Emergency BC

[jtexas]

Re: Emergency BC

I guess I'm beating a dead horse here - if this topic becomes another abortion debate, I won't complain...but since we're just wrapping up another one I'll leave y'all to it - but I'm still curious. Maybe I didn't compose the question well enough? Maybe I hadn't thought about it enough to realize what my question really is? I'm just makin this up as I go along. <br /><br />One more try: where is all the opposition to this particular "morning after pill" coming from - is it coming from ignorance about how it works? Not "who" is opposing it, but "why". (And other than "because they want to control everybody" or "because they think they are God" or "because they are conservative/liberal/repubs/dems/stupid/foreign/bayliner owners" or whatever.)<br /><br />Meaning, if the word got out to everyone that the regular pill works identically to this one, would a movement to ban the regular pill develop, or would this one gain acceptance?<br /><br />[btw swampnut, "one group wants to control..." sounds a bit whiney. And "...control the lives of everyone" - haven't you been told a million times not to exagerate? ]

 

[Serentiy]

Re: Emergency BC

The only difference here is the way people use them. To be a rational adult and plan way ahead or two people who are living in the moment and OOps we got to get on the pill tonight. It shows who are the responsible ones are. <br />that is why we went to perminate B.c. asap<br />Serenity

 

[dogsdad]

Re: Emergency BC

Originally posted by jtexas:<br />Meaning, if the word got out to everyone that the regular pill works identically to this one, would a movement to ban the regular pill develop, or would this one gain acceptance?

That is a very good question...but I can only speak for myself---and I find thinking about it somewhat uncomfortable. To have an instinctive reaction on an issue and adopt it as a stance is one thing, but to integrate it all into a belief system or philosophy is another.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Emergency BC

Originally posted by Serenity:<br /> The only difference here is the way people use them. To be a rational adult and plan way ahead or two people who are living in the moment and OOps we got to get on the pill tonight. It shows who are the responsible ones are. <br />that is why we went to perminate B.c. asap<br />Serenity

Are you articulating a position against? Based on...what? I mean, is it an ethical objection? Moral? Religious? Legal? Medical? Emotional? Gramatical?

 

[SwampNut]

Re: Emergency BC

The only difference here is the way people use them. To be a rational adult and plan way ahead or two people who are living in the moment and OOps we got to get on the pill tonight. It shows who are the responsible ones are.

Wouldn't we WANT to stop the people who lack the "responsibility" gene from reproducing? And it seems like some see this as allowing people to be irresponsible, when the reality is that they will be no matter what. There's no reason to add another unwanted child to the world, another welfare case.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Emergency BC

And what about in vitro fertilization? They typically fertilize & freeze a whole dish full of eggs - what about those?

 

[18rabbit]

Re: Emergency BC

Originally posted by roscoe:<br /> <br />(This is a quote from the same article you got the rest of the info from)<br />_______________________________________________________________<br /><br />""A woman doesn't become pregnant until 5-7 days after having sex. EBC works after a woman has sex but before she becomes pregnant.<br />

It depends on what your meaning of the word “is” is. What is the author’s (what segment of "medical science")definition of “pregnant” ?!?!? Not buying into the idea of “almost pregnant” for 5-7 after the sporting event.<br /><br />(99999999999999999998)<br /><br />(btw, are we counting up or down???)

 

[jtexas]

Re: Emergency BC

"Medically pregnant" means having a fertilized egg in her womb. (There are "tubal pregnancies" but they are dangerous for the mother and have no chance of going to term.) The egg has a short distance to travel after fertilization before arriving in the womb.<br /><br />Obviously scientists need words with precise definitions - society in general can get by with less precision.<br /><br />Don't worry about "not buying into the idea" - sometimes the whole world rejects science...ask Galileo.

 

[lakelivin]

Re: Emergency BC

Originally posted by jtexas:<br /> Did some quick searches trying to find something that might be neutral science, came across the this (linked above) from<br />James Trussell, PhD<br />Director<br />Office of Population Research<br />Princeton University<br />Princeton NJ 08544<br /><br /><br />

<br />To make an informed choice, women must know that ECPs—like all regular hormonal contraceptives such as the birth control pill, the implant Norplant, and the injectable Depo-Provera,29 and even breastfeeding may prevent pregnancy by delaying or inhibiting ovulation, inhibiting fertilization, or inhibiting implantation of a fertilized egg in the endometrium.<br />

The footnote reference cites <br />"Statement on Contraceptive Methods. Washington DC: American College of Obstetricians and<br />Gynecologists, July 1998."<br /><br />There's no question about it being the same medication - it's exactly the same, but at a much higher dose. There are only two - progestin, and progestin with estrogen.

