actually using specs from the OEM manual for a change.
Why confuse things?
OMC gave no spec for correct voltage, so he's measuring the resistance.
 
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