Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

MTribe08

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Oct 25, 2008
Messages
680
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

I have also helped people with flat tires & things like that on the road.

I will say that on the road if the family is with me I am a bit hesitant to stop for younger guys by them self. I will always help a female or an elderly person though. Sometimes you just get a bad feeling I guess you could say.

I will say that in this day and age, you have to be careful. Its actually sad that you sometimes have to think twice about stopping to help somebody that appears to be in trouble.

Just a few weeks ago here in Phoenix, an off duty police officer had made a late night run to WalMart to pick up some medicine for is 3yr old son. (He had two kids and one on the way.) On his way back home as he got off the freeway, he noticed what appeard to be a teenage kid lying in the ditch on the side of the road. Possibly dead, hurt, he didn't know. When he stopped his car to get out and render help, another teenage punk jumped out of the bushes and shot him twice in the chest. Killed him. He was 25 I believe.

These punks had a plan that they wanted to go to a party, and were going to hijack a car to get there. They shot the man, took his car and burned it not far away.

I understand why people are reluctant to put themself in a vulnerable situation. Its the sad reality of the current world we live in.
 

Expidia

Commander
Joined
Aug 26, 2006
Messages
2,368
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

So everybody that has an old boat or old motor is a "Yahoo" and shouldn't be out in the water? Remember, just because you have a new rig with a new motor and do all your maintenance doesn't exempt you from having trouble on the water.

In my opinion, it does not matter the age of the boat, it's the level of maintenance. Of course many old boats have new motors too.

They are easy to spot. Just look at the faded gelcoat. It's the ones that people tow from behind the barn and use only several times a year. Thinking, oh well, if I break down there is always some nice person to tow me. Why should I need tow insurance? I see these pieces of crap getting launched at the ramp by yahoo's and I know that boat is not going to be running very long out there and I'll be damned if I'm going be the one to tow them back in.

We are not talking breaking down on the highway here and coasting to the side of the road. We're talking life or death situations when you breakdown on the water like 132 mile Lake Champlain and a storm comes up in a matter of minutes and now the waves are 4 feet. They should not be there in the first place on an old, untrustworthy, ill equipped rig.

I worry more about "my" life and "my" equipment more than I worry about others in those old boats.

Let them carry a $50 handheld VHF. But they won't cause that's beer money for them :D

They are all over the place. Easy to spot at the ramps. Most of the time they can't even get them started and tie up the ramps. Finally it starts and they start cheering as they flip their cig into the water and they are off in a trail of blue smoke!

Me tow them, I think not!

And cell phones are pretty much useless on the water. How do you call to flag down that only boat in sight while you are taking on water. What's his cell number.

In my opinion, all boaters should be licensed after taking a course before getting behind the wheel of a boat. In NY you have to be licensed to drive a jet ski but you can get behind the wheel of a friends go fast boat after a few beers, with trip outboards on it and just take off. Go figure.

All boats should have a radio device too. Although, those handhelds are useless too because their 5 watt output won't even cover 2 miles to flag another boat, unless you have total line of sight. Luckily the coast guard has high powered units with antennas on high hills, so they may be able to hear an SOS call . . . But chances are you would have problems reaching another boat on bigger waters. So I upgraded to the 25 watt and carry the portable as a back up.

First time I actually needed to call someone at 9 pm in total darkness last year, no one could hear me. Bought the 25 watt the next day (these can be bought for $50 too, plus a cheap antenna). Almost threw the handheld into the water. But I saved it to use it as a boat to shore walkie talkie, cause that's all it's worth.
 

scipper77

Commander
Joined
Sep 30, 2008
Messages
2,106
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

Reply to Expedia,

You are a very angry boater, but you also make some good points.

My BIGGEST pet peeve in the world is probably boaters who can't get there boat to start at the launch. They hold up the line and always want to use the launch as a repair shop once a failure occurs. I always start my boat at home with the muffs just to make sure I'm not towing to the launch for nothing. There is absolutely no reason why every boater can't do this (OK I'm sure someone will think of some reason).