So if one has the belief that life begins at fertilization and threfore objects to any intervention that might prevent a fertilized egg from implanting in the uterus as immoral, wouldn't the same logic force one to object to breast feeding as immoral?<br /><br />Gets pretty sticky (so to speak).

 

[Serentiy]

Re: Emergency BC

Well I will tell you that B.C. is based on what you believe.If you are with only one partner the B.C will work. If not use a wrapper. we went perminate. because I had my kids and I kept forgetting to take mine. So it was easier to get the perment done. Now no worries. <br />serenity

 

[Kalian]

Re: Emergency BC

You guys are proving one of my earlier points well, that being that some issues canot be resolved through technicalities. You can justify just about anything you want to if you use the right words and analogies. You could justify first degree murder if you start delving into the pscholocical make up of the perpetrator, looking at heriditary factors and gene makeup, as well as cultural and envirionmental influences. Sometimes you just need to see the whole picture for what it really is. Life is complicated, and it's not black and white.<br /> My personal belief is that life begins at conception, and therefore abortion is wrong. I feel that a woman does not have the right to decide if that life continues or ends. I feel abortion is justified in certain situations, but not ones of convienence. There are plenty of good technical arguments both for and against that position. I think I'm pretty much done here, peace.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Emergency BC

This isn't a question about abortion. It's about birth control pills.

 

[dogsdad]

Re: Emergency BC

It seems that abortion arguments sometimes focus on the question of when life begins...and here we see the question of birth control evolving into a question of when abortion begins.<br /><br />Round and round and round...

 

[woodrat]

Re: Emergency BC

DD sez:"I want to promote civility. Promoting strife is wrong."<br /><br />I am really happy to hear that DD, because way back when I was first participating on the DC forum here, just pre-election 04, you were one of the ones who was least civil towards me and my contrary views about the election. I bailed out of here completely around then, because with personal attacks and derision being the standard operating procedure for so many, I felt that I was just wasting my time. I think that generally DC seems a lot more civil all the way around now, from all facets of the political spectrum (notice that I didn't say "both sides"). Obviously everyone will have their momentary lapses in civility, but it does generally seem more respectful, and, I might say, a little more well rounded in the political persuasion department as well. And being able to voice differing opinions without resorting to name calling is a universal good thing, I think.<br /><br />As to abortion, like many decent americans, I want them to be safe, legal and rare. I have been the hand-holding, stressed-out biological donor present at more than one. Once I was 19 and she was 17 and it was absolutely the smartest thing either of us ever did at the time. That child's life would have been a mess, along with both too-young parents who would have broken up even more quickly and angrily than we did anyway. And yes, there were a bunch of whacko angry protesters blocking our way at the clinic, making life so much more pleasant for everyone involved. Just like any self-righteous, full-of-themselves whacko protesters are prone to do...<br /><br />I think for many, the whole beef with birth control OR abortion is not so much a divine reverence for all life, but a vindictive belief that extra-marital sex should come with a heavy cost, or punishment of some kind. So that the little unborn life is actually used to punish the sinners, and of course, by extension, punish the child as well.<br /><br />No doubt many will disagree strongly with that, but I have listened to a lot of anti-abortion rhetoric over the years, and that is definitely a part of it for many.

 

[woodrat]

Re: Emergency BC

Oh, and just for the record, personal responsibility-wise, I did pay for that abortion without a dime of public assistance, by selling my car. Sometimes an abortion IS the responsible thing to do.

 

[dogsdad]

Re: Emergency BC

I won't accept a burden of excessive guilt, and especially since I don't own all of it.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Emergency BC

That's all about "morality". With some "religion" thrown in. And no consideration of "science".<br /><br />But the government...has an interest in its citizens...so the question...is not, when does "life" begin...but...when does "citizenship" begin?<br /><br />How does one become a citizen? <br />Naturalization is one way.<br />What's the other?<br /><br />And for anyone with a Judeo-Christian objection looking for religious grounds to establish the beginning of life, here's a Biblical definition:<br /><br />"For the life of the flesh is in the blood"<br />Leviticus 17:11 KJV<br /><br />A fertilized egg contains no blood.

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Emergency BC

F**K the puritans! Woodrat, WELL SAID!.....JK