Ironically on my last outing of the season my boat started fine at home but wouldn't start at the launch. I was the idiot at the launch.:redface: And yes I did try to fix the problem on the little side dock.

I think that the faded gel coat theory is bunk. mechanical know how and "body work" are two different animals.
 

Hitech

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Sep 22, 2006
Messages
290
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

Well, I don't know why they wouldn't but I certainly would. But, I'm hoping to repay for the two different tows I've had. Once on SF Bay (that was a long tow, at least 30 minutes) and once on a lake. I'm hoping to find someone to help some day.
 

MTribe08

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Oct 25, 2008
Messages
680
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

In my opinion, it does not matter the age of the boat, it's the level of maintenance. Of course many old boats have new motors too.

Oh ok..but this: "I didn't spend all this money on my boat to ruin my day towing some yahoo in because he's got this old boat or an old motor is what you said.
 

electricjohn

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 16, 2006
Messages
229
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

I have towed many people. But some get on your nerves. It gets under my skin when you go to help someone in a poorly maintained boat that should not even be on the water and was a breakdown waiting to happen or those that get upset because you won't tow them to the launch were they launched instead of the closest one. Maybe this is why others are not willing to help. Boating since 1963 and I have never needed a tow (knock on wood), but have done repairs while on the water to get going again. One repair involved using a shoelace and another electrical tape.
 

dingbat

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Nov 20, 2001
Messages
16,313
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

I always start my boat at home with the muffs just to make sure I'm not towing to the launch for nothing. There is absolutely no reason why every boater can't do this (OK I'm sure someone will think of some reason).

I typically leave the house between 3:30 - 4:00 am. I don't think my neighbor would appreciate the exercise. :D
 

scipper77

Commander
Joined
Sep 30, 2008
Messages
2,106
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

I typically leave the house between 3:30 - 4:00 am. I don't think my neighbor would appreciate the exercise. :D

Then start the boat the night before. I do. The thing with mine is if it's been sitting for a week or more it takes a while to start the boat, but if I've started the boat within the last 24 hours it starts right up.
 

MTribe08

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Oct 25, 2008
Messages
680
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

I have towed many people. But some get on your nerves. It gets under my skin when you go to help someone in a poorly maintained boat that should not even be on the water and was a breakdown waiting to happen or those that get upset because you won't tow them to the launch were they launched instead of the closest one. Maybe this is why others are not willing to help.

I can certainly understand that. When you get the feeling you are not appreciated and it happens time and time again, I would probably grow hesitant as well.
 

jwkoehn

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Oct 3, 2006
Messages
104
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

every sport has its share of jerks boating is no different
 

mthieme

Captain
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
3,270
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

Ain't that the truth.
Although I've never required assistance with any of my boats including my 40 y.o. faded algae covered hull, mechanically tip-top 'Ray that has oversized steel plates reinforcing every cleat and eye because she has towed many boats over the years, I have compiled a list of places where to and not to go boating just with the posts I have seen here.
 

reelfishin

Captain
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
3,050
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

I have towed many people. But some get on your nerves. It gets under my skin when you go to help someone in a poorly maintained boat that should not even be on the water and was a breakdown waiting to happen or those that get upset because you won't tow them to the launch were they launched instead of the closest one. Maybe this is why others are not willing to help. Boating since 1963 and I have never needed a tow (knock on wood), but have done repairs while on the water to get going again. One repair involved using a shoelace and another electrical tape.

But at least you were prepared in having electrical tape and some tools.

The type of boater that has always amazed me is the guy that's miles from shore, in a well used boat, in poor shape and has no tools, no ability to fix anything, and knew all along that the motor was failing or had a dead cylinder.
I ran across two guys a few months back, broke down 3 miles out, no tools, no clue, trying to get back in with a 28lb thrust freshwater trolling motor and losing ground. I came along side in my much older aluminum boat, asked what the problem was, and the reply was that the water pump had failed and the motor quit. I asked if it had given any symptoms, they said that it hadn't been pumping for the last few times out but they figured it would be fine.
I asked if he had just gotten the boat and he said he had bought it new in 1977. I asked how old the motor was, he said he had not idea, it was the third motor on that boat, the last one did the same thing.
He had never done any maintenance, didn't believe in it. I offered to tow him back to the dock or at least out of the bay, but they were hesitant, when I told him he'd most likely end up out there all night, possibly in the shipping lane with the outgoing tide, he finally let me drag him back in. I was headed in anyhow, and back at the dock I gave his motor a quick once over and was shocked at the condition of the motor let alone the boat itself. The motor was all but falling off, the wires were rotted so bad that even brushing them knocked off chunks of insulation and wire, the hood was held on with a black bungee cord and the steering cable was rigged in a way that prevented left turns, (the steer tube was missing about an inch of thread, and the cable was clamped in place with a piece of scrap steel and several hose clamps.
This was a boat that they felt was worthy of an overnight fishing trip miles from shore. There was no radio, (there was a radio but no antenna), no cell phones, the only rope was more or less rotted clothes line, and the boat appeared to leak pretty bad as it had 5 bilge pumps running at all times and four deep cycle batteries sitting out in the middle of the floor.

I didn't feel safe just walking on it at the dock, the bow eye was loose, most likely didn't have a backing plate left, and all of the cleats were damaged or so badly corroded that they were bound to break.

I pulled him back using a spare rope I carry, I attached it to the bow eye on his boat, (no choice since it was the only thing that I felt wouldn't immediately snap off), and to both of my rear transom tie down eyes. I pulled him in at about 12 knots, stopping about 500' up stream from the dock and disconnected allowing him to drift into the dock slowly. My boat was a bit lighter and smaller than his, so I didn't want to get on the down side of his drift, and the docks there are well padded.
The first thing I did was to get my boat on the trailer and out of the way, it took me about 5 minutes in all. When I noticed them fighting with the boat on the ramp I parked and walked back to see what the problem was, they had the trailer backed in only to the edge of the water, none of the trailer was wet, the one guy was attempting to hoist the 24' boat up onto the trailer from that point, the bow eye was about level with the rear cross member and the cable had about 3 tons of strain on it and nothing was moving. When I suggested backing the trailer in further, they said this is how they've done it for years, all is fine. After he all but twisted the winch handle off, he finally backed in a few more feet, at this point nearly pushing the boat sideways behind the trailer. Now the trailer was in the water enough to wet the rear set of tires, nothing else, the rear roller assemblies are still a good foot above the water. This time, he's got the bow against the frame itself, off center about a foot and at a 45 degree angle. The boat is listing over and isn't even thinking about coming up on the trailer. Now they then back the trailer in, this time so far the trucks back tires are wet, there's no sign of the trailer and the boat is not drifting around on the way too long cable length, and now is over the side guide bunks. The second guy finally gets the cable in, after falling into the cold water up to his waist now, and gets the boat back behind the trailer, he gets the boat to start climbing the rollers, then which him standing on the trailer, the boat about 2 foot onto the rear rollers, signals the driver to move up, he does, but so far that the stern is now almost for certain on the ramp. He proceeds to fight with the winch and drag the boat onto the trailer. It's sitting well off center but on the trailer. He then goes right to the drain plug and proceeds to let out about 40 gallons of water or more. He climbs in the boat, runs the bilge pump, lets out two live wells and dumps two ice chests full of water and ice on the deck, again letting the bilge pumps run, which are still pumping out a steady stream of water out of several outlets.
I noticed that the bottom of the boat was all patched and was painted white with some ugly yellow streaks here and there. I asked what yellowed the paint like that and he said that the patch was leaking so he coated those spots with Gluvit, on the outside.
I guess since the patches didn't work, the next best thing was to invest in more bilge pumps and some extra batteries, and of course, an electric trolling motor.

It's a real eye opener when you get a close look at some of the boats that others deem seaworthy, that thing was a mess, it had no business on the water, but if I hadn't towed them in, and I later read about two guys that were lost or drowned, I'd feel responsible someway. If they go back out like that, it's not my problem. I made it clear to both of them that certain things I saw just weren't safe but I doubt is made much difference.

I don't think I'd go out with any sort of known leak, let alone with a boat that needs multiple bilge pumps and batteries to just stay afloat.
I also can't picture thinking that an electric transom mount trolling motor hung over the bow rail with a tiny plastic prop would ever get me home in a 20+ foot boat against any current, let alone an outgoing tide.

The bottom line is that anything can break down, even new boats can break down, but being out in a run down, leaky boat without the personal knowledge or even common sense to make sure even the most basic items are in order is just asking for a disaster.

If you take a close look at the majority of older boats at many marinas, you will no doubt see more than half have some sort of reinforced transom, several layers of plywood with carpet and numerous patches. Most people either just don't realize the dangers or don't care.
 

electricjohn

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 16, 2006
Messages
229
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

Where did this take place? In other words, where do you boat?
 

marine4003

Lieutenant Junior Grade
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
1,119
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

RE: Trashed old boats, i noticed most of the story's involving trashy old boats and skippers without a clue, seem to originate up north,looking around down here at launched boats,trailered boats and slip boats i would have to say more than 90% of the boats are clean,well maintained boats with captains who maintain there equipment,seldom do you see clueless captains and the ones who are out there are newly rich who purchased the nicest,fastest boat they could and there errors extend to wake and no manners at the ramp/fuel dock,whats it like further down south?
 

jkust

Rear Admiral
Joined
Aug 2, 2008
Messages
4,942
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

I stopped to help out a 23 foot open bow a few years ago on my folks lake with their 84, sixteen foot bayliner. Everybody went right by them and frankly we thought they were just friendly wavers but I back tracked when I realized they had a problem. It was one of those situations where they had a known problem (think the starter was intermitent) but chose to ignore it and risk depending on the kindness of fellow boaters. In any event, I towed them quite aways back to their cabin with the Bay's little 85 hp engine which suprisingly did fine. Upon putting the boat back on the lift I realized towing that much larger I/O full of 8 people was a bad idea when I saw the new gel cracking by the eye I towed them from. I hate to say it but now I would second guess helping folks out when it damages my equipment. It bugs me when people don't think first. This similar thing happened on my snowmobile last season. Essentially, an ancient, 35 year old snowmobile the guy just got free, totally untested, broken down in the middle of nowwhere towing a cat cutter with a bunch of 3 to 6 year olds. Of course I helped but how stupid is that to endanger the lives of lots of little kids in the sub 0 degree temperatures. Also, towing another snowmobile damages your drive belt. No good deed goes unpunished.
 

jay_merrill

Vice Admiral
Joined
Dec 5, 2007
Messages
5,653
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

Oh ok..but this: "I didn't spend all this money on my boat to ruin my day towing some yahoo in because he's got this old boat or an old motor is what you said.

I agree that people shouldn't get too wrapped up general boat appearance or age. Some of us "don't do pretty boats." My boat is used like a tool. Its ugly and old, but I don't care. I don't wash it every two minutes or stress every time it bumps a dock. What I care about is that it provides a stable, reliable and economical platform for photography, which is mostly what I use my boat for.

I feel the same way about my 37 year old main outboard motor and 40 year old kicker. Both are weathered, but are reliable and economical. Neither is immune to the occasional maintenance problem, but are easy to keep in good condition.

I think it is also worth mentioning that I have towed other boats on a fairly frequent basis. In the majority of cases, those boats have been much newer than my own. Many have had motors on them that were only a few years old at the time of the tow, and some were nearly new. I not only don't believe that older motors are the ones most commonly in need, but often chuckle about the number of times I have towed someone with a $15,000 - $20,000 motor back to the ramp.
 

AguaSki

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jul 4, 2005
Messages
545
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

Just a few weeks ago here in Phoenix, an off duty police officer had made a late night run to WalMart to pick up some medicine for is 3yr old son. (He had two kids and one on the way.) On his way back home as he got off the freeway, he noticed what appeard to be a teenage kid lying in the ditch on the side of the road. Possibly dead, hurt, he didn't know. When he stopped his car to get out and render help, another teenage punk jumped out of the bushes and shot him twice in the chest. Killed him. He was 25 I believe.

These punks had a plan that they wanted to go to a party, and were going to hijack a car to get there. They shot the man, took his car and burned it not far away.


I am familiar with this story. I have a brother that lives in the area (Buckeye, AZ) where this went down, and a cousin that booked these punks into jail. Very sad story, and it does make you stop to think about the danger faced by any Good Samaritan.
 

turborich

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Aug 29, 2008
Messages
132
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

Since I started this post I would like to clear a few things up.

Yes I am a new boater, however I have watched how my friend handles his boat & have seen issues that he has ran into with his boat, weather conditions, etc. I ask a lot of questions as well & listen to the answers. Before I ever took my boat out I made sure that I had the following on board. Life jackets, fire extinguisher, anchor, extra rope, a small tool kit with a socket set, pliers, wrenches, elect tape, cutters, etc. I also have a good flashlight with a set of extra batteries & a spot light. I have made sure to put a good automatic bilge pump in as well as a water alarm. That way if I'm not paying attention & the bilge starts to fill up I will know.

I do not smoke so I don't throw cigarette butts into the water:p, I also don't have a problem starting the boat as it fires right up nor does it leave a trail of blue smoke:p Despite it's age & patches to the hull I have made sure that the engine is as reliable as it could be, it did need some bugs worked out but it's all about trial & error on an old boat. It's what I could afford & I am fixing her up.

On the day where I was refused any help (not just a tow) I later figured out why the boat stalled out & wouldn't start back up. The previous owner had one of the wires from the alternator hooked up to the + on the coil. This was causing the coil to overheat & not produce any spark. I have now figured out where that wire goes & it's fixed. There would have been no way to tell that there was a problem without testing the boat out. It didn't do it on muffs.

I am also VERY safe on the water & constantly keep an eye out for everything. I am a very nervous person so I think this causes me to be extra safe. I don't care if I have the right of way or not, I still slow down until I am sure of the situation as I don't want to misjudge anything.

I know that I still need to get a small trolling motor just in case the engine or drive should fail as well as a VHF radio. This is on the to do list.

Not everyone has the money to buy a new boat & I don't believe in buying on credit. Not all people with old boats are bad boaters. One day I will sell this one & move up a little to a nicer one.:)
 

oops!

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Oct 18, 2007
Messages
12,932
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

ive just re read this entire post......


some of the attitudes here are truly disturbing to me.


i have a lot to say about this but im just going to say.......

if someone is in distress it is the law that you have to help.....
(read td's simple first post)

a broken down boat may not look "in distress" to you.....but let me assure you.....a quick change of the weather, and they will be..........

if you dont help.....shame on you.......
 

marine4003

Lieutenant Junior Grade
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
1,119
Re: Fellow boater wouldn't help tow me in

ive just re read this entire post......


some of the attitudes here are truly disturbing to me.


i have a lot to say about this but im just going to say.......

if someone is in distress it is the law that you have to help.....
(read td's simple first post)

a broken down boat may not look "in distress" to you.....but let me assure you.....a quick change of the weather, and they will be..........

if you dont help.....shame on you.......

Roger That.
 
